The Vance Crowe Podcast

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In this episode of the Ag Tribes Report, host Vance Crowe dives into the pressing issues facing the agricultural sector today. Joined by John Boelts, President of the Arizona Farm Bureau, they explore the complexities of water management in Arizona, a state where agriculture consumes a significant portion of the water supply. The discussion highlights the challenges of maintaining agricultural water rights amidst new policies and the ongoing water crisis.

Vance and John also tackle the contentious topic of immigration and labor in agriculture, focusing on the California Farm Bureau's stance on illegal migrant farm workers. They discuss the need for a legal workforce and the impact of outdated immigration laws on the agricultural industry.

The episode also covers the explosive growth of the Doge USDA tip line, which seeks public input on waste and fraud within the USDA. Vance shares insights into the potential implications of this initiative and the broader context of USDA spending.

Additionally, Vance provides an update on the Bitcoin land price report, exploring the varying costs of agricultural land in Yuma County and the role of Bitcoin in land transactions. He also delves into the concept of Lightning wallets and their use in Bitcoin transactions.

The episode concludes with Vance's personal insights on the Peter Thiel paradox and a discussion on worthy adversaries, highlighting the importance of diverse perspectives in agriculture.

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(00:21) The Challenge of Succession in Agriculture

(01:18) Introduction to the Ag Tribes Report

(03:05) Arizona's Water Crisis

(10:05) California Farm Bureau and Migrant Workers

(15:30) Doge USDA Tip Line and Public Reaction

(21:00) Bitcoin Land Price Report

(25:10) The Peter Thiel Paradox and Worthy Adversaries

https://serve.podhome.fm/episodepage/the-vance-crowe-podcast_638721156549613591/421

[00:00:00] Unknown:

The Ag Tribes Report is brought to you by Legacy Interviews, a video service that captures people as they really are so the future knows who they really were. Bring the wisdom of Legacy Interviews to your next agricultural   conference with a keynote by Vance Crowe.   Listen on for a preview of one of Vance's most popular offerings,   my grandfather's axe.  

[00:00:22] Unknown:

Someone once told me the greatest threat to our civilization   is our inability to pass down our institutions.   That's exactly what's happening to agriculture.   Farmer led organizations,   even the farms themselves are struggling to keep young people engaged and those that can't end up faltering even going away. So many conversations about succession focus on the legal or accounting side of it, but in my grandfather's acts, I offer principles for starting conversations   that will help your organization or farm survive the test of time. I give audiences tangible ways to discover the motivations of others, to delegate power so new leaders can emerge, and to identify a path to succession even if one isn't obvious. This talk will empower your audience to begin some of the most important conversations of their lives so that what they've built can be passed on and we can preserve the culture of agriculture.  

[00:01:19] Unknown:

Welcome to the AgTribe's report, a breakdown of the top stories affecting the culture of agriculture   with your host, Vance Crow.   The report begins in three,   two,   one. Let's begin.  

[00:01:33] Unknown:

Welcome to the Ag Tribes Report. I'm your host, Vance Crowe. Each week, I bring on a guest cohost that represents one of the many ag tribes that collectively make up US and Canadian agriculture.   And this week, we have John Boltz, a prominent figure in the agricultural community known both as a vegetable farmer and is the current president of the Arizona Farm Bureau.   John joins us from Washington DC where he has been on Capitol Hill.   John, welcome to the Ag Tribes Report.   Vance, thanks for having me. Great to be with you. So what are you doing in DC?  

[00:02:09] Unknown:

Well, you know, there's never a shortage of worker,   work for for those of us in agriculture up here,   on Capitol Hill and within any administration.   Regulation is   is part of life in, in any business, but particularly in agriculture.  

[00:02:27] Unknown:

Yeah. And so, there it has to be an amazing time to be in DC right now. Totally different than any other time because I I think you've been there several times before.  

[00:02:37] Unknown:

Yeah. I have. And, certainly heady times. A lot of the things are, you know, international and   and, very,   confrontational, I think, is probably the best way to describe it. But   sometimes,   showing up at times like that, I think, gives an opportunity for those of us that wanna talk about food   and how it's grown or fiber products and how they're grown and produced.   I think maybe it gives people a little sense of hope, and I think more people can agree on what we're talking to them about. So maybe it is, an opportunity.  

[00:03:11] Unknown:

Well, I, I think that listeners, if they don't know you, we are in for a real treat. I've known John for years and years. He and the Arizona Farm Bureau have been a great friend to me. We've, gotten to go through a lot of experiences even during COVID when we were worried about our supply chains. John came on the podcast and talked all about how   his, his melons and vegetables and everything were being harvested. So we only have thirty minutes, and we've got a lot through to get through this week on the Ag Tribes report. We're gonna be talking about the Arizona water conditions and how it's become a real fight.   The California Farm Bureau's stance on illegal migrant farm workers. We're gonna talk about the Doge USDA tip line and its explosive growth, and we'll also dive into what Brick Rollins,   Brooke Rollins, has, has been up to as the new ag secretary.  

We're We're also gonna cover the Bitcoin land price report. We'll hear John's Peter Thiel paradox and ask about his worthy adversary.   So let's jump right in with the first headline, Arizona's water becoming a real fight. Arizona's agriculture sector continues to account for a significant portion of the state's water use with estimates indicating   it that ag consumes between 72 to 75%   of Arizona's total water supply.   A substantial part is drawn from the Colorado River.   In December of twenty four, Arizona designated a new active management area near Wilcox, making this the first designation since the nineteen eighties.   And, they're trying to curb the excess excessive   groundwater pumping in the Wilcox Reserve.  

And then also on the policy front, governor Hobbs announced the Rural Groundwater Management Act on, the January 31,   a bipartisan initiative to create new agencies for conserving rural groundwater.   So, John, it is super complicated. I have to imagine Arizona is always in a water fight, but what's really going on there right now?  

[00:05:05] Unknown:

Yeah. Vance, when you live in the desert,   you're conscious about how every drop of water is collected, used, and and then cleaned up to reuse. Right? When we were kids, we all learned about the water cycle   and how water really doesn't go away. It,   it's used again and again, and, agriculture is a good example of that. But,   yeah, we're we're heavily engaged,   as Arizona Farm Bureau and the farmers and ranchers in the discussion about water use,   and want to maintain   the access that agriculture enjoys today,   for food and fiber production.  

We always remind folks that,   upwards of 90% of the state of Arizona drains into the Colorado River. So the various rivers, streams, tributaries,   almost all of them flow into the Colorado, and a little bit of other part of the state,   flows into Mexico for the most part. So,   upwards of 90%. And then   what we utilize water wise, whether it be groundwater or surface water out of the Colorado,   it takes, you know, that 70 to 75%   of the  

[00:06:16] Unknown:

the fresh water to grow a % of the food and fiber that everyone depends on every single day. So on the policy front, what is what's changing? Is the fight intensifying, or is this just the news?  

[00:06:29] Unknown:

You know, a, it's the news of the day, but I think it also is important.   When when   headlines   show up that are relative to agriculture   or, in this case,   you know, the essential ingredient,   irrigation water.   It gives us a unique opportunity to step forward, talk about what we do. Sometimes,   food and fiber is so abundant abundantly available   and affordable in The United States   that people forget that we all depend on it, because it's so readily available and affordable, but also,   that the rest of our economy is built on it. Ag is, you know, less than 10% of our economy these days. The food   the food economy   employs less than 10%. There's one or 2% of us producing it and getting it to to market and, you know, maybe another 8% or so that are processing, handling, preparing it, working in the restaurant industry.  

But if we don't do what we do effectively,   then the rest of the economy can't along, can't tick, people can't make their living.   So it's essential to every other industry that that agriculture is able to do what we've been doing in this country very effectively for so long that people are generations removed away from the farm. And that doesn't mean that we have something that we need to lecture people about. It gives us a unique opportunity to talk to them. And so water policy is key to that. There are reasons in our country why food is so abundantly available and affordable, and that centers around   agricultural water rights and having,   an available water source for farmers to produce food. And we don't pay for water in The United States,   at the tap in your house,   on farms, things like that. We pay for water delivery,   and that's unique. The whole world's not like that, and, monetization of water,   frankly scares me, and it should scare everyone.  



[00:08:27] Unknown:

And the the governor's water policy, the one that got in enacted just in, December, how did you did you participate in the production of that? Or I guess in January at the January?  

[00:08:37] Unknown:

So the governor launched,   her bill.   Have been working with the governor's office. She has some great staff. And I think her desire is to lead on this issue.   In Arizona, we have a shared government. We have a Republican legislature   with a Republican majority there, and we have a a Democrat governor. And I look forward to them coming together and Farm Bureau playing a big role   in, you know, negotiating   what will work best for Arizonans, not just for their food and fiber production, but also,   you know, for water availability   for for every use. And there there are concerns. There   everyone will agree that there are challenges with water in Arizona. We live in a desert like we talked about before. So,   it's something that we have to be engaged with. I don't think the governor's proposal   will probably win the day, but I think it's important that they put something forward and that they're that they're   that the ideas that they're putting forward are out there and available to the public for discussion.  

Ultimately, they they,   encourage   the legislature to enact and the governor to sign some very large cuts to agricultural water use,   so much so that it's unlikely to be viable to stay in production agriculture. So   that's kind of a challenge, and, we look forward to finding some common ground where we can and working forward.  

[00:10:03] Unknown:

That is very diplomatic of you, John. Alright. Moving on to headline number two is the California Farm Bureau sticking up for illegal migrant farm workers.   Wall Street Apes, an ex account with over 800,000   followers,   put out a tweet really criticizing the California Farm Bureau saying that they've been working within within California to, quote, protect   illegal workers and their families. The California Farm Bureau says the industry has taken a hit after immigration agents   conducted several operations   in Kern County last week. That's according to Wall Street apes.  

So I actually reached out to the California Farm Bureau. They've, they've been an extraordinary organization   that, lives in a very bizarre world to ask them, you know, do you do have you been supporting illegal farm workers? Do you have anything you wanna say? They sent me back a a press release that said to provide long term solutions,   the Farm Bureau has outlined three key priorities, modernizing the H-2A agricultural visa program to make more flexible and responsive to labor needs,   providing   earned legal status for current agricultural workers, recognizing long standing contributions to The US food production,   and crafting immigration policies that reflect the reality of agriculture   in a diverse state like California   while supporting lawful immigration policies the Farm Bureau cautioned against indiscriminate enforcement of actions that do not account for workforce stability.  

John, you are very close to this issue. You're in Yuma, California or Yuma, Arizona.   The farm bureaus are in a tough spot needing to ensure the harvest can come in, but also recognizing that there is dramatic pushback from the general public.   What do you think about,   farm bureaus and their role in in,   legal and illegal workers in the farm production?  

[00:11:54] Unknown:

I think farm bureaus across the country and American Farm Bureau   certainly,   appreciate,   that we have   a need for a legal workforce in agriculture to provide for Americans'   food and fiber needs day in, day out. Our biggest challenge is that in 1986,   the laws that were crafted   didn't provide very well for that. And   agriculture has been left   to wither on the vine for the last   forty years,   fifty years now. So we're we're sitting here struggling trying to get by,   with the workers that we have, which are inadequate. We're losing market share due to free trade   agreements.  

And so California's in a tough spot as is many other states across our nation.   There's a large number of undocumented folks working in agriculture   and hospitality   and construction and a number of other industries.   And so we face a challenge of   how do we   advocate for needing a legal workforce, but we've been dealt the hand we've been dealt for the last forty plus years. So I can understand California's   position there. Where I farm in Yuma,   we have a legal workforce of about 50,000 people working in production ag.   That's an awesome thing to have, but we are fairly unique in The United States.  

Hardly any place in The United States enjoys that. So this is a huge challenge for   not just American agriculture,   but for American consumers.   Thirty years ago, people   sat down to the Super Bowl like we all did a few weeks ago and watched the Super Bowl and said, wow. This is great and had some guacamole   from avocados grown in California.   We don't do that anymore. 97%   of the avocados consumed in The United States come from Mexico. That's not by accident.   It happens because we don't have enough hands to harvest the crops in the field. We use the h two a program heavily. That's our legal uncapped guest worker program,   but it is extremely flawed. In fact, it was designed in 1986   really not to work very well at all.  

And through   numerous, public policy actions taken by various administrations over the years,   It's become a very challenging program, yet it's the only lifeline agriculture has for a legal,   work program. So we're really challenged   and, and really need,   a rescue, frankly.  

[00:14:30] Unknown:

Yeah. And it just seems like, people are willing to tear things down when when revolutions come about, which I think, you know, there can be some big positives to tearing down bad systems, but, but you also have to make sure that the system that is feeding you and making sure your whole everything works   can stand up. Do you think that we are gonna run into actual harvest problems with the way the immigration is being handled right now?  

[00:14:53] Unknown:

We were running into those in the late nineties being sure to people.   There's a real possibility that if enforcement action happens across   the greater part of The United States, that we'd have even bigger challenges. And some of these folks   immigrated to the country,   overstayed a visa, have been here for a long time. It's a very challenging topic.   But bottom line, Congress has left American agriculture to wither on the vine.   And we we need solutions to it, and we needed them, like,   fifteen to twenty years ago.  

[00:15:27] Unknown:

Well, let's hope they find a good way to, to resolve this. Moving on to headline three, which is related.   Doge USDA   tip line gets a hundred thousand followers in a single week.   Doge USDA put out the following post. Doge is seeking help from the public. Please DM this account with insights on finding and fixing waste, fraud, and abuse   related to the US Department of Agriculture.   This one post, the only post that's been put out there, got retweeted over 4,300 times and has 2,500   replies,   and that does not count the DMs that people probably sent, privately.   Some of the notable replies include senator Thomas Massie. What happened to the assault weapons and the millions of rounds of ammunition they purchased to keep farmers in line?  

Why do they need it? Oilfield Rando said, hey, guys. The Inflation Reduction Act authorized $10,000,000   for racial equity commissions,   and the bin leak said centralized   supply chains, health inspectors, and regulations favor large agribusiness at the expense of small to medium farmers,   support local and regional food systems, improving financing for small farms.   John, what do you think of, the Doge USDA tip line, and, would you have any recommendations for them?   John, can you hear me? I don't see okay.   Well, John did a great thing by for me. He was offering to to do this while he was in DC. So he's in Capitol Hill. He had to find a place where it was gonna be quiet enough. It would be warm enough. So   I, for one, think that this is gonna be an interesting and exciting time. There were a lot of people that had, comments about what they thought should go on, Dosia's list. I think for many of the people in ag, they were watching USAID   and the horrors that were going along with a lot of those expenditures.  

And having been somebody that lived in DC and has seen the the gigantic   building that is the USDA,   it is truly staggering to imagine just how much money is being spent in USDA.   I know a lot of people in ag talk about the fact that, 80% of the farm bill is actually SNAP benefits.   So I think there's gonna be many, many things that get looked at,   and including how are SNAP benefits allocated.   I I know, both Brooke Rollins and,   RFK Jr have spoken about how they wanted to remove a lot of the processed food that's in there.   I think there is a whole bunch of equity and inclusion,   benefits and groups that work throughout. I know several people in different states have told me about this.  

So I think there is a whole lot of cuts coming to USDA. I did receive a phone call from a listener   who said that some of the USDA,   cuts, while he's pretty close to being a libertarian, cut a little close to the bone. There were some,   people that are in the the part of the   USDA that monitors, are you doing the sort of soil conservation work that you need to be doing in order to get your, loans and your crop insurance?   And some of the important people were taken out there. Also, I heard that, Doge sent out,   resignation notices to a whole bunch of people that were doing poultry.  

And, and it turns out that some of them were actually fighting avian flu, so they had to bring some of them back. This becomes very controversial because sometimes people are like, woah. Woah. What's going on? If you guys are cutting all these important people, nuclear scientists, people fighting bird flu, what are we doing? My personal   take is that,   I've seen bureaucracies,   and I've lived in places and worked   in bureaucracies that are incredibly complicated, and I don't think you can take them out one piece at a time. I think you really do have to tear things all the way down to the foundation.   And, from there, you're you're gonna break some things. And, I think it's when those things break, you try and put them back together. The challenge is we're talking about services that impact 330,000,000,   Americans and people all over the world. So there is definitely attention here. I think that USDA   tip line   man, I I really do hope we get to see inside of, of what tips people were putting out there. Alright. Headline number four is really just asking about what have you seen Brooke Rollins doing? The US Secretary Of Agriculture, Brooke Rollins,   has been doing a lot of meet and greets, from everybody, from the governor of Texas to the FFA.  

And, many of her things on on her x timeline seem to be her waving and saying how great ag is. So I was gonna ask John, what do you think? Is, is she, you know, going to start getting in there and implementing any of the USDA things? Is she a placeholder   while they wait for Doge to come through and cut? I don't actually know,   but I, I don't see big pronouncements. When I go out on x to try and look around and find interesting things that she's been up to on news stories   or even the AI. It really just says, you know, these are the people she met with and and how she thanked them for being a part of agriculture. So I needed somebody like John around here to tell me maybe, some insights that he had that, about what she's up to and what's going on with her.   Alright. Well, that's gonna do it for the headlines. I wanna thank, the several listeners. We had Sean Haney ask about the Arizona water conditions, and then we had, a couple of listeners call in to tell me about stuff going on with the USDA.  

This is always greatly appreciated if you have stories you think we should cover   on the Ag Tribes report. You can send them to me on x at Vance Crowe, or you can email them to me, at [email protected].   Alright. We're gonna move on to the Bitcoin land price report. I had a chance to talk with John who lives in Yuma County,   and, he I was like, alright. Well, what's a what's an acre of good cropland cost? And just like everybody I ask, they say, well, there's a wide range. But what John said that was so interesting was the wide range ranges from $15,000   an acre to $60,000   an acre.  

And he said, how can this possibly be? Is it because you can plant things on one field that you can't on another? And he said, yes. Actually,   in his, county, Yuma County, there are microclimates   that make it really,   efficient to be able to grow melons and certain types of vegetables.   And you could go just a few miles away and have a totally different crop that's available to be planted there, maybe something like cotton or,   or, you know, some of the other row crops.   And so he gave me this huge long spread. And so with Bitcoin's price being at 98,400,   which is, about two and a half percent above what it was last week at 96,000.  

That's a big stretch. Right? You can you can get a couple of, acres of land,   if you're on the high side,   and, and on the low side. So with that big widespread,   I don't know what you can say the Bitcoin land price report is this week.   But, since, John's not here, I thought maybe I'd take a little bit of time to explain something we've been talking about on both on this podcast and on my long form interview show, which is I've been encouraging people to get a lightning wallet. And I had a few questions this week about, well, what is a lightning wallet? How does it relate to Bitcoin?   Well, with Bitcoin, you're never gonna see somebody using Bitcoin to buy a cup of coffee. And the reason is is the reason that Bitcoin is so secure is because of that mining. We talked about this last week that about every ten minutes, all of the transactions   that were submitted   get put into a block, and then that block,   gets added to the blockchain.  

Now if you were trying to buy a cup of coffee and it took ten minutes for your,   transaction to be confirmed and,   that's just not efficient. So instead, what people do is they take Bitcoin and they load it into a lightning wallet. Think of it as like an abacus   where we say, I have so much money in here, and then I slide a little bit of that money from me to, let's just say, my friend Jay. And then Jay and I can put that money back and forth in an what's called an off chain transaction, meaning that it is not going into the blockchain.   Then if I decide, hey. I've had enough interactions with Jay or Zach or whoever I'm sending Sats to, I wanna put them back into Bitcoin. Well, then they take those transactions and they say, Vance has this much now. He used to have that much. We're gonna submit that into the blockchain. So that goes into the blockchain and becomes permanent.  

So Lightning in a lot of ways is like a,   you're spending money. It's not as secure as a regular Bitcoin, but you can do things in incredible speed and with ease without needing to use the entire blockchain.   So we have been experimenting and exploring with Lightning. It has been an absolutely fascinating   experience. I have learned a ton. And if you would like me to send you some satoshis so you can start, sharing them back and forth between you and your friends. Maybe you can listen to the podcast on the fountain app and send me some some satoshis, the smallest unit of Bitcoin,   for, putting on the podcast. I would love that. What you can do is go to river.com   and download their app. They have become a, sponsor of the show, a partner of the show. And, when you download their app, there is a lightning wallet on that app, and it actually works great. All you have to do is go to your receive wallet and ask for a lightning invoice, and then you can send that to me. You can either send it to me on x or you can write me an email at vance   at legacy interviews.  

And then when you do that, I will send you now 250   Satoshis. Last week, it was 500, but we are lowering that subsidy by half, and I'm gonna keep doing that until we're all down on Bitcoin. The next 10 people that do that, I'll send you 250   satoshis   for you to play around with and have fun with. Alright. So I wanna thank River for helping me out with this. And now we're gonna move to the Peter Thiel paradox. This is where, normally, I'd be asking John, John, what is one thing that you believe that almost no one you know agrees with you on? And, I don't know what John was gonna say,   and I think many of you have actually heard my, Peter Thiel paradox, but I'll go ahead and use it because I don't have another one, but it's one I feel strongly about. And I'd love to hear some more novel arguments, and that is that I believe that pattern tiling   is changing   the watershed of the Mississippi River. And for many of the benefits that are happening to the individual farmer and even some of the, the erosion control that we're handling, I think this is a large contributor to the huge spikes we see on the Mississippi River and then the subsequent drops. If you are,   somebody that watches that, we continue to see the Mississippi River dropping below,   the ability to have full, barges on that   Mississippi River, and I think it is because we are draining the entire Mississippi watershed so much faster than we ever have before. And this is something that is not being talked about and held up as something that is an actual pretty big downside to pattern tiling. But that's just one man's opinion. I've had a chance to talk with people that, expertly install a tile. They've given me lots of reasons to understand   that, that pattern tiling is valuable. I just think this big downside should be addressed.  

We'll ask whoever is on next week about their Peter Thiel paradox.   And now we're moving to the worthy adversaries. This is where I normally would be asking my guest, who is one person that you respect   but you strongly   disagree with?   And, I'm gonna go out there and say stock cropper. So that is, Zach Smith. He's a longtime friend of mine. We get into these raging epic battles back and forth. Oftentimes, they're ingest,   but he believes that there's a lot more that we should be doing as a collective   and that the government and laws should be doing. And I am a free market capitalist that believes   that if you wanna care for land for generations,   it shouldn't be something that you're doing because you're getting a benefit from the government that they can turn on and off.  

But instead, you should be saying, hey. This land is valuable because I took care of it. I made sure to, you know, put high quality nutrients on it. I did the right thing with cover crops. I did the right thing with erosion.   And that over time,   that if these things are as beneficial as they are claimed to be, then you will see the value of that land going up. And people will say, ah, the more that I do good practices on my land, the more valuable it it becomes for my property.   So, Zach believes, that we need to make sure that the government is, looking in on people and and making sure they're doing what they say they're doing, and that we also give them incentives to be able to get things done that they might not be willing to try on their own.   I, I really enjoy the disagreement. I find a lot out from having this, and Zach is definitely   my worthy adversary. You can follow him at the stock cropper. No. He's at, Zebulos Prime on, on x, and they, I will put him on the list of, worthy adversaries that I have on x. You can check out that entire list   by visiting my,   Twitter feed, and that will give you a chance to see all the many worthy adversaries that have been on, from our guests.  

Alright.   That is going to do it for this week's show. I wanna thank John for jumping on. He, was really taking time away from legislators, a lot of his hard work that he's doing out in Arizona.   He, that guy from, The Warm Place, was sitting in a big coat while it's cold outside. So thank you, John, for doing that.   Yeah. Also, I wanna thank River. They've been a wonderful,   partner to work with and to find ways to, make it as easy as possible for people to   experience and touch the Bitcoin lightning,   system. So if you would like to do that, send me a lightning receive address, and I will send you 250   Satoshis.  

And then finally, legacy interviews. This is the service that, me and my company provide where we sit down with individuals and couples to record their life stories so that future generations have the opportunity to know their family stories.   This has been a wonderful service. We just got done with a family from Canada that had an amazing story, and I don't know that they've ever told it before. Their children and their grandchildren are gonna get to hear about aspects of how they grew up, why they made the decisions they made, and,   and really what makes a wonderful and successful family. It is a wonderful thing to do. And if you would like to capture your loved ones, go to legacy interviews dot com to find out more.  

Alright. I am going to wait to find a host for next week's show. It may be a Canadian that can tell us about, what's going on with the tariffs. It may be somebody doing illegal immigration. Who knows? It has been such a wild ride   that,   yeah, I I'm gonna wait a little bit to figure out who the next host will be. Thank you so much for, tuning in, and as always,   feel   free   to   disagree.