Mere Mortals

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We might be delusional but at least we're not influencer level delusional.

In Episode #443 of 'Meanderings' Juan & I discuss: an update to our live recordings, eating delicious meat at a Brazilian churrasco, Juan's mirth at ridiculous influencers, why Coffeezilla is like Cato the Younger, why Juan was late for work and what I found shocking about Courtney Dauwaulter on Joe Rogan.

Huge thanks to Petar the Slav for supporting the show. We really appreciate your contribution!

Timeline:
(0:00) - Intro
(0:39) - We were delusional to think this would work
(3:41) - Brazil update: memorable moments
(8:05) - Boca aberta & yapping
(16:59) - Baller busters & influencers
(27:39) - Prediction: The gotcha game gets everyone
(32:50) - Boostagram Lounge
(40:09) - Juan's self destructive running
(45:46) - Ultramarathon with one winner
(50:16) - Experimenting with your routine to find the truth
(1:05:21) - Feeling meaningless without the structure of a job
(1:13:56) - V4V: Hiatus & send some feedback

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[00:00:06] Juan Granados:

Welcome back, mere mortalites. It is a meandering session.   It is live.   You've got here the mere mortals Juan in Australia.  

[00:00:15] Kyrin Down:

And Kyrin Michael down on this side.  

[00:00:19] Juan Granados:

Now I've got to address this directly, folks. Kyren Michael down.   I'm not gonna preempt something, but we've received the booster today in response to this about mister Michael Down. And there was a bit of confusion. So if you do wanna know why Kyren calls himself Kyren Michael Down, stick around halfway through. We'll explain it in the boost to ground lounge. But correct. The endurance is a chance for us to have a pretty open wide ranging conversation. In the past at this time slot at at 7 PM Australia, he's the same time, 7:30 PM at the moment. We've been going through more so in musings where we're talking very structured conversation.   Now we are live at 7:30 right now. We are gonna be changing that, so we're trying to kinda address that off the bat. We're gonna be moving towards a weekend time slot, something that works a little bit easier for myself and Karen as we continue to do the podcast from various locations around the world, but also shifting to m e n rings method for the next few months. Why? It is easier on us in the way that we address it. Honestly, it's fun in what we're doing right now. It helps us probably as well catch up on what we're talking about.  

If, for folks who probably don't know,   when before we actually began this podcast, the mere mortals podcast,   the reason we began it was because Kyren was away in another,   long kinda long term   travel over in South America. And it was through audio,   like, big 30 minute audios that we would send back to each other that gave us the impetus to do the podcast later down the track. So   realistically,   this kind of serves once again to what we wanted to do back then, which is kind of catching up meandering fits that way. And that's just to give some people some context to why we're doing what we're doing.  

[00:02:03] Kyrin Down:

Going back going back to our roots.   The the only problem the only problem is that that that was more,   how would we say R rated?   Or what Steven Steven said from a couple of weeks ago, you know, like,   ma 15 Plus.   These are these are these are actually more than the plus. These are more on the PG side of things. But yeah, yeah, you're correct. You know what the funniest thing is, I think we must have both been absolutely delusional that we thought this would work   at this time slot. I mean, especially for me,   just although I do have most of my my notes today are actually around routine and habits.  

So it was it was funny,   actually  

[00:02:47] Juan Granados:

testing out the routine and saying like, oh, man, this is actually really hard. I'm not this is not something is gonna work Now so I mean, bit of context for people. So we thought   that   shifting half an hour later for myself personally   and   way earlier for Karen. So it's 6:30 AM context for Karen.   7:30 PM here in Australia needs attendant time.   And we're actually chatting a little bit for off air off air but live on YouTube around   shit, just how difficult it it like, who's actually worse off for now?   Where we're gonna be moving your time again? We probably don't know exactly the time, but we'll get to it. It's gonna look like probably me being at a 6:30 AM, current being at, like, a 7:30 PM slot. And that works way better. That's just how, you know, we ended up working and it's what it is. So, like, look, you'll see that we'll communicate it in various formats. Work with it. Yeah. We haven't we haven't even discussed it. Yeah.   I think we need to begin   most of these meandering slow, man. I think we need to start off with, like, Brazil updates. This is gonna be like the the consistency,   and I'm gonna target it really specifically. I just want   the 1 or 2 memorable moments of the last week since we chatted.  



[00:03:58] Kyrin Down:

Yeah, sure, sure.   So I've got I've got a couple of notes here, but these aren't the most memorable ones.   The memorable one for me   probably was   doing   an Asado. So true Haskell for those who   want the   the Brazilian for it. A barbecue. The barbecue. Yeah. So it's essentially the the Brazilian version of a barbecue. Everyone has a every country seems to have, like, some sort of grilling of meat   on a on a some sort of stone   or grill or whatever it is. And,   yeah, that version, it's   it's funny how   I can see   where Australian barbecues   go wrong   and why I   I'm not as big a fan of our ones I as I think I'm a fan of of the   Argentinian or Brazilian ones, for example. So   as for context, I went to see a Norte, which is a town,   North   East, or maybe it's like, it's like East, basically of where   where I'm at now in Londrina and in Cianoche,   that's where   Lucas's girlfriend's   mom   and aunt live. And so we went to stay at their house. So his in laws, I guess if, if he was to be married, and   the you know, they kind of work us into the   house. Obviously, they know Lucas, and I hope they know Yara.  

And, and   welcome welcome us in and I was welcome as well. And, yeah,   we just stayed there. And then they had this big family gathering on the Sunday. So it was, you know, like,   cousins,   nephews,   you know, partners of them,   things like that. I mean, it wasn't, there's probably   10   12:12 ish people or something like that. Is that you know, it's not like the largest thing, but it was still still recently sized. And yeah, we just did a Chuhasco and they've have their, you know, specially built.   How would I call it? It's imagine, like, you know, a pizza oven, I guess. But   the the base of it underneath is is kind of like a   a funnel. And so that's where you put all the coal   and you light up the coal and it's it's burning and whatnot. And then you've got like the rackets,   just normal level height to to put meat on. And they've got special equipment like these big pair of like tongs where you you stick on, like, a full chicken or a full   rump of of meat of some sort. And then just,   you know, they   the difference is they cook it   kind of like one at a time type deal or they've got different pieces of meat, so it all comes off individually. So   whereas in Australian barbecue,   I mean, it's not always the same, but   a lot of times you'll cook everything at the same time, everything will be done. And then you move all the meat onto the table. And then that's when everyone eats together.  

This is more   you   one thing is done at one time like one piece of sausage or one piece   of lamb or steak or whatever it is And then you cook it up straight away into, like, little tiny bite sized pieces, and you just give a little bit to everyone.   And   it was just a mess. It was just so tasty, man. So so tasty. But by that that was, I mean, obviously, like the the the aspects of talking and chatting and being part you know, having some drinks being part of like the family atmosphere is great, but goddamn that meat. Oh, the beer was good. What was, was it just purely the produce or was it,  

[00:07:44] Juan Granados:

like additional things? Sauces,   spices?  

[00:07:47] Kyrin Down:

No, no, that no, no, they all they add is like maybe a little bit of   salt but no there's no there's no spices there's no sauces   just from skip one big thing just yep just really   and just cooked fresh, just fresh off the grill. That's that's what made the difference.   Those I'll give a shout out to this guy. And this is a fun little term.   Boca Barreta. What do you think that means? 1, you don't you don't know. Boca  

[00:08:14] Juan Granados:

Barreta.  

[00:08:15] Kyrin Down:

Boca Alberta. You don't need to know Portuguese   to know the Spanish is pretty good as well.  

[00:08:21] Juan Granados:

Yeah.   Mouth something?  

[00:08:24] Kyrin Down:

Oh,   mouth open, which means open mouth. So Boca   Aberita is basically someone who is just like   wow, wow, wow, wow, wow, they're constantly   I think I think you could use it for   perhaps for someone.   I don't know. It's one of those words where it's it's kind of what would be the   it'd probably be shit talker is the equivalent in English. And  

[00:08:48] Juan Granados:

Have you heard have you heard of this particular term going around at the moment in I don't know what generation said or the even younger one? Or they call it, yapping, like when someone yaps too much. And we've we've probably used that term before in the past. I know I've used it before. But it's yapping as in like, y a p   p I n g yapping.   Yeah. And I see so so much of it now.  

[00:09:11] Kyrin Down:

Okay. I can't I can't say I've heard that in particular.   The   Yeah. Okay. I mean, it may it makes sense. It's just an old word, but I'm I'm sure I'm not using it how the   how the kids  

[00:09:23] Juan Granados:

the well, I'll get into another part of story. I want to let you finish. But it was, it will include into something that's been taking my,   I guess, energy in a fun way in a funny way.   I'd like a call out is like Luke Belmar. I don't know if Luke Belmar's a name that you know.   Big on social media, one of those guys that made a like, it seems like he made a bit money on crypto, but post the   most over the top reels for views and call outs.   And everyone on his comments is either support   or   everyone else basically being like, this dude is the king yap at Shader. Hate. This dude yaps this dude yaps like no tomorrow. Like, yap queen, yap king. So that's where I've been saying yap and, like, in a lot of other contexts. So anyways. Okay. So that that's that's a good call out. So barbecue made all the better in a Brazilian way eating it in individual and get good meat.  

[00:10:15] Kyrin Down:

So Boca. Yeah. So Boca Berta,   this was the guy who was helping to cook. So Lucas and and he he were cooking. They were kind of like, you know, the 2 the 2 chefs.   And he he took over mostly. And   he is a shit talker. There's no doubt he is a shit talker, but it's it's in a in a great way. And what I really noticed for me was   when you're at a level of Portuguese, which is   rudimentary,   and by that, I mean, I'm   I'm saying things like,   I I I have   I have,   it's funny, like, when you try and explain just how bad your Portuguese is and you're trying to, like, create shitty English and your brain just does not want you to do it. To create shitty English.   I'd be saying things which are the equivalent   equivalent of like, I wasn't realized.  

You know, I want to say I haven't realized or   or something like that, or I will not realized, you know,   I'd put it in the wrong tense. And I'd use the wrong word, but that's still kind of get it like maybe.  

[00:11:21] Juan Granados:

Yeah. Yep.  

[00:11:23] Kyrin Down:

And   when you're at this stage,   you know, you can ask questions   relatively   simple, simple. I'll be like, you know, oh, it's,   how come I can't see the stars here or I can see the stars here? This is this is interesting. And and usually that'll just give the impetus for someone to talk for a little bit.   But he was great because man, he just talked, you just talked so much. And   he talked even though   he probably realized I'm only getting about   70% of what he's saying. Maybe.   Yeah, 70 percent I think is a good mark.   When that gets into conversation,   and I'm part of a 3,   like a 3 people with 2 other Portuguese speaker that easily drops to like 30%.  



[00:12:10] Juan Granados:

But on that one on one with him, he just kept talking. And so we talked for probably like 2 hours together. And I was I was gonna say if it's nothing for your Portuguese, but it was for like, it was you it was it was 2 hours of talking, but it was him 1 hour and 45 minutes of talking. Yeah, correct. Talking.  

[00:12:26] Kyrin Down:

Definitely. Definitely. But that's that's what you need when you're at my level of, of of learning, understanding and things like that. And   I'm just so appreciative for him for doing that because that, you know, that's the kind of thing that really levels up your Portuguese, you don't you don't feel it at the time, you don't really learn any more new words, but it's just getting to the you start to realize like, oh, he just said, buraco, or that means whole. I don't you you know, you're just piecing together that thing of where you're trying to figure out what exactly they're saying. And   it's kind of like   you've seen those,   example sentences where they take out all of the the vowels, but you can still almost perfectly read it. And and you're just reading through and you're like,   okay, I can read this, I'm missing half of the information or like a third of the information, but I still   understand what's being said. And I'm at that stage where   all of ours are missing   and some of the important letters like a t they're missing   When it's when it's an x or something, I'll be like, oh, yeah. You know, I could kind of understand that word because it's a weird word. But   then there's just some things which is just like, oh, my God, I don't know what this means. I don't know what they're saying.  



[00:13:39] Juan Granados:

And then that's a good way to that's a good way to see it though.  

[00:13:43] Kyrin Down:

Yeah. Yeah. And then and then there's just   people where it's impossible to to understand. There was a guy who had some sort of physical deformity. And Luke Simon met him yesterday, and we're just probably shuffling from some rain. And now he had good hair. And   the   he was just talking with Lucas and I'm just like I tapped out as soon as he started speaking things.  

[00:14:08] Juan Granados:

He   speed or  

[00:14:11] Kyrin Down:

no, just just the just the way he was making noises with his mouth really deep, just really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, really, and it was raining really hard. And there was a busy road next to us. And right as we're leaving, he got really animated and talked about something and his false set of teeth fell out.   And so I was like, okay. Yeah. All of these combined   equal   Kyren not understanding shit.   Kyren not super paying attention. I'd I'd say that was probably the   the biggest thing for me. You know, this cool stuff with Sionnoche is basically   it's called like the city of clothes. And basically, it's it's kind of just specialized for clothes. If you walk down,   I don't know how to describe it because the the city itself is still relatively large, probably about the size of MacKay.  

So if you've ever been to MacKay,   you'll know there's there's not really a city center. There's kind of one main   long street which has most of the like boutique stores or nice restaurants and things like that. So you're not just kind of like that where it's got one long one or maybe like one long one with a couple of crossing streets   and almost all of it is closed. Just close, close, close, close, close   for the days, you know, specialized closed doors for for kids for   chic fashion for, you know, jeans, for socks for whatever. And I was just   so surprised but damn, this is there's just like a random   smallish   town smallish city.  

City is probably a strong word.   A decent size.   Yeah. Decent size town, I guess,   of yeah. I'm just gonna guess, like, a 100,000 people. And they just had a lot of clothes there man. A whole lot a lot of yeah. It's hard. I would not I mean, I wouldn't have even termed  

[00:16:02] Juan Granados:

any specialization in Brazil to be about clothes but again, I would attribute it to like Italy or something like that.  

[00:16:08] Kyrin Down:

Yeah. Yeah. I think it's more just for the manufacture for the distribution,   not necessarily for the manufacturing. Maybe once upon a time, it was manufacturing,   but similar things happen,   Asuncion par Paraguay.   The amount of people who go there just to buy cheap shit   and bring it back into Brazil is is pretty pretty high as well. So in a place is just just monetary, just economics.   I don't know. Thing humans just doing human things. They they end up getting,   yeah, just   a a town full of clothes.  

[00:16:42] Juan Granados:

Yeah. Yeah.   You mentioned,   humans doing human things. I'm going to use that as a transition and the yap   yapping and yappingese to go to this thing that I wanted to share with you because you probably haven't encountered this, and it's been something that I've been really enjoying over the last   week or 2.   So there's a few people so you would know a few of these that I'm about to name. Grant Cardone.   He's one of the other ones that you might know. Do you know a guy called Chris Kron?   So I'll listen up. There's Grant Cardone. There's Chris Kron. There's Diddy p Diddy.   There's a guy called West.  

There's another guy called   the guy who who's a monk.   Phil Shetty.  

[00:17:26] Kyrin Down:

Jay Shetty. You Shetty. Yeah, you read his book, man.  

[00:17:29] Juan Granados:

All of these right.   So   here we go.   So them individually and Wes Watson, dude, Wes Watson, if you haven't come across Wes Watson, man, you'd be in for some good laughs. But basically, I hope you're taking notes people  

[00:17:42] Kyrin Down:

Once once delivering, like, the Now I'm gonna I'm gonna watch list. After this, go to your Instagram and follow all these people. Well, I'm gonna put a caveat in that. A lot of what these people say, there are,  

[00:17:54] Juan Granados:

like, grains of truth in there, like, grains of   recognition that I also agree with. I'm gonna give you an example. Chris Kron, he talks a lot about, hey. I wake up really early or something in the morning. I go do, like, lots of training, and I do my med all sorts of stuff. And I don't disagree with that. I do that. I do that for a large part. I I don't put it out as over the top as he does, but   sometimes I agree with. Sometimes I'm like, you sound like a absolute dickhead. Fine. Cool. You know, you're gonna have those 2 ends. If you're gonna be operating as an influencer social media type, that's what's gonna happen.   But I just took it as like, hey. That exists in its own realm. I'm sure people hate them. Now I stumbled upon a page, and I I don't know if you have heard of this page or if others have called Bola Busters.  

And I don't know I don't know if they operate on Facebook or in other places. I see them on Instagram, maybe on TikTok. I don't know. I don't have TikTok anymore.   But baller busters on Instagram,   this page who as far as I can see go back all the way to 2019   and   essentially just like destroy all of these   financial social media influencers   in   either a calling them out in really funny ways   because of stupid ass statements that they make or all the way down like the coffee seller   mode   of doing investigations,   checking out, like, someone saying, hey. I was I own this and I do that, and they'll, you know, do all their investigation to be like, actually, no.  

They're currently under fraud,   you know, under   blah blah blah being for this particular thing, and they're not owning that, and they're renting. So   but they just man, they go hard at the pain. Like, I don't know how these people haven't been, like, chased down by these others sending them someone like death threats or whatever. But they they go hardcore.   And, like, what struck me, and maybe I'll ask it in terms of Brazil.   One of the things that I noticed about it was   before social media.   So I don't know. Let's say   fuck. Let's take it even older. Like, when we were born, like, around in the nineties area or 95,   if there was someone out there who was an influencer or tried to be an influencer or or you know? Hey. I'm trying to pedal   things I'm trying to sell on to you so you can buy through maybe CDs and and whatever have you.  

If it helped people or if you agreed with it   and you kinda stumbled upon your ecosystem, it was like, okay. Cool. Awesome. I take that for for app. If we listen to something like something stupid I'll give you an example of stupid thing that Chris Grant did. It was a,   in in his mind, he's already a trillionaire because if you do some mathematics in his mind and you multiply it, he's already a trillionaire and he wants to right? Just stupid stupid shit. And so,   and it's like, you know, someone said that back in the nineties.   It's kind of limited, of course, because it's just the reach is much different. Right? You're not hearing these people. They're they're gonna be in somehow shape or form filtered by other existing mediums and the like, but you don't encounter them. Now you hear them all over the place because they've got a bit of a voice. Not a bad thing that everyone's got a voice. But it can be a bad thing. More so for the people who, like, we just laughed about it. Right? We're like, okay, this is dumb. But I could see people out there, dude, who   example, Wes Watson, from what I've been, like, seeing and whatnot. People pay these guys $10 a month, $20 a month.  

And you see example, dudes get get screamed at and don't get, like, anything for it. Right?   I go, man,   maybe it's self explanatory to us, and we do take the learnings away and leave the bad stuff behind.   I don't know if it's self evident for a lot of people.   And I go, man, that's kinda shitty. Like, I don't know if there's anything   that can be done apart from these funny pages that present this shit that you make. You're like, oh, fuck. This dude's an asshole. Like, an asshole, end of the year. Like, who who will listen to it and makes it funny? So it makes it like, oh, yeah. Yeah. I wanna, like, follow this. So, anyways, I've been   down the rabbit hole of losing heaps of hours just kinda, like, watching and laughing at these things where I kind of agree with and then go, whatever.  

Have you encountered so I wanted to ask you, have you encountered any   social media, like an influencer   or   people talking about it in a Brazil way? Like, is this type of mentality   stretch into the the fabric of what you're seeing in Brazil from Lucas or a few other people? Like, did anyone talk about, like, oh, this is famous,   this Brazilian or this group of people   or whatever have you?  

[00:22:29] Kyrin Down:

I'd say not in this not in his circle. And and, you know, I'm I'm still kind of on this on the surface. Right? I haven't integrated into groups. I don't really know that many people outside of I mean, like Lucas and Yara   and and their families are really the only people I've had, like, in-depth conversations with   And,   I've yet to had a chance to, like, create   any more   significant bonds other than that.   No. I   I'm I'm sure they have the the people they follow. I'm sure there's people talking shit.   All I can say is   I scrolled through a couple of their TV channels recently,   what is the predominant   thing that you'll find on   a third of the channels   in going through  

[00:23:18] Juan Granados:

cooking channels.  

[00:23:19] Kyrin Down:

And and there's probably about   2025.   No, it's, it's religious stuff is people like,   right, getting into   almost all guys.   And   they're just just either talk about religion or they're preaching in front of a large group of people with a microphone. Well, I assume so you can't.   The way they're acting as as if they're in front of a big group of people.   And,   you know, that's that's just, I guess, like, maybe one of their versions of of social influence and and media influencing is the they're a lot more stronger on,   I assume, is the Christian   sort of thing. So,   yeah, I wasn't really trying to interpret too, too hard what they were saying. And   I did see when we were in   Avenida Paulista in Sao Paulo, which is like the biggest street I guess in think of the   what's what's the big French one one that,   Champ Champ Delice,   rudder.  

Yeah. People get what I mean. The the big the big one. It's not as big as that,   but   you know that's the equivalent sort of thing. And I did see multiple girls there getting their photos taken, like in the middle of the   the street. So you know, the the framing with like the 2 the 2 lanes going down behind them.   But even Lucas was like, I don't know if I'd call them influences rather than just, you know, like   girls who just want some nice photos of themselves. And some of them were just like groups of girls taking it with themselves, like younger teenage ones. So   yeah. Okay. Yeah. I I think that stuff's   everywhere,   whether it's a good thing or a bad thing personally.  

Yeah, you can go both ways. I tend to not   fall into the side of we need to protect people from other people.   If anything, I would say social media is is good for exactly what you're talking about.   It it lets lets you be able to have at least a glimmer of, like, oh, this other people think this person is full of shit as well. Whereas if you're in, like, a crowded bar   and a guy is there and he's got 2 of his friends who are believing everything that he's talking about,   it can be a bit harder to speak up in some certain cases. And that I know I'd find it harder to be like, man, this dude's full of shit, but I'm not gonna say it to his face.   And I'm no, no, that's a good point. 1 of multiple people thinking that.  



[00:25:52] Juan Granados:

True. Yeah, it's just it's hard to do it in person.   Okay, that's interesting. So I would have said obviously in Brisbane.  

[00:25:58] Kyrin Down:

Yeah.  

[00:25:59] Juan Granados:

No. No. No. You kick out one of I've got a slightly tangent to the thing. Oh, cool. So I was just gonna say, like, at least for me, I see in Brisbane, like where we live and at least from what you're saying in Brazil,   it's not as what I would imagine nowadays   a self evident place like LA or where the a lot of these people are from, like Miami, where honestly it looked like   everyone's either lying or everyone's just, like, posing.   And you see it a lot on social media, and it can it only looks like it just happens all the time. Like, this just must be like this fucking circus show where everyone's just pretending to be different shit,   which makes me go,   you know, the glitz and glamour can be good. Right? I'm not saying it's a it's a bad thing. But, man, it can come with so much other shit, so much other negative shit that you don't necessarily think it happens until you discover it and only over time. Because you might discover this in Brazil over time as well that you, like, kind of scratch yourself. You're like, oh, actually, no. People fucking lie a lot or people just really pose or they don't really who they are. Whereas I don't see that in Brisbane so much maybe because we're a small again, as part of the comparison to the world, it's like a township. Right? It's not not gigantic,   Even though the Olympics are gonna be here in 2032,   it's   it's like it's small enough that people don't have to be fake, although there certainly exists so people. But yeah. Okay. Interesting. What was the attention we're gonna say?  



[00:27:19] Kyrin Down:

Yeah. I would say biz. I'd say it's more a size thing than nothing else. When you just get to large enough size, you can have   people famous for being famous. You can have   specialized,   you know, the people who go around to gyms and show out the new fancy stuff. And, yeah, I I think I think it's more of a a size related thing than nothing else.   The tangential thing was my my my hot take is,   I I think Koffeezilla will have a fall someday,   a fall from grace. Not not necessarily   due to him   as a person.   I'm kind of ambivalent about whether he's, you know, good or bad or anything like that.   I think it's   that when you when you take   so much glee in the kind of downfall of others, you know, like, he's, he's really happy and kind of joking. He's serious at times that don't get me wrong,   the   how how happy he was about and like laughing at the   people who is exposing.  

And   I'm just like, man, whether this is just creating enemies or some kind of like bad karma.   I just get the feeling like one day he's gonna he's gonna have a,   you know, questionable   whatever,   you know,   exposing someone and he or   someone, you know, I could imagine someone setting him up as well, like creating what looks like a big scam and then actually just   just, like, doing it just to kinda capture him. Getting him in a gotcha. And bring him in. Yeah. Yeah. I think if you're in the gotcha game, that that shit comes around. That's probably the the big the big kind of like Well learning I've got.  

[00:29:02] Juan Granados:

Are you super familiar or at least familiar with the story of Kato the younger   and stoicism?   Kind of passing me. The only reason the only reason I mentioned this because I'm reading at the moment,   Ryan Holiday's kind of, book about the stoics.   And I actually really like weirdly, again, I don't know what the hell is going on, but now I'm starting to enjoy more history than anything. But Keita the younger had a   not comparing to the coffee seller, but had a similar view where he was very strict. He was very rigorous. He was very, like, on point and very stoic.   But because of that, there was a lot of things that caused him grief in regulation to around the time of Caesar and the like and basically he ended up.  

Having all these problems where at the face of it, if he'd actually decided, like, actually,   for the,   for the empire, for the the people. It actually would have been better if I wasn't so fucking hard ass on that exact line and being like, actually,   I need to not do that for this particular council,   council or conversation because,   yeah, I can let that go, and it's actually a well, you know, better overall.   I kinda   similarly see that downfall of is that just like a an example of, you know, when you're too strict with something and you don't see kind of the overall, you may find that there's a greater fall.   I I see that for coffee or other people. That's, like, in that regard   where kind of when you're subsumed to be like, okay. Well, everyone must have some some problems and some issues.  

You could, a, kind of keep on finding and discovering that, like, keeps everyone else has some way that you could look at it and be like,   oh, that was dodgy or you could have done better or you should have done that. And I think it's gonna become a game of gotcha. And then somehow he'll be in, you know,   in because even the space, you might get led down the path, not by his own wanting, but just because he's involved in it all. And as you said, you know, someone will try and get him or he'll just   fall without, you know, knowledge of it and get wrapped up into something. And then all of a sudden, everything would just fall by the wayside because they're like, oh, look at this guy.  

[00:31:06] Kyrin Down:

Just the unintentional stuff, you know, say he does a page. I think he does Patreon   or that type of support model. You know, he's got, you know, some people who are perhaps really big patrons and they start to influence and they start saying certain things in in his Patreon group or his discord and or it turns out like, oh my god, he's actually being sponsored.   Like, his top patrons are actually scam artists themselves who are shilling shit. And it's just like, you know, could be totally   out of his control. But the   the the the things that he does like the the   yeah, it's it's more just like   that gotcha stuff just seems to come around in comparison to I don't know, I saw a clip last night of Keanu Reeves and   and Constantine.  

And, like, that dude is is basically, like, untouchable.   You know, everyone loves Keanu for for whatever reason. And it just it seems because he's just like a genuinely nice happy guy who's like also,   you know,   you see him, like, hoverhand in girls and photos and stuff because it's just like  

[00:32:11] Juan Granados:

I don't think it's a I don't think it's a it's like there's always happy guy. I think he's just this very relatable human.  

[00:32:17] Kyrin Down:

Yeah. No. I mean, like,   when I when I say that, I mean,   yeah. Yeah.   The   he doesn't seem like an asshole. That's what I mean. Yep. That that's a good You know, that he just seems like one of us.   Yeah. He's reached, like, the absolute levels of fame, but, you know, if you look at his back stories,   it's a tragic   tragic,   things has happened in his life that seems to have   affected the killer's dog. And  

[00:32:45] Juan Granados:

the the killer's dog man. Just fucking crazy.   Talking about supporting it.  

[00:32:50] Kyrin Down:

Yeah. Yeah. Do the the support the spot.  

[00:32:53] Juan Granados:

Yeah. I wanted to support and then we'll we'll move into a couple of other things. I want to hear the rest of the notes that you have.   And we teased it at the beginning. Mister Michael down, Karen, you're gonna have to explain this to folks as I bring it up here. But we got 2 got 2 Boostragrams,   come through for us   as of late, and the both of them came through from Peter. So thank you very much, Peter, sending them through.   There's one pretty cool on the ground report. Have a great adventure, Karen.   6,666   sets and using fountain.  

And then the second one, who's mister Michael down? So confused. And that's a row of ducks. 2222.   That's it. You said fountain.   So I think you got an answer that one, Karen. What what's mister Michael down?  

[00:33:34] Kyrin Down:

Spanish? Yes. So   I use Michael for various different reasons. Michael's my middle name   and I'm glad my parents,   you know, over the years, I've I've come to question   the utility of Kyren as a as a as a name.   I I I used to kinda like it because it is unique and and it's kinda like like it makes it special.   Yeah. I'm changing, changing gender as well. The   the but over the years, I'm kind of getting to the point where it's like   Kyren is is nice. I but I think Vienna is probably a nicer name. It's it's unusual in the sense like you're not going to meet many girls called Vienna, but you probably meet some. And   basically everyone knows how to say it. Now   they might have trouble if she went   to Austria, for example, or something because   I didn't call it Vienna there. There'd be Veen. I'm pretty sure it'd be   Veen. And that's that's one of the ones where I'd be like overseas might might not be so useful, but at least in her very own country,   no one's going to look at that name and go,   Vienna,   like Vienna or something. No, it's Vienna. Everyone knows that. That's how you say that.  

Whereas Kyron is just a pain in the ass in   other countries and in my own country. And   so that's why I use,   Michael. So I use Michael for Spanish speakers. I've been using Mike,   here for Portuguese   speakers.   And,   if if I go to Germany, I'd probably use my nickname of, Kaiser, which, my mom my mom gave me. So,   yeah, that's I I think that's why you referenced mister Michael Dan, at some point.  

[00:35:19] Juan Granados:

Now I would wanna point out as well, I'll point out as well. You're not even   the only friend in our small friendship group who does this. We have another friend who asked you that does this in Australia as well. Uses a different name, and I only recognize it once again because I saw him not too long ago. And he uses a different name. So this is kinda common in our friendship group. This is not, like, unusual way, you know, you've got myself,   Manshield. You you've met him from the other day. Tyrone. Well well, Manshield  

[00:35:46] Kyrin Down:

mental does that with when he gets coffee. He uses   another name. I can't remember what he uses. But Our friend, yeah, and it's in. He uses Nathan.  

[00:35:55] Juan Granados:

Oh, yeah. Yep. There you go. Yeah. I think so. Yeah. Yeah. So there you go. People changing their names. So there you go. We don't identify anymore with our names. I am now   I I I can only I I'm gonna change my name to identify to a different Just change your name to the You prepare. The number 1. It's just the actual number 1.   Yeah. Yeah. That makes it a lot easier. So but thank you very much, Peter, for supporting through. Once again, that is through boostograms sent through via fountain.   Oscar Marie was on the, what Bitcoin did with Peter McCormack, which was cool to listen. And I know Kyron and Mia both listened to it now, at least the majority of it. I'm almost through. Once again, if if you wanna support the podcast, it's the way we're trying to do it. Value for value,   send through some sort of monetary   piece of Bitcoin or Satoshis with a message attached. You can also stream. Plenty of good podcast players out there let you do that. You can also send through a   direct PayPal. Cash if you'd like with PayPal. We haven't checked, but I'm assuming there's nothing there. With that PayPal, we send it straight through anyways to supporting the rest of the b for b community. So there's that.  

And that's what we sort of ask folks. If you want to support us, that is very much the way that we do ask that support. Yeah. That that's one of those ones.  

[00:37:03] Kyrin Down:

I'm I'm becoming more conscious about the   the ask   portion of it and   the the subtle things that you say which can or cannot affect people.   So, for example,   is someone listening in would would hear that and they'd be like, well, I wanna support you guys via PayPal,   but you just say you're gonna turn and give that money away anyway. Well, I don't want you to do that. I wanted to actually go to you.   And this is one of the ones where it was like, you know, if we were actually getting   the equivalent   amounts coming through PayPal as we did through boost, I'm I'm sure we would stop that. I'm sure it'd be like, okay. No. We'll actually we'll actually keep some of this for ourselves, but it's because it's so small. It's like   we'd say it as a way to perhaps be like an extra incentive or something like that. But this is what yeah. There's,   if you listen to that interview, you it's it's cool kind of seeing someone who who doesn't really get it.  

Peter McCormack   doesn't doesn't   he's very much stuck in the advertiser   mindset and, you know, that that could be the correct way for him.   I think it's kind of shoddy where it's like, if you get a minute 8,000,000 sats, and the thing that is your whole fucking podcast is about.   And you're not   you you only have, like, the passing interest in it. Like, that's that's a little bit like, dude, what what are you actually doing here?   But,   you know, he's,   when I was talking to Danny,   who does he does get it more than than Peter does.   He was just saying like, that dude is just so busy. He's busy all the time.  

Non stop. And so I can understand why  

[00:38:43] Juan Granados:

people like this come visit my house, mate.  

[00:38:47] Kyrin Down:

Yeah, exactly.   I can understand why if someone is super busy and doesn't have time to realize like, oh, it's not just fountain, it's a whole plethora of apps. Oh, it's not,   it's, you know, it's not like this closed and locked thing. Oh, you know, they're not really   the kind of competing with Spotify, but not really, you know, and, you know, Oscar didn't even get the chance from what I can tell so far to talk about. You know, it's not just the Bitcoin thing, it's the chapters, it's the being able to go live. It's, it's all the other interactions so.  

[00:39:19] Juan Granados:

Yeah I think it's I think there was some some some point in that conversation that could have been better explored but again that's   meant to be because. He's talking about.  

[00:39:28] Kyrin Down:

Oscar did well.   He gets it. He gets it.  

[00:39:32] Juan Granados:

I think the the point for all this is when we we call out the support and we're calling out all for that. Look, we are very much aware that it is a the way we ask   for things right now is very   different to probably what most people listen to. That's fine. That's fair. I'm actually gonna talk to you about it just a little bit in the moment in the podcast about another idea that I had because,   genuinely, my mind goes to there's probably ways that we need to monetize the podcast in the medium term,   and this is a very long term play, right, which we're kinda confident with, but it's it's a long term plan. We don't know what the timing of that is.   And before we do that, I'm gonna tell you about how I stitch myself up today, literally this morning. Okay.  



[00:40:13] Kyrin Down:

I'm always happy to And then I wanna and then and then I wanna hear your,  

[00:40:17] Juan Granados:

your other tip the notes that you got as well. So I switched myself up this morning, folks, because I went, you know what? I'm gonna run. I'm gonna go for a run this morning. A long run.   First of all, to park the car near I parked the car near work.   I was slightly late. You know?   I always say that I preach that I wake up at 4:4 AM, 4:10.   I did indeed wake up at 4:10 AM, fell back asleep, then I woke up. Yeah.   So then I got up, put my shoes on, drove, parked the car. It was 6 AM, 6 AM.   Keeping the timing here. I then decided to, for the folks who don't know, I was in Brisbane City. For Karen, I was basically at   the   what was the good page, like, Eagle Street area. It's basically to give you an idea. I just had a call. I'm gonna just run out. I got I got time. 6 AM. Fuck. I got plenty of time. I don't know if to be out to the office until 8. Let's go. Let's just see how far I go. I went around the river, got to Hamilton,   got to Eat Street.  

Now at that point, it was a loving case. I was like, ah, cool. This is good. I'm feeling good. Let's turn around. Let's hop on back.   At 13 no. 14 kilometers, like 13 point something kilometers my right foot dude rammed   hard like one of those where your foot just like squeezes   down and that was it that was it for running there was no more running after that but I stitched myself up because I was   7 kilometers away from the office.   I went, shit.   I've stitched myself up here. So then I had to proceed. I quickly, like, jumped into Woolies, got myself like a a Gatorade, scolded down, and then I, like, semi walked, ran back to the office in, like, the most hobbliest,   slowest way.  

And one part that I took away from it was because I ended up getting back to the car at 8:30.   And I went   Damn. Fuck. I just wasted my time. Like, I actually wasted a lot of time. Now I filled it with listening to podcasts,   but part of it, I   went, shit, man. Sometimes I say that I'm busy and sure, I am busy and it's just all your time with things.   And I went, do I do I need to just go out and try to run really far? Sure. It was fun. It was fun not doing 50 k's all up, but was it like super necessary could have just done 10 k's and going on with my day and be more effective now   nicely today I didn't I got everything that I wanted to do. I did, which is good, but I think it's it helped me recognize that, 1, yes, I can be a bad motherfucker and just go and do what the fuck I want and just run and whatever. Obviously,   my body gave out, not my mind this time, which is good.  

But then the other, which is kinda like this   hidden underneath this the thing that's supporting my ego. It's like promoting it. It's like, but you wasted some time. You could have done these other things. You could have been more effective, you know, between a 15 k and a 10 k. It's no different to to you, 1. Like, fucking who cares? What's the difference? It's probably just as good.   I'm just gonna, you know, paint still on my foot, so that's probably the worst bit off. And let's just sleep it off and try to work out in the morning. By the way, I think it it gave me the learning of,   be wary of the things that even though they might bring you joy and,   might make you feel good,   There's   sometimes some underlying   slices in there that are like, yeah, but   you probably didn't have to go and do it the full, you know, the full 15. Could've done 10. Gone back. Didn't have feet pain. Could've done other things and still felt just as good at the end of the day and maybe be even more net positive than what you felt. So I was a yeah. I just thought about it this morning because I was like, oh, I kinda stitched myself up as I was running this morning. Yeah. We've talked about or I've talked about at least  

[00:43:47] Kyrin Down:

multiple times in the podcast about self destructive   tendencies   to do something where   you you kind of know it's bad for yourself, but you do it anyway. And,   I I always got the feeling like you never really identified with that. Is this one of the things you would say is self destructive   about yourself? Like, was that a self destructive act that you just did?  

[00:44:10] Juan Granados:

No. Because   because it gets I guess more crazy than that I guess in the plan is   in the plan that written down I was supposed to actually do a half marathon   And I think really self destructive would have been like, no.   I'm fucking getting this half marathon distance no matter what. Like, this is gonna happen.   And I kinda made the call. I was like, I think it was 14.7   kilometers. I made the call. I was like,   fucking for what? I was like, man, my feet are sore. It's gonna be it's gonna   become worse for tomorrow. Just that's it. Finish the day. Like, full run it off for 15. It is cool.   I'll it was supposed to be a running day.  

I missed out a part of a workout that had running, and then I just bundled that up in the running. So   in part, yes.   In part, there was some recognition to not even go beyond and be just, you know, pushing it for the sake of the fact that I I put it down on paper.  

[00:45:03] Kyrin Down:

Yeah. Do you have your phone on you?   Yes. How come you just didn't get a Uber or something back?  

[00:45:11] Juan Granados:

Honestly,   didn't think about that. I think I think I didn't think about it because I was like,   no. I'm I'm I've got to make my way back to the, to the car. I think the other reason was because I did have headphones and I wasn't listening to a podcast that was interesting.   So   extending   the listening, although, again, I could have just listened while I was on the Uber.   Honestly, it didn't cross my mind. That's a tweet one. It did not cross my mind at all. Oh, I'm  

[00:45:37] Kyrin Down:

I'm choking this down as one of your self destructive things. That's, that's not healthy behavior.   Is it good for you? Seen any of if you've seen any of those,   the ultra marathon where it's like last man standing. You ever seen any of those videos?   Yeah. For those who don't know, it's essentially,   what are they? Is it a 1 mile or no? It's not. It's it's longer than that. It's ridiculous.  

[00:46:00] Juan Granados:

It could be different lens.  

[00:46:02] Kyrin Down:

Yeah, the one I've seen is   it's a pretty standard one where they've got 60 minutes so it's on the hour.   How far is a mile one?  

[00:46:12] Juan Granados:

1 point 2 kilometers.  

[00:46:14] Kyrin Down:

Yeah, so it's probably   it's probably 5 miles,  

[00:46:18] Juan Granados:

something like that. For I think the one I think of the stuff you're referring to is 4.2 miles.  

[00:46:23] Kyrin Down:

Okay. Yeah. So it's 4.2 miles, which is a decent,  

[00:46:28] Juan Granados:

you know, 37  

[00:46:29] Kyrin Down:

point something 8 point something kilometers every 60 minutes. Yeah. On on the hour. So you do you run your mile like or you run your distance, however long that takes.   And then you you hopefully get a little bit of time to rest. And then you have to do it all again. And basically, it's you just keep doing this until   there's only one person who completes the last,   section. And, you know, you've got these   create all of these people join up and do it, and probably most of them will run   the equivalent of, like, a marathon over the the first. A marathon.   Yeah, probably the most of it would be they end up doing yeah, they do end up doing like 100 miles. No, I'm saying like the bulk of the people will probably go and. Oh, gotcha.  

And then you'll have this select group of   6 to 12 people who   go, you know, 24 hours,   26 hours, 28 hours, 30 hours, and they just keep going. And   the   I remember listening to Courtney DeValta on Joe Rogan, and she was the only one.   Joe was so surprised and she's like this ultra marathoner.   She doesn't do that race from what I can tell, but she just runs   like ridiculous distances.   And he was just so surprised with her because he was like, you've got like no demon in you. What? Why why are you doing these things? Because and I think it was   I found it shocking that he found it shocking that   she had none of this in him because, you know, he's talked with a whole bunch of people who do the, like, the craziest shit.  

And   he was surprised that   she didn't have any of this kind of, like, what I call self destructive   tendencies in her. There was no, like, I'm punishing myself   by doing this. The, you know, I think the classic example of this is David Goggins. Like that dude is just   all punishment,   basically no pleasure, or he takes pleasure in the punishment, which is like this kind of   sadomasochistic   kind of feedback loop that he's got going on.   But, yeah, that that's one of those ones where I'm like,   yeah, like, if you're doing those those real big distances, sometimes you just like punishing yourself and it's   healthy   with   the you know, it's   a healthier version of you know, going down the route for example.  



[00:48:49] Juan Granados:

True. I was gonna I was gonna say, and I'll I'll, there's a gigantic caveat.   15 kilometers.   Great. Great. Isn't long distance when you're talking? You know, these people that do just ridiculous distances   and for sure. To to some people, even just an average runner, that might just be standard distance. Right? But, again, I don't consider myself a runner at all, so that was hitting top end. I guess it's also I just don't know what I can and can't do largely in a space like running in a similar way that if someone came to me and you've barely lifted and whatnot, and you'd be like, oh, yeah. I could probably   I think I've benched once before, like a 100, so I could do, like, 90 for 12. Yeah. I'll be like, shut up. Shut up. Second, you have no idea. I have no idea. Know. A 100. You know, if you're like you know, if it's like a workout where it's, you know, it's got,   dips and bench pressing and muscle ups, something like that. I could do it in, like, this time. You dive. Shut up. You can't. You don't know what's gonna happen to your body and the energy whatever. Just shut up. You don't understand it.  

But I think sometimes you have to go through it to kind of really know because even if I told someone around that or someone if someone told me, like,   if you're gonna do this, whatever, I'll be like, no. No. That should be all good. I'll drink my water. I'll do this. It'll be all fine.  

[00:50:02] Kyrin Down:

Good transition, man. Because and I'm not looking too deeply into yours. It's only if you tell me that you've done the same thing or an equivalent   next week and then the week after where I'll be like, Juan, what are you doing?   Next week, the 21.   The this gets so nicely into my topic, the main one that I wanted to talk about, which was routine, and how much of your routine is actually set in stone. So   the   this last 2 weeks, it's been about 2 weeks since I've been well, let's say 3 weeks, because the week before I left was just chaos as well.   My routine has just been all out of whack.  

And I'm waking up at 6 am   God, when I heard when I heard that ringer today, I was just like, God   damn. And   I got a question for you, I guess, which was to kick this off, which is   how much your   routine is set in stone as in   you it's it's at the point where it's now   oh, there's a religious word for it. It's like dogmatic. You're dogmatic in that I don't do this. You know, I don't go to bed after   10 pm, perhaps is one for you or for me, it would be like, you know, I don't wake up at x certain time.   How much of your routine would you say is like that? And   what what are the reasons for this?  



[00:51:27] Juan Granados:

That's a good one. I'd say that between   3 hours after waking   up and 2 hours to 3 hour I said 3 hours after waking up 3 hours before sleep. It's pretty routine. It's pretty standard.   It doesn't fluctuate that much. The only time it fluctuates   is   our conversations   or if there's an invite to something. But usually in the mornings,   there's   my alarms, my alarm hasn't changed. Like, yes, I've sometimes do you sleep past it, sometimes I wake up earlier, but it hasn't changed from 4:15.   This is what it is. And when I get up, there's a very usual routine of,   getting and getting the drink for the day, going to the bathroom, getting changed, going to the gym before a run, doing that, either coming home or going into the office.  

And then when that,   usually, like, more often than not, it's going to the cafe in the morning and looking after my daughter while my partner trains.   That is very   usual, very routine.   After that, that's when it kind of fluctuates. When it's through the day,   I can't control a lot of things of, like, the meetings that I do or the emails or the reacting to things   that fluctuates, and it's the reason why I don't put things like training,   reading,   whatever, in the middle of the day, because it just it won't happen. It just will not happen with everything that's going on. Then towards the end of the day, it's once again pretty routine from about the point of   nowadays, we're trying to have dinner around 5:30   just from, for everyone who's got kids. You totally understand this. You have to have some sort of routine for the bedtime or where you're fucked. Right? You'll just be fucked, in terms of them waking up or waking you up or whatever else. So there's pretty set cadence of, you know, bath time, getting them ready,   reading   time, play time,   relax time, they go to sleep,   then you go and do whatever else was before. But again, as you mentioned,   yeah, I don't have it super focused, you know, like, I'm not gonna go to sleep after 10 PM.  

But it just so happens it's, like, pretty routinely that, yeah, I'll either read or chat with my partner, and then we'll go to bed  

[00:53:36] Kyrin Down:

usually around the same time. So Yep. You mentioned Yeah. It's pretty it's pretty locked in. You mentioned 4 15 there. And this is one of the ones I wanted to like dial in on. So if that were to change to 8 am,   you know, unforeseen   life expect,   circumstances,   whatever,   you now have to wake up at 8 AM, what would be the reasons   that you would want it to go back to 4:15?  

[00:54:05] Juan Granados:

So, like, why 4:15? I guess some yeah, I guess the main reason would be why 415   because it gives me enough time to do   some of the things I wanna do in the morning before the rest of the day kinda takes away   that opportunity for me to do them.   Yeah. So if it did change to 8 AM, it would mean   trying to carve out time somewhere else through the day, which   for as it stands right now is way more difficult than if I was to do it in the morning.  

[00:54:34] Kyrin Down:

Yeah. So this one of those ones where I go,   there's a chance that that could be the the reason, but I wouldn't be surprised if the the real reason actually wasn't something different. And you've just kind of forgotten about it or never realized it about yourself. And the reason I say this is because   because my routine has just been so out of whack. I've had to do a whole lot of things differently than I use than I normally do.   You know, for this one, I've been waking up earlier and going to bed earlier.   For the travel stuff, I've been,   you know, having to   travel at certain times where I don't normally want to, you know, sleeping in different   circumstances and ways and like trying to do it on a bus and on on a plane.  

Speaking and learning Portuguese at times where I'd normally not want to because it's like a it's a social setting and then things like this.   Not doing,   the like   deeper work that I usually like to do in the mornings and then having to do that at another time or if I get a chance at all.   And   the   the couple of things I've realized about myself were,   I guess, just the reasons that I do certain things were   the kind of close, but they're not exactly what I thought it was. So   what if you had to guess were were my reason for not doing 2 workouts a day?   And what is the real reason for me not doing 2 workouts a day?  



[00:56:04] Juan Granados:

Well, I was gonna say the real reason is that you don't hit there's not enough time now to do that large amount of working out. All you too sore.  

[00:56:15] Kyrin Down:

Even before that, even before that. So like, even if I had like my real good routine,   locked in routine from a couple of months ago,   what what would   what would have my What would you assume?  

[00:56:26] Juan Granados:

Maybe just the soreness of the wrists or the body or something like that.  

[00:56:31] Kyrin Down:

Yeah. So so it's not that. And, I that was kind   of my reasoning for for never really doing like a hard,   harder workout in the in the mornings.   So I used to have a kind of routine where I'd I'd stretch and I'd I'd stretch for a couple hours in the in the morning, and then I would do a full on session later in the afternoon.   And I used to think it was   I don't do, you know, handstands in the morning and then handstands in the afternoon or like handstands and then a strength workout   was because,   my when I wake up in the morning, I just feel bad. You know, I'd like right now, for example, my eyes feel so heavy.   I still got   about the same amount of sleep.  

But I can just feel like everything about me is just like, oh, this is just is just not fun. My I don't want to be   up and moving at this time. And I assumed it was the same thing for like working out. I just don't work out in the mornings because,   like, I don't I don't feel good, all that sort of thing.   And   trying to remember back to when I used to play soccer, and I'm pretty sure I always enjoyed afternoon and evening games more.   But it's not like   I was benched   Because we had a morning game and Kyren shit in the mornings. You know, it's whatever   decrease in performance there is, it's it can't be much. And   the the reason I found this out was because I've had to do a couple of morning ish workouts with Lucas because we're traveling in the afternoon.  

And I realized   I oh I can't do this it's and and it's not actually that bad of a session like it it just takes a little bit longer to get into it but yeah okay no I'm it's   like   10 to maybe 9 and a half or 9.2,   It's it's like 10 to maybe 9 and a half or 9.2 or something like that.   And I discovered the the real reason I don't do 2 is   I just don't want to shower twice. I don't want to   go out twice. I don't want to have to do twice the amount of   washing for my clothes.   And that is the predominant reason.   It's it's not it's not the workout itself. It's all the other shit around it, which puts the auxiliary things that come around it, which just take up so much time,   and that people don't realize take up time.  

Another example for this.   The and this is one I   I knew,   and I've said for ages,   I don't do one meal a day because I think it gives health benefits for any sort of reason.   If anything,   there's probably science out there that would   indicate that for what I want to do for,   you know, for the things that I care about getting one arm handstand being able to, you know, do something which is   pretty damn hard and requires   a lot of like training strength and all that sort of stuff is probably not optimal.   There's probably   a better way to fuel my body to be able to do that. But   I don't eat more than once a day is because of all the auxiliary shit. I don't want to cook twice. I don't wanna have to clean twice. I don't wanna have to   think about what where am I going to go to get breakfast? Oh, no. This sort of thing.  

And this is one thing I I I have known and I'm very certain about like, this is the reason why I don't eat more than once a day.   And also because it,   it makes me feel a bit sluggish with the, with the training. But once again, I did train   because   one of my yearly goals, if you go back to that, was   when I traveled to not be too strict to myself, not to be too disciplined.   And I've,   I've even got into my weekly, like, little checkup thing, which is   do not behave anti socially   just because it doesn't fit into your plan. So   just because,   you know, Lucas's family, one, Yada's family wanted to have, you know,   a lunch,   where everyone sits down and gets together.  

Don't be antisocial about that, Kyren. And I haven't been I've been actually really good about   eating some foods and let you know, like participating in the   the joint experience of of appreciating a lunch and things like that.   And,   yeah, that was that was just one where I was like, that okay.   The reason I don't do 2 records today, that's that's just just why   it's it's it's not what I thought it was. It's something completely different.   And   yeah,   it's just been interesting   having my routine so broken up and seeing   there's there's minor variations of this in terms of   how much Portuguese I can handle a day I and even social interactions.  

Before this, I would have said,   I need   I need to have, you know, 2 or 3 hours on my own doing nothing,   or not doing nothing but 2 or 3 hours on my own.   I've spent like 3 days with Lucas   and his family and friends and girlfriends.   Basically constantly   interacting is, you know, physically within reach of someone   of by 5 meters for the whole day.   And   I've done okay. You know, it hasn't been the end of the world.   Yes. After the 3 days, I realized I, oh, fuck. I'm I'm a little bit tired. I need a little bit of space to myself.   But, you know, I I was able to get through 3 days pretty fine.  

So, yeah,   just these routines, I think it's worth looking at. And and as you were saying with the the running,   experimenting,   because   the reasons that you'll find for why you don't do certain things, I think can kind of surprise yourself as well.  

[01:02:23] Juan Granados:

Yeah. I think   summed up in in some ways for that, right, is   you will always regress to the mean,   and you want your mean to be a good mean.   You want what your   default   standard cookie cutter,   What you wish you could do day in day out   mean is a good need. You know, for me,   that looks like as I kind of just stated before,   early mornings,   relatively early sleeps,   good structured time with my family,   good structured time of being able to make money through the day,   learning pockets through here and there,   and   fitness and more learning wherever I can. Now   that has I will naturally tend regress to the mean   if given the opportunity.  

Right? From   elsewhere, like, if I was traveling and, yeah, you're gonna have these things where the routine kinda kicks you around, but eventually, you wanna kinda return to the mean.   You also do want that, I guess, that flexibility,   as you   say, of being,   I don't know if anti fragility is right alongside of it, but just being flexible, You know? Being okay with and this is something I found out   many years ago around,   food intake in that I was very inflexible in the way that I was eating   way back when when I used to do more bodybuilding, start lifting. Why?   Because I was in this routine of, well, now I've gotta eat, like, every 3 hours, and I'm very,   prone to, you know, getting, like, sugar crashes because I'm not having enough carbohydrates because I'm eating this much,   and kinda recognizing that's pretty inflexible. Like, if I go in and have to not eat breakfast or lunch for whatever reason, you just gotta push I was like, man, this I can't do it. I have no energy.  

Very different now. You know? And so you gotta find the places where it's like,   yes. Is it optimal for,   you know, a very specific thing? Are you one of my true attributes? No. It isn't.   But so what? It's better to regress to the mean because for the overall, it's a it's a better benefit   than trying to optimize. You say, like, you know, if you're trying to optimize or you're stretching in your   handstand goals, well, sure, you could be doing that in Brazil and nothing would be stopping you, but, man, you would be missing out on all this other stuff that's kind of the point of why you're over there at the same time. As you say, to be not not not be antisocial, but to connect, to   explore your Portuguese, to explore Brazil, to be with friends. It's like, again, all the way back to the coffee zillow thing. Right?  

Or,   k. Like, you can you can be so strict and so disciplined in a particular thing. And it's not a bad thing,   but it's all the other things that you also end up losing because of it. As long as you recognize   what your mean looks like and making it a good mean,   just know you're gonna regress towards it and then fluctuate it as you need to. Like, you know, you'd be pretty comfortable, I guess, in the fact that,   yeah, it's a bit of a moving piece at the moment for you. Yeah. You you do end up prioritizing the things like handstand work and a few other things, but you'll always know when you get back to Australia or you find a place where you can regress to the mean, you will. You'll get back to that, and that's because that's your standard now. That's just the way that you wanna operate, and that's not a bad thing.  

[01:05:22] Kyrin Down:

The other thing I realized   about   routine is   I always,   when I hear people   talking about   people need to have jobs,   they need to have something in their life where it's like, what would you do if you're jobless? It's like this unknown void of scariness.   And   I always used to think like, I have you people never fucking just not like, what do you do on weekends if you don't have a   if you if you if you just if jobs are so critical for you for your life, why how how are you this kind of like scared about the the void or or what you'll do with your day and having   like a loss of meaning. And I'm like, if you got meaning through your fucking job, which you hate, like, dude, you got you got to fix your priorities,   or saying that other people need this.  

This is one of the times where I'm like,   I won't I won't   concede my point. I think my points still way stronger, but I'll concede   by   7%   where I'm like, okay.   Having a loss of routine   has made me   realize,   you know, the other day, for example, was was the first day I kind of know, we had this super big busy schedule.   Any spare time I had was trying to fix up our old audio,   do a little bit of prep and things like this for the for the last one. So essentially, like, it's been   week of crazy prep getting ready to come to Brazil.   1st 3 or 4 days with, like, Lucas and and family, like, didn't even open my laptop, finally get established in this little room here and, you know, spend time unpacking, getting stuff together,   working   and doing crap on my computer, just, you know, stuff that needs to get done, then traveling again. And then yesterday was the first time where I really just had   a block of space where I was like, you can do whatever you want here. And because my routine had been so broken.  

Like I, I almost didn't know what to do. It was like, well,   do I do I study now?   Do I do some of my   do I do some stretching?   Should I do some reading? Should I go out? Should I practice my Portuguese?   Should I do a bit more like podcast prep?   All of these sort of things were running through my head. I ended up just like fucking it around, to be honest. Like, I wasted a whole bunch of hours just on nothing.   And   this was a time where I went, okay, I can kind of see, like,   if you don't have   one some passions that you're working on and that require a lot of time   and 2 a routine to kind of like fit them in or   a schedule perhaps is a better word for it, then I can kind of go okay, I can see why you would be scared about not having   that being   told for you in a job type situation of this is what you do at this time. Say that I think say it in another way.  



[01:08:22] Juan Granados:

It is   the lack of structure that scares people because it is implied structure through a work domain. Same thing with university. Right? When people leave school   and, sure, some people will push people to go into university from parents or what it might be, like, the best thing or you have friends that go to it. But in large part, some people go to university because it's once again,   come out of school, and they're here's this next structure. It's the next step. It's the next thing to do. And it's nicely   squared up and diced up and you do this and you get this and this is what you do. And people thought that same thing in the workplace. It's you're getting structure.  

And people work better that way. You know, I've let a lot of teams. I let a lot of people. When people work well, it's because you give them a lot of precision and a lot of structure and like, hey. You're gonna have this, and then we're gonna have the session, and then you're gonna get this detail here, then you're gonna get it there. And then people go and do the work, and then they come back and cool. It's like ticking the boxes of what I'm seeing.   The problem I think for most people is that in general,   most folks don't know how to create their own internal structure,   you know, without the university, without the work. Because as you say, then the general human tendency might be just to fuck around to   do things which are hedonistic as opposed to maybe strategically   viewed   or just don't have   the thoughts behind how do I goal set what's important to me. Right? You just become hedonic. You become just fucking monkey mode and, cool. I'll just fucking masturbate for an hour, and then I'll just watch videos for 3 hours, and then I'll listen to music for another hour, and then I'll go for a run. And   okay. You you spend some time, but, you know, in your world and I think you   it's weird because for you, maybe that's not weird. You know? You worked well in the structure of school, in the structure of university,   and work was shit for you because you had a shit like workplace,   but then you weren't able to build up a really easy structure to how you wanna live your life. Maybe it was because you knew how to   play in a structure or you knew very easily how to create that. A lot of other people may not be. I think it it's like a question of structure. It's still we remove for a lot of people 8 hours, 9 hours of structure.  

They kinda go   like,   fuck what I fill it with? Because it's they they just haven't conceptualized  

[01:10:36] Kyrin Down:

what how you would fill this gap of life to structure it for another way. Yeah. The army is a similar thing as well where it's, you know, the just another variation that just to clarify,   my my work actually wasn't too bad.   The it wasn't a shit workplace by any means of the imagination.   I think it was just Fuck you, Rio. I'd reached the stage where   I   realized, like, this this wasn't,   you know, if if I'm going to be doing, and this is probably the other aspect to it, which is, well, if I if I get to choose my own   kind of destiny or what I work on, if   it feels kind of like   why arbitrary   and meaningless, like, why am I doing this instead of,   you know, if you've got a job, there is some sort of like underlying meaning   to it, I guess, which,   or people attach that to it. You know, I'm doing this job because I'm supporting a family   and   etcetera, etcetera, etcetera.  

Whereas for me, I'm I'm kinda like, you know, I know the one arm handstands an arbitrary goal, man. Like, it's not gonna do anything.   Is it gonna, you know, like,   cause there to be like celebrations? Will it etch my name in stone?   Will there be legacy? Will it even bring me happiness? Like, not really, like, it's just it's, you know, the day I get it, it's kind of like,   I'll just be dissatisfied   because I want to do it longer   or do another trick or whatever.   But but you know, I'm okay with the kind of like,   choosing to do the things which is somewhat arbitrary and therefore, I guess, meaningless,   or attaching my own meaning to things is perhaps the other way of putting it.  

Whereas if you're if you're not willing or not able to do that, that's that's when the the work kind of   makes sense to you. It's like, oh,   or the lack of work is scary and the void.   As you were speaking, I was just like, damn, how would one manage me? Like, what would that look like?   What do you what do you what do you give me some structure? Or do you what do you like? Let the lanes reins loose. And he's just like, Karen, just get this shit done by this time. Don't don't screw this up.  

[01:12:53] Juan Granados:

It'd probably be the latter. It'd probably you know, you could always tell the people the the type of people how they work and stuff like that and probably be something like the latter. But I've, you know, I've also had it in the other way where it's very much the form of you gotta be like, hey. You need to do this by 10. And by 3, you're gonna do this, and then you got this section. You're all good with that. That also happens as well. Right? It's such a thing.  

[01:13:15] Kyrin Down:

Have you got it? Do you have another noise as well? Did you check that? I did. But this is getting too long, man. And I'm conscious like you're already you're staying up too late.   So   yeah,   yeah, yeah. For me, this would be like dinner time.   The   so a couple of things. I'll just save my my other Brazil notes for for the next time. And, as you mentioned,   maybe it was before the podcast started. I I did my kind of like first Instagram story, I guess the other day, and I was talking about some classic authentic Hawaiian. Yeah, tell me.   But I'll save that for next week. So if you're if you tuned in for that,   I'll talk more about Brazilian food next week. The other thing was the V for V show. And   this is one of the ones where I was like, you're asking,   what was the deal with that? Are you,   gonna bring that back or anything? I think I've decided   I'm just going to take a put it on hiatus for the moment.  

The 6 hours it would take to create that   per week,   which is, you know, 6 to 7 hours. So let's just say 1 hour a day.   I just would rather be using that hour to do Portuguese things,   and Brazilian things. So,   yeah, the the drive to do it has certainly declined. And, you know, I'm already, like, 2 weeks overdue for an episode. So,   I'm just gonna do I like a little mini So just saying like, hey, I'm just taking a break from this for a bit   and check back in like 3 or 4 months time, and that's when I'll kick it back off again. So,   yeah, routines change and   yeah,   same with our routine for the timing and things like this. It was probably foreseeable. It was   it was probably   notable to go, like, these guys are actually gonna be able to stick with us.  

We'll see. We'll see.  

[01:15:06] Juan Granados:

So Things change sort of thing. Things things fluctuate.   One of the other things, I didn't talk into it, but I   in part starting to look at, okay. Well, what are other forms of us being able to produce an income like a sizable income? Yeah. Let's leave that for next week. Now. At least in the short term or medium term. I think we could talk about that in next week. But, again, it's those things that are floating around in my mind that go, again, things can change. Things can fluctuate. You can still at the core level, our principles remain the same, but what are the things we can do?   But look. We are we are gonna leave it there, me and more lines. I hope you have enjoyed listening into the podcast. We talked about it already. But we are a value for value enabled show. So you can turn through time, talent or treasure time, obviously, listening into the podcast, sharing with folks, talent,   you know, as we're talking about what are the other ways that we can provide support to people. You can let us know what that is through any commentary or emails, whichever way you wanna reach us. If you think there's particular things that Karan should be seeing while he he's in Brazil,   any notes or memorable things that you think that we should be looking into around structure,   All of those various things are always gonna be good. And treasure, which is in the format of boostograms   sending through satoshis in a streaming way through all the good podcasting players out there. We can utilize our sort of PayPal directly if you wanna go and support us through there. Many ways, and we're gonna keep on harping on with that, but we will continue to seek ways in which we can try and provide more value basically to people if the best value there for us to be shared. So for now, I think we're gonna leave it there. Thank you very much for tuning in wherever you are in the world, which means Australia or Brazil or globally,   immortalized, take care wherever you are. 1 out. Karen out.  



[01:16:46] Kyrin Down:

Ciao.  

[01:16:49] Juan Granados:

Good.