Monthly bitcoin update EP32. Stay up to date with what matters.
Bitcoin monthly is a show hosted by Max, Bitcoin QnA and Antomous. We cover important updates in the world of bitcoin and open source software.
We do this monthly to keep listeners informed without having to dedicate hours every day to keep on top of developments. We break things down in a simple and fun way and we welcome questions or topic suggestions via podcasting 2.0 boosts.
In this episode of bitcoin monthly we talk about the importance of using bitcoin in a private and freedom focused way as well as covering the list of topics below.
Antomous gives us a puppy update.
Sparrow Wallet v1.8.2: Improved Transaction Tree Labels & More
BlueWallet v6.4.15: Tool to Generate Last Mnemonic Word & Tor removal
RoboSats v0.6.0 Pre-release: Introducing RoboSats Federation
Foundation Passport Firmware v2.2.0 and Envoy v1.5.0 Released
Bitcoin Keeper v1.1.8: Custom Multisig, Coin Selection & More
Phoenix Wallet iOS v2.1.0 Now Supports Request Inbound Liquidity Feature
Samourai Dojo v1.22.0: New API Endpoint, Exclusion of Incompatible Clients
RoninUI v2.4.0: Added Whirlpool UI
Whirlpool Unspent Capacity Smashes through 10,000 BTC
Mercury layer has been released
Ledger Connect Kit Exploited
New EU KYC/AML Rules to Impose Stricter Surveillance Measures on Users and Service Providers
Jamie Dimon exposes critical flaw in bitcoin.
Show Host: Max
https://twitter.com/MaxBitbuybit
Website - https://ungovernablemisfits.com/
Co host BQA
Twitter - @BitcoinQ_A
Website - bitcoiner.guide
Co host - Antomous
Twitter - @antomousB
Website vulcan21.com
Show Sponsor - Foundation Devices
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(00:02:20) Cheers to Foundation Devices
(00:03:10) Support us by supporting RoninDojo
(00:03:53) Crisp mic mate, how was the holidays?
(00:09:13) The Bitcoin ETF didn't pump my bags!
(00:12:43) Sparrow pleases the transactoors and inscriptoors
(00:19:25) The bluewallet giveth, and the bluewallet taketh away
(00:24:19) Robosats is federating
(00:29:25) SHILL ALERT: Foundation Devices Updates
(00:35:13) Bitcoin Keeper is FOSS...as of 6 months ago
(00:38:15) Phoenix allows you to request inbound liquidity
(00:41:03) Samourai Dojo v1.22.0 - Proper Peers Relay Transactions
(00:45:52) New Layer 2 Proposal: Mercury Layer
(00:48:35) Ledger's end of the year fuck up
(00:52:29) Unelected EU officials increase surveillance and more tx limits
(00:56:52) SAMOURAI SWAPS beta is live!
(01:01:10) Among others HRF awards grant to Keith Mukai of Seed Signer
(01:03:56) SHILL ALERT: New premium aluminum cases for SeedSigner
(01:06:48) Is that the list? Are we done?
[00:00:04]
Unknown:
Bitcoin is close to becoming worthless. Now what's the Bitcoin? Bitcoin's like rat poison. Shit. Oh. The greatest scam in history. Let's get it. Bitcoin will go to fucking 0.
[00:00:42] Unknown:
Alright, you ungovernable misfits. I'm your host, Max. Everybody knows that Bitcoin is useless, worthless, and doomed to fail. But what if everyone's wrong? What if it's the system that is doomed to fail? Join me, as I speak to some of the brightest people in the space, and Sliver to the deepest, darkest depths of the Bitcoin rabbit hole. Welcome back. Today's episode of Bitcoin Monthly is recorded with Bitcoin q and a and Antimus. We do it every month, and we do this so that you don't have to spend hours every day searching through all the updates In the Bitcoin and open source world, we do our best to filter out all the noise and get to the signal.
But maybe there's a topic that you particularly want us to cover or you have questions on something that we cover in this episode. If you do, You can send us a boost on any of the podcasting 2.0 platforms, and we will cover it on the next show. Actually, we will probably cover it. If it's stupid or scammy or just nonsense, we won't cover And if you want your stats back, you can ask us. We might give them back. We might not. We might tell you to fuck off if it's scammy. Anyway, loads to cover in this episode, so we'll Crack on. Before we start, I wanna say thank you to Foundation Devices for sponsoring this show. We wouldn't be able to make it without them, And I appreciate that they sponsored this show despite knowing that I would show their product to friends and family and listeners anyway.
It really is the Best hardware out there. It's fully open source. It has the best team in the Bitcoin world, And they're doing everything that they can to keep you safe and secure. QR scanning is piss It's easy with this thing. Envoy, their companion app is beautiful, and the new UTXO management tool is amazing. We cover some of this in this show, so I won't bang on too much. But if you haven't already checked them out, you need to go to foundation devices dotcom. I've put a link at the bottom of the show notes, but you can use the code Ungovernable if you do decide to buy one. You'll get 3 months of IV pnusage for free. Foundation devices.com.
Finally, if you want the best Bitcoin node out there, again, fully open source and with the best team in the space. Go to roninddojo.com. I've put a link in the show notes. You can use the code Ungovernable. If you decide to buy one of their Tantos Or Tanto twos. You will get a discount, and I will get a few sats as a thank you for mentioning them. Everyone's a winner. Enjoy the
[00:03:45] Unknown:
show.
[00:03:49] Unknown:
Oh, here's his beautiful voice. Hey. Hey.
[00:03:52] Unknown:
Can you, Mike? Can you hear me? Oh, yes.
[00:03:57] Unknown:
Wow. Wow. You sound really nice, mate. A new year, a new voice. A new you. How do you feel about it? Now you're a real man. We can hear you.
[00:04:07] Unknown:
Exactly. I've just come up real close and just groan a bit. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:04:13] Unknown:
That's for the ladies out there. Exactly. What are you recording on? Now a blue,
[00:04:18] Unknown:
the one you recommended. Yeah. So it's a Yeti blue, and it's, it's wonderful. I mean, it's still Mhmm. Still on the stand. I haven't got the arm out yet. Don't get it. Yeah. I hate the arms. This shit. Yeah. I hate them. Okay. Okay.
[00:04:33] Unknown:
When you use the arm, which I'm using now, you swing it across, and you're like, oh, this is gonna go right in front of my face, exactly where it's supposed to be. Yeah. But the problem is, when you do that, it's directly in front of the screen, which is also supposed to be in front of your face so that you can see the screen. So now as I look at our Bitcoin monthly show notes, All I can see is a fucking microphone. So just consider that
[00:04:57] Unknown:
before you buy one. It's really annoying. You have to sort of peer around stuff to see. Yeah. I get that. The issue is that I've if you've got, like, notes here, the mic's standing where I'm supposed to be writing. Right? And I've got it, like, kinda leading down so that I I'm not too far away from the mic, and I wanna sound like this. You need, like, a minion to stand on the side, I hold it to you when you write notes. They take it away again. That's it. Thank you. Yeah. Boys, how have you been doing? Been doing pretty well. Yeah. Christmas came and went. Fairly uneventful.
[00:05:28] Unknown:
Didn't catch COVID like the rest of the world, which is a plus. Mhmm. Everybody that I know seems to be ill in some, Shape or form, I managed to, survive it unscathed even though everybody in the household was on their deathbed. So by not having the jabs, I've, got that pure blood in me that's, I can now take on the world.
[00:05:48] Unknown:
And you had to look after everyone else, I assume, by Christmas then. Yep. Yeah.
[00:05:53] Unknown:
So that's been a thing in the UK,
[00:05:55] Unknown:
COVID? Apparently. Yeah. Everyone in my family had it as well. I don't know whether it's COVID because I refuse to let my family test, but that sort of symptoms anyway. Okay. Same in my household. Our family Christmas was canceled Sold on one side of the family. Oh. And then we had another cancellation, and it's because people were flapping around and testing and Boomer stuff. Very frustrating. But outside of them, we had a lovely Christmas in my house. It was very nice. None of us were sick. We're all pure bloods. Pure buzz around here. Had a great Christmas. Apes are too much. My little one can't stop saying bulking right.
So They just walk into any room and see any protein shaker or any food and just go, Bulking. Oh, amazing. And that was what Christmas was about. What about you, Antimus?
[00:06:48] Unknown:
Yeah. Well, this year was really relaxed, really slow. That was amazing. Like, the last years because I've got a pretty, like, spread out Family, together with my missus. So, the over the last couple of years, there's been a lot of traveling and going backwards or forwards and the Split up and so on. So this year, we just kind of retracted from all of that and and just, had a really solitary Holidays, and that was absolutely beautiful. So, yeah, we got a puppy, and, so that's Oh. That was wonderful to have a bit of time with I'll be in there because the the the last 2 months have been pretty tough getting her up to speed, but, everything's wonderful now. Can we do some puppy news? Yeah. I was gonna say I need some puppy pictures when we get off, the recording. Let's just, yeah, know a little bit about the puppy, how old, Well, Breton docks too hard, but it'd be nice to know. No. No. She's fine.
Labrador, And she's now 17 weeks. I just have, 4 months. And, yeah. I mean, we've got it with, like, 8 weeks something, 7, 8 weeks. So at the beginning, I would see a lot of wiping and a lot of, And it just eats everything fucking hell. So, yeah, I stayed there from near death a few times. Exactly.
[00:08:09] Unknown:
By the way, anybody that tells you getting a puppy is preparation for having kids is a barefaced liar. Yeah. Ignore everything they have to say. I bet.
[00:08:18] Unknown:
Yeah.
[00:08:19] Unknown:
Yeah. I can confirm. I thought when I had a dog, I was like, fucking hell. This is So much harder. My life is so much harder now. Like, I've gotta think about this other thing and can't just go out and not come back. And, oh, it's really tough. No. No. Treasure these moments.
[00:08:38] Unknown:
Yeah. No. It is absolute I mean, and now it's amazing. I mean, obviously, the 1st few weeks when it's I'm just a little sleep and and all that kind of stuff. But, I mean, that goes over so fast. I mean, Doug, I mean, You you kind of notice how fucking slow human evolve. Like, it's like they'll keep Yeah. Fucking hell up. Like, it takes ages. Like, it's so vulnerable and helpless. Mhmm. I mean, these these little ones, I mean, you're out of it in, like, 2, 3 weeks. I mean, such. It's fine. Yeah. And now now it's a proper little dog, man. That's wonderful. Love it. In other news, the ETF came and pumped all of our Bags, and we've all retired now like Bitcoin Twitter said we were going to. Oh, wait.
[00:09:21] Unknown:
Oh, shit. I better send that boat back quick. Shit. Sell the yacht. Yeah. Good job I kept the receipt. Exactly.
[00:09:34] Unknown:
Oh, man. There was, like, one day where it pumped, and then, like, literally a day later, they're like, oh, fuck. It's ended. It's over. And then Jamie Dimon came on and was like, a well, I don't know. I have to confirm this with you guys whether this is possible. Apparently, Satoshi can just come back, and then he'll just delete all the Bitcoins. Is that right? That's what he said on CNBC.
[00:09:56] Unknown:
He's got god mode. He can, he can just come in and do what he wants. Yeah. Why has no one checked this? I wouldn't have got involved if I'd have known this. He'd just come back and delete it. If only it was open source. That would be good, wouldn't it? I didn't have many texts, to be honest with you. But for anybody that the few people that I have tried to Orange Pill and that did, get over the line. I always say if they do come back to me and they're like, yeah. Oh, it's going down. I'm just like, yeah. If you ever wanna sell, you know where to come.
[00:10:20] Unknown:
Well, not you. Because I keep trying to sell mine to you. You won't
[00:10:24] Unknown:
Wow. You're tainted.
[00:10:29] Unknown:
Oh, man. Yeah. I was I was kind of expecting, like, sell the news event, but not even that happened. I mean, it was just absolutely, like, anticlimactic,
[00:10:37] Unknown:
the whole thing. I was actually looking for Cheap sats after that. The best thing about the whole situation was the fact that the SEC completely botched the announcement. That was good to be fair. Beautiful. Just that was just a wild timeline that you just It instills confidence, doesn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. These people are there to protect Gee, from money launderers and criminals, and they can't even send a fucking tweet on the right day.
[00:11:04] Unknown:
Or update a website.
[00:11:05] Unknown:
Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. The website went down the shop. Wasn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. And they didn't have, 2FA. Right? That was the issue.
[00:11:14] Unknown:
Apparently so. Well, I I I call bullshit that they got hacked. Really? Mhmm. You think they tweeted it out And then It's just too convenient. Yeah. They had it queued up for for the wrong day, and one of the interns did it wrong. They had to press the send button too early, or they just queued it for the wrong day It's my opinion. Maybe. I know Elon's come out and corroborated their story that they didn't have 2FA and they got hacked and stuff, but, You know, slip him some, Dogecoin, and he'll say anything.
[00:11:45] Unknown:
Or was it Elon? I've heard that one going around as well. I did actually
[00:11:49] Unknown:
say yeah. The fir the first comment we were talking about it in the work chat, and, that was my first comment was that I got, like, a a a little imagination thought here that Elon sat in his man cave in his fancy house in his underpants drinking beer just abusing Twitter god mode. Just fucking with the SEC.
[00:12:06] Unknown:
Because he did tell them to fuck off. Oh, did he? Yeah. I can't remember the exact phrasing, but in so many words, he told them to fuck off. Oh, yeah. Because of, like, the Tesla stuff. Right? I mean, because the the SSC was, like, investigating him and stuff like that. It was either fuck off or, like, they can suck my dick or they can Fuck off. It was something along those lines. Nice. The sort of thing you can do if you're Ironman. You can just say shit like that.
[00:12:32] Unknown:
Yeah. When you literally do have god mode. Mhmm. Alright. Antimus, take it away, mate. Yeah.
[00:12:39] Unknown:
Got quite a list. Thanks, Q, for for putting this together. So we've got, first of all, Sparrow Wallet v 1.8.2. So we've got some Some improvements here on on, like, labels and the transactions, and also a more visible effective fee rate, like a Statement, which is quite cool. So when you do, like, CPFP, like child pays for parent, you have to bump the fee. Right? So Both transactions together have an effective fee rate, which is now displayed more visibly, beforehand, or you'd have to go Going with the tooltip to to get that info. So there's some, like, minor improvements there. As always with Craig, there are quite a few things bundled up in these These updates, I don't know if anything else jumped out to you guys.
[00:13:26] Unknown:
Well, first off, he got it in by the skin of his teeth. I I messaged him yesterday that we're recording tomorrow and we've got nothing to talk about. So he's like, shit. Alright. Let me cobble something together. And this is what he came out with. So fair play. Not bad for that. Yeah. It could work. Yeah. The CPFP thing, is very cool with the effective fee rate because with the frothy mempool that we've had over the last 6 months, I've had a few messages from people that have kinda got caught out by doing Child Pays for Parent and not fully understanding kind of how it works and the fact that 9 times out of 10, you have to increase the fee rate quite drastically to pay for the parent transaction. Whereas some people get caught in the trap of they just bump it up a little bit thinking, well, you know, if I did 10 sats per byte before and now I do 15, and that's what Mempool says, then like you said, Antomous, that doesn't mean that the effective fee rate is the new one that you applied. It has to be much higher than that to carry the weight of the previous transaction. So being able to see that in Sparrow now before you hit the big red button to send it and commit is gonna save people of headaches, which is a good thing and, obviously, well thought out by Mr. Raw as well. The only other one from this release is that you can now reorder the outputs of a transaction, which will make no difference to the 99% of normal Bitcoin users.
Apparently, this is important for the ordinals, degens. 1 of the or the counting method that they do to kind of order their satoshis It's like a a first in, first out ordering system. And if you just kind of use a wallet like Sparrow or any other wallet just to blindly make a transaction, and it doesn't order them in the way that this Stupid ordinals framework says you can inadvertently send your yes, theory. Thank you. You can inadvertently send your, Quote, unquote, rare sat or whatever crap it is that's buried within the transaction to somebody else. And then, you know, as with Bitcoin, once it's gone, it's gone. So, it's not Specifically, like an ordinal support with Inspire or anything like that. It's just a case of if I've got 3 outputs to a transaction, I can choose which one goes in 0, 1, and 2 positions.
[00:15:29] Unknown:
Just going back to the chart paper preparing bit, what's the benefit of using that rather than RBF or Vice versa. I'm pretty sure I saw something the other day, which I didn't fully read. I just scanned it where it was saying something to do with privacy concerned with Child pays for parent, and RBF is gives less away or doesn't link other UTXOs.
[00:15:50] Unknown:
It depends a bit on on in what position you are. Right? So if you send coins to me, then you can only do RBF, and I can only do child pays per for parent, right, because I've got the output and you have the And you had the inputs. Right? But, obviously, if it's a self spend, you could do both. So if you wanna mimic That you're spending the coins, then you'd want to do child pays for parent. Although, no, at the end of the day, that doesn't matter. Right? Because it could still be both. So I I don't quite see the the privacy point. Maybe q there, but otherwise, it's just, like, the the depending on in what position you are. Right? Yeah.
[00:16:29] Unknown:
To my knowledge, the only privacy thing is with RBF, you can include additional inputs when you replace the transaction. And if you don't have a a say on what inputs are used, then obviously, you might be adding additional inputs to the transaction that are not desirable.
[00:16:44] Unknown:
Yeah. I think that was the point. I suppose if you're not labeling or you're you're using something, then that links. Yeah. Okay. So there's that As a plus point, I guess, for child pays for parent, but the flip side to that is
[00:16:57] Unknown:
doing child pays for parent versus RBF. There's 2 transactions with CPFP, so it's gonna cost you a lot more. And like I said before, you need to really jack up that fee rate. So, you know, to complete that, it costs a lot more Versus just replacing one transaction with another that then posts a higher fee rate. So there's trade offs to both. But that depends
[00:17:16] Unknown:
on Unless I'm I'm mistaken, but with child pays for parent, it only costs a lot more to bump the fee if you had multiple inputs with the Charles transaction. Right? Because that would increase the the weight. If you had just, like, one input, one output on the first transaction, Then it wouldn't take that much to bump it. But the second one, obviously, is just one input, one output. So the weight would be a lot Lower with the second one, so you'd have to bump it higher. Right? Or am I?
[00:17:45] Unknown:
Yeah. I think you're going down the right lines. It does the the the the Way in which you need to kind of bump the the fee does grow with the size of the transaction in terms of inputs, outputs, and signatures and stuff. So, yeah, you're right. But it that the the point of sale is still more expensive even in the most simplistic of transactions compared to r RBF. I had a situation now where I caught myself,
[00:18:05] Unknown:
with Wanting to do, child pays for parent, I had to do a a large transaction and, wanted to merge from different wallets Into one wallet and then do a large transaction. So I sent over some some coins from another wallet to the spending wallet and lowballed the fee because I knew I was gonna pass it on anyway, so, I could do child pays for the parent. The issue was I put in such a low fee that it didn't even show up in the in the mempools. And the issue is with it was on a a BTC pay server, and there it was showed as spent, so I can't respend it. And in the other one, it doesn't show show up, so that took quite a while to to get that undone.
[00:18:44] Unknown:
What did you do in that scenario there? Did you just wait until the fees dropped Then it got rebroadcast.
[00:18:50] Unknown:
Now I had to recover the wallet in a different wallet because it wasn't possible to do that out of, in my b two c pay server, it was from a lightning on chain wallet I was spending out. And inside RTL, it wasn't possible to rebroadcast. So I had to recover that wallet in a different wallet and then rebroadcast,
[00:19:11] Unknown:
and that worked. Was it blue wallet by any chance that it used for recovery? Yes. I was gonna say because there's not that many wallets outside of LND that support that c type because they don't use BIP 39, do they? Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Good to know. Wow. So that's a good segue. Right? Look at that. You see? What a Such a pro. It's that pure blood, isn't it? Exactly. Firing on all cylinders this morning, guys.
[00:19:36] Unknown:
Just as well, didn't do it in the evening. So we've got 2 releases actually here. So this is v 6.4.1215. And in the first, we've got a new tool to generate the last, mnemonic word. So if you draw your words out of a hat or or however you wanna do that with Chips or something like that. You can do this and then generate your 12th or 24th word within BlueWallet, which is definitely a cool feature. And then in the second release, we've also got and this is, pretty disturbing. I don't know if this, also, like, affects other projects, but they've removed Tor support. So, yeah. The and this is due to A dependency they've been using has not been maintained for a year or so. So they've deemed this insecure or not compatible anymore, And this is especially with, their framework, UI framework, which is, like, React Native so that they can use this on all different platforms.
And, yeah, I don't know how many other wallets use this this framework,
[00:20:44] Unknown:
the React Native, and have the same issue. But they have definitely said, we'll Taking out Tor support, and people should use it with the Orbot. Which is the worst app in the world. Yeah. I hate Orbot. I fucking hate Orbot. It is so shit. The fact that Blue Wallet have removed Tor from the app, although it sounds bad, like, it there's probably no change for the end user because it never fucking worked anyway. So I can kinda see why they would take that out and just have one less thing to worry about. But, you know, it's not great for, know, if you're a blue wallet user and you wanna talk to your, your node when you're not home, then you've gotta go through some hoops. You either gotta deal with the headaches of all bot, which I wouldn't even wish that on my worst enemy. Or, you know, set up a a tails girl side of things, which then massively raises the barriers to entry because not everybody's gonna be comfortable in setting that So if you're looking for an alternative, envoy.
[00:21:35] Unknown:
Don't worry. We'll get onto the shill.
[00:21:37] Unknown:
Shill. Oh, nice. Nice. Shill. Alert. Starting the year strong. I like it.
[00:21:46] Unknown:
It's all not working in blue wallet. Is that something to do with their implementation or how they're setting it up? Or is that just something with tool generally that it's just very unreliable? Because when you say it never works, it's not changing anything because it never works. It works in Envoy for me. Not always, but It does work. Like, you know, I was contacted you the other day. I was, oh, I'm trying to send this payment. It's not fucking connecting. It's not working. And I had to refresh and fuck around and Do it a couple of times, and then it worked. And that's, for me, a trade off that I'm willing to take. I'm like, it's not often I have to send a payment. Like, oh, it has to go this second. It's like if it takes me another 5 minutes, I'm like,
[00:22:28] Unknown:
I'm okay with that. Yeah. I sounded a little bit harsh before. Tor on mobile is difficult. I've never used a mobile wallet That has Tor built in and never not had a problem at some point. Every single one I've used has faces different challenges. The 1 Bit Blue Wallet is, as Antrima said, they they use a React Native to kind of as a framework to build their app. The Tor Library that they use that's compatible with React Native is not maintained and clearly didn't work very well. So reading comments on GitHub by one of the the main devs, Basically, they've just taken it out because it didn't work, and they're looking for an alternative.
[00:23:04] Unknown:
Fine. So it it is to do with how they've implemented it. Because both with Phoenix and with Envoy, it's not always perfect, but it's pretty good and usable. And so, like, I never understand this thing where people are like, oh, I just can't be bothered. With you, with your tail scale and stuff like that, like, okay, fine if you found a workaround. But A lot of people who are just like, I'm not gonna bother because Tor's too unstable. It's like, I don't personally experience that. Maybe that's me being lucky, but it's a bit shit, but it's workable.
[00:23:32] Unknown:
Yeah. It's, sadly, it's just,
[00:23:34] Unknown:
for the BlueBot situation that there isn't another alternative that they can look to that's compatible with their current App architecture, I guess. I'm not sure of any apps or other apps that use React Native, to be honest. Yeah. Like Zeus or something like that. I I mean, these are all also projects that that run on all sorts of different, platforms. I mean, that's one of the main benefits of using React Native. Right? What I understand is that you can very easily
[00:23:59] Unknown:
create your app and then deploy it for Android and macOS and for iOS and all this kind of stuff. Right? Yeah. Absolutely. You mentioned Zeus, actually. I just quickly checked, and it does that is, it's built on TypeScript and React Native. So Not sure what they're using under the hood, but, maybe the blue whale guys could see what going on on the Zeus side of things.
[00:24:19] Unknown:
Robosats, this is a big release On their side, great new features, that's been on the robot for a while. It's a horrible name in my opinion, but It's introducing the Robosats Federation. I was bracing myself for what was gonna come now, but It's not a new organization, that's been set up. This is their attempt to decentralize the whole Ecosystem, so you can now set up your own coordinator or multiple coordinators can exist In parallel and as a user, you can choose which one you wanna sign up for. So this is definitely great to see. To stabilize this, project and make it more resistant against, outside attacks.
Obviously, as a user, you should, watch out because It doesn't matter which one you choose. The the coordinator always has the power to steal funds from you. So, this is It that's one of the reasons why it's important to have multiple coordinators, so you don't have to trust one of them. But this is definitely interesting to see how this will, evolve and and shake out in the long term.
[00:25:31] Unknown:
Yes. I think there is a Reputation system for these new coordinators that come online as well. So whilst you are absolutely correct that, you know, one could go rogue and steal from you mid trade, The idea being that, obviously, if they did that, they'd quickly gain a terrible reputation and then cannibalize their own revenue stream. But, yeah, this is great to see the option to have multiple Different coordinators up there, all crucially within a single order book, so it's not like you need to know the onion addresses for all our different coordinators. Like, they're all visible from within the same master order book. One unanswered question I have here, and maybe you can answer it, Anthemas, is while it's great that we're decentralizing the coordinators, and we have multiple options, and hopefully we get to a stage Somewhere down the line where this is lucrative enough that there's enough of an incentive that we get 100 of these. If they're all coming into a single order book, Then if I was a 3 letter agency, wouldn't that order book just be the main target then? Because if I take that down, then nobody else can Discover that there's a 100 coordinators.
I know that's kinda hand waving. That probably is not an easy thing to do, especially if it's been hosted over Tor, but it still seems like there is a little bit of a Single point of failure or single point of attack at least? Yeah. That's the main difference, right, to Bisk because there you've got your your client server on on your machine At home, and they can connect directly here. You've got it running
[00:26:49] Unknown:
via this one website. Right?
[00:26:51] Unknown:
Are they partly thinking liquidity is relatively Small on Robosats as far as I understand it, and maybe they're thinking, well, we can adapt if things change, if we grow to a certain size because, Presumably, a 3 letter agency is gonna put their resources on something bigger first, I'd imagine. I don't know. I don't know how they think, but that may be part of it. They're definitely taking steps.
[00:27:17] Unknown:
And I think that the big 1 was decentralizing the coordinator, and I would imagine that the next step would also be to have multiple endpoints from which to to access the order book so that that's not dependent on this one access point. But I I haven't seen that vocalized by them, but that's definitely a good point.
[00:27:39] Unknown:
They might not vocalize it because that might put more of a target or whatever. But I just think Maybe if I was in that position, I'd be looking and going, this is probably okay as a trade off for now, but maybe on the road map, there's something different.
[00:27:53] Unknown:
Possible. Yeah. And I I don't wanna come across as as alarmist. You know? This is native to Tor, and it's nontrivial to try and take down an unknown onion address. Some dot net markets survive for years years years. Like, it's it's not an easy thing to do. So I don't wanna come off as, like, pooh pooh ing, you know, what they're doing here because this is absolutely a fantastic Step in the right direction and, you know, love to see what they're doing. So maybe I'll try and get an answer to it. I'll hop into the Robosatz Telegram group and just see if there's,
[00:28:20] Unknown:
There might just be a a simple answer to it, and I'm just being an idiot, but we'll see. And maybe it's even possible to do that. Right? I mean, I don't know how they get all the different Data from the different coordinators to bundle that up into this one order book. But, I mean, it's all open source. Is it, like, Via some kind of API system that you could just pull this data, and I could set up a website and just pull that data and create my own or order book.
[00:28:46] Unknown:
So I think I may have just answered my own question just been reading one of the links. I think that each new coordinator that comes on also hosts The whole thing as well. So they Oh, shit. Okay. So I'll read it verbatim here. Decentralized instances. The new version brings the power of decentralization to Robosats. By sporting new instances, we increase the robustness of the platform. In order to fully stop the peer to peer market of Robosats, every single instance must be stopped. So what I glean from that is that each coordinator is the host for the whole order book, not just their own orders. Mhmm. Okay. Or their own economic liquidity, so to speak. Yeah. Nice. Very nice. Good work. Boom.
[00:29:29] Unknown:
Right. Next on the list, we've got Foundation Passport, firmware v 2.2.0, and Envoy v 1.5.0. These were both released Beginning of January, if I'm not mistaken?
[00:29:42] Unknown:
Yes, sir. No. I think, late December, but definitely after we last recorded. The Envoy side of things, I won't go into full details because we basically covered it last time because the beta was out. So all of that info's covered within there, but the headlines are full tap group support for mobile wallets. We've now got a full Spanish translation, and then the rest of it was kinda quality of life sorts of things. So, Yeah. Go check it out. On the passport side of things, release 2.2.0, the main headliners were if you're signing a larger transaction, Larger in terms of data, so it might be a multisig transaction or just a single sig with a shit ton of inputs. We will automatically detect that as soon as you Start to scan the the PSBT from Sparrow, Envoy, Nunchuk, whatever it is, and just say, hey, by the way, this is a very large transaction. Do you want to Sign it via micro SD card instead because it might be quicker. You can then say yes or no, and then you know, obviously, if you say yes, you'll be switched into the micro SD card sign in flow. If not, then you'll just continue with the QR code scanning flow, and it'll just continue to read all of those inputs.
It only triggers you know, you'll only see this when you are Signing very large transactions, but it's just to give you that option to say, hey. You know, it might be quicker to do this via a micro SD card. And once you've signed the transaction, You can also let's say you did it with QR codes. You can then once it's signed, the passport is displaying the signed PSPT on screen via QR codes. You can now save that to a micro SD card if you want to kind of keep it and broadcast it later. If you're away from a coordinator or something like that or or you haven't got Internet connection, You can just save that signed PSBT to a micro SD card and keep it for broadcast later. And the flip side is also true that if you are signing via the micro SD flow and then you're like, you know what? I wanna pass this back to the coordinator via QR codes, then you can go back the other way as well. And the final, headline is that we now Support restoring seed QR seeds. So both formats, compact and normal. So you can now rather than having to type the words in to restore an existing wallet within Passport, you can now just scan a QR code if you've got one of those already backed up. Hell, yes.
[00:31:48] Unknown:
Be cool if someone made some, like, nice plates or something for that.
[00:31:54] Unknown:
That's wonderful to see. That's definitely something on my to do list To to get that checked out.
[00:31:59] Unknown:
Do you know what I've been really enjoying with the passport? It's basic, but I really like it. It's just being able to check addresses. I know that's simple, but sometimes when I'm putting in passphrase, and then I'm like, oh, have I actually put the right one in? Am I actually using the right passphrase here Before I send or do a self spend, just being able to scan a QR with the passport and confirm, yes, you are actually sending where you want be sending, you're not fucking yourself over here, is a really nice little feature. Yeah. Literally, for me, one of the best parts of a QR code based signer is Just scanning a QR code and being sure that it is one of yours, be it a receiver or a change address before you go and do a big transaction, just to get that peace of mind is worth its weight in gold. It saves a lot of concern. You know, for example, if you haven't written down is it fingerprint you call it? Like, when you enter a new passphrase in and then it gives you So, you know, if you haven't written that down or you're not sure it's right and then you're gonna do a larger spend, just being able to check that, it really It takes, like, one second to do it, and you're like, oh, okay. We're fine. That is really nice.
[00:33:07] Unknown:
So just to build on top of that, we've just started Quality assurance testing on 2.3.0, which should be out by the time that we record next time. We've got a full address explorer as well. So if If you, for whatever reason, don't want to or don't like to do the the verify QR code scan we've just been talking about, you can also go in and now view addresses By the account. So you can see a list of addresses that are controlled by the various accounts that you've got added to passport. You can view them 1 by 1, skip By 10 at a time, if you've you know, you're looking for, like, index 670 or something stupid like that, and then you can also view a QR code version of each and every address as well. So technically speaking, you could, if you wanted to, and I don't advise this, use passport Without a coordinator to receive only if you wanted to. Obviously, there's lots of caveats there that you obviously, Passport doesn't know the state of the blockchain and and the wallet itself, so doesn't know whether addresses have been reused or not. So that's one of the main reasons why I say I don't advise this. But, yeah, Address Explorer, very cool feature, especially if you're, like, you're Looking for, like, a a a specific address, a specific index so you can go and check on device for any of your accounts.
[00:34:17] Unknown:
One question I had to the signing with large transactions and the the micro SD card option, this was for passport. Right? So On your passport, when you start scanning, it will ask you if you wanna transfer via micro SD card.
[00:34:31] Unknown:
Yes. Only when it detects a really large transaction. So most people are never gonna see this unless you're, like, a a 3 or 5 multisig user or you're a miner and you've got hundreds of inputs and you're kind of, consolidating them all or something like that. Okay. But in Envoy,
[00:34:46] Unknown:
is that also detected? So when I set up a transaction, Envoy would already know, right, that this is a large transaction And that it could directly be transferred via micro SD card.
[00:34:57] Unknown:
We don't support micro SD card signing in Envoy yet, so everything is on the Passport side. So as soon as it reads the PSBT, doesn't matter where it comes from, could be Sparrow, Nunchuk, anything that we're compatible with, Passport will surface the morning. I understand. Right. Okay.
[00:35:12] Unknown:
Then next on the list, we have got Bitcoin Keeper v 1.1. 8, and this is, custom multisig. So now you can set up any m or n multisig you want And also coin selection, which is something we approve here. So that's that's great to see. Yeah. I think
[00:35:37] Unknown:
previously, they only had, like, specific plans. So you could you could set up a single sig, like just connect your passport, Or you could do a 2 or 3, which they gave them names. I think it was, like, the pleb plan and the money budget plan or something like that, and the latter being a 3 of 5. This release now basically means that you can go and do a a one of 3 or a 7 of 12 or something, whatever you've you know, you can make it fit your your specific use case If you wanted
[00:36:03] Unknown:
to. What's the open source status of Keeper at the moment? I I did not follow this, So now maybe I missed this, but they had that on the road map. Right?
[00:36:14] Unknown:
Yes. And I am frantically trying in the background to find an update because I don't know. Still not seeing any GitHub links on their website, so my gut feeling is it's still not open source.
[00:36:26] Unknown:
Well, Bitcoin Keeper, release, but this is on GitHub. Release fee 1.1.2.
[00:36:33] Unknown:
Found it?
[00:36:34] Unknown:
Yes. Oh, nice. Ah. It's a start. Oh, look. Built on React Native.
[00:36:41] Unknown:
Interesting. They've They have a tool yet. Oh, they have? I think so. But they use Whirlpool? So No. You can't connect to Whirlpool, over Clearnet. There is a Clearnet API. Oh, okay. Or or more. I'm looking for Yes. License. Here we go. Yeah. It's MIT. Oh. Good job, guys. Well done. Love to see it. Is there any clauses? Hang on. Nope. Shortly, MIT. Well done, guys. When did this happen?
[00:37:10] Unknown:
Cool.
[00:37:11] Unknown:
6 months ago, the license was updated.
[00:37:14] Unknown:
Oops. Missed that one. Cool.
[00:37:17] Unknown:
I believe the, Bitcoin keeper guys have just got a 2 Bitcoin bounty from HRF, border wallets. Did you see that? Oh,
[00:37:26] Unknown:
because they implemented it. I saw I saw the bounty that were we spoke about that a few months ago, right, when the the bounty was put out, but I didn't see that they got it. Looks like it's just been paid out. Yeah. Cool.
[00:37:37] Unknown:
Was it in Bitcoin keeper? Because don't because the the same team makes a couple of wallets. So I think it might have been in their other wallet.
[00:37:44] Unknown:
That could also be. I can see it's v 1.1.0. Pierce, we have also open sourced the code under the MIT license, and that was on the 1st August 2023.
[00:37:55] Unknown:
Yeah. Oh, but then for being behind.
[00:37:58] Unknown:
Nice. Because that was always my well, the the one hold back I had with that. I mean, they do it, and the Max does do amazing job, and the the UI is great. It all looks cool, and they're doing the right stuff. But it was always like, oof, don't really wanna trust this with live funds or recommend it to people, Not being open source, but, I mean, now it's been open for for 6 months. Love to see it. We've got also Phoenix wallets for iOS fee 2.1.0. They also support the request inbound liquidity feature. I'm not a 100% sure if this was now just an update for the iOS Versions and it was also already implemented beforehand?
You are correct. Okay. So this way around. Yeah. I mean, the the request inbound liquidity feature is wonderful. I think I saw this the first time in, like, November or something. November, December. I don't know. This is coming up. Do you wanna give a recap for the listeners as in what it is and why it's cool? Well, for those of you who want to or who receive a lot of lightning transactions, this is a great feature to have because, obviously, it's a one-sided liquidity stream. So you've got the Sats always coming coming in from your your channel Partner, and at some point, the channel is gonna be empty. So you'll have to rebalance if you can or set up new channels, especially in a high fee environment. This can be very costly.
Phoenix is now offers a new feature that you can plan ahead and request A certain amount of inbound liquidity for a certain amount of time, and they'll set that aside for you. And you're paying a small fee, but it's it's Very minor.
[00:39:31] Unknown:
What's small?
[00:39:33] Unknown:
Don't have the exact numbers in here, but I remember Sorry. I stepped away for 10 seconds. What was the question? Of, like, how high the fees are for the liquidity provided, but I remember that it was pretty low. But at the at the end of the day, it's a great way to secure your inbound liquidity For a relatively low price without having to set up new channels and rebalance and and splice your way out of it. Yeah. Especially for those of you who are selling products Via lightning or just, receiving your salary or getting donations or whatever. If you've if you've got a lot of Inbound liquidity coming in, and you're not sending a lot of it out via lightning. This is a great way to kind of cover your risk of future high fees.
[00:40:16] Unknown:
With, explaining that you're incentivized here to do one big receive to open a large channel and pay a single fee So that you can you know, if you then wanna receive any further over and above that in the future after you've spent some down, it doesn't result in additional splice, Which is essentially an on chain transaction, which is then the fees are passed on to you. So if you make one big fee from the outset, you can save yourself quite a lot in the long run if you plan to to use Phoenix long term and to do lots of payments in and out with it. In the short amount of time, I couldn't find the the exact numbers on the cost for the liquidity.
[00:40:53] Unknown:
It's 1%.
[00:40:55] Unknown:
Oh, that's alright.
[00:40:57] Unknown:
There we go. Samurai Dojo v 1.22.0 new API endpoint. So this is just an option to be able to check your Addresses and if they've been used before and exclusion of incompatible clients. I don't have more information on that. I don't know, exactly what that is. That's why I included this.
[00:41:18] Unknown:
Render.
[00:41:21] Unknown:
Yeah. Yeah. And I think Max has got a great couple of podcasts you wanna deep dive onto this, but, basically, there's a a fork of Bitcoin Core maintained by Luke g dash junior dasher called Bitcoin Knots, which is also used or one of the options within the Ocean Mining Pool. Anybody that runs that Knots Client, it has certain restrictions that limit op return data or the size of it, which makes a lot of privacy preserving spends that are common within the samurai wallet ecosystem. They won't be relayed by those Knots nodes because Knots sees them as Spam or whatever you wanna call it, and it it won't relay them. So if you're a Dojo user, it makes absolutely zero sense to have any peers that are running not because When you send the transaction, the knot's peer will not relay it. So this update with Dojo basically just cuts all of the knot's clients and makes them, You know, not able to talk to Dojo Software. Yeah. I mean, that whole
[00:42:17] Unknown:
saga, right, has been quite a a large, topic. The the last time we spoke, That hadn't all gone down. Right? It's the first time we're on air with all those developments.
[00:42:28] Unknown:
Yeah. Max did a a great couple of podcasts and and Twitter livestreams to cover it. But, yeah, I I think this makes from the Dojo perspective, this makes perfect sense. People are there's a few people screaming censorship and whatnot, but it's It's literally like, well, why would I want a Bitcoin peer connected to my node that isn't gonna relay my transactions?
[00:42:46] Unknown:
Yeah. Just makes no sense. Mhmm. Dojo Koda broke it down really nicely on our call, which I then posted live on my feed as well. But, yeah, he goes into why, and I can't see any reason why you wouldn't do that. And, also, it's kind of not irrelevant, but not many people use Knots. It's like it's such a small percent of the network that the amount of times where this is actually gonna happen is is so minor. And it's a bit of a fuck you as well. It's like It's an important thing that they're working on, and Luke and his games are, fucking around with it unnecessarily
[00:43:22] Unknown:
as far as I can see. So yeah. That also will pass downstream to all Ronin Dojo users as well because, obviously, that Mhmm. Runs the Dojo software. So I think that's already been implemented by the Ronin team as well. Yeah. And with Ronin, they've come out with a new Whirlpool UI for those of you who've been using Ronin Dojo for a couple of years. Think it was about a year ago or 14, 16 months ago or something that they came out with the Ronin Dojo UI, which was a huge STEP and now also they've improved on this with their Whirlpool UI, which, just visualizes, all the work Whirlpool workflows directly from your dojo, so major boost there. Whirlpool unspent capacity, also Jumping over 10,000 Bitcoin, this was obviously going on during the drama.
I think no one could have scripted this one better. So, that was that was quite quite nice. They came out with a new s code to give a small fuck you. Was that filter this, wasn't it? Filter this. Yeah. 50% off. Lovely. That was beautiful. So that was that was sometime
[00:44:31] Unknown:
around Christmas. Right? I think it was New Year's Eve. Oh, New Year's Eve. Alright. It was when it when it tipped over 10,000. It was either Christmas Eve or New Year's Eve, but, yeah. Awesome to see. Massively vindicated for the team. Huge congratulations to everybody involved, and it's still going strong even after 10 k. I think we're up to 10 and a half k now.
[00:44:48] Unknown:
And you were right for a change?
[00:44:51] Unknown:
Yeah. The one call, well, I made 2 calls last year. One of them is still open. It's a bet with, O'Dell about Menpool's clearing. Currently, he's winning, unfortunately. I think I've got until the halving to lose that bet. Mhmm. And then the other one, I think I said it in March, Well, liquidity was about 6 and a half 1000 Bitcoin. I called, 10 k liquidity by the end of the year, and I got it By literally the skin of my teeth, I'm pretty sure it was New Year's Eve. Yeah. But that wasn't a bet with anyone. It was just an off the cuff comment to back to T Dev because T Dev Regularly, post updates about the liquidity, especially when it hits all time highs. And I just, off the cuff comment just said, you know, back in March, 10 k by end of year, and then I commented it on pretty much all of his updates after that just to drive the point home, and it seemed to manifest itself. I'm not saying that I had much to do with that with my, you are. You are. 3 times 100,000 sat UTXOs in Whirlpool. I was gonna say, how high are the interest rates on your loan for Yeah. I'm sweat I'm sweating a little bit. Yeah. But you're right. Just remember that.
That's the important point.
[00:45:58] Unknown:
So, next on the list, this is something that's potentially interesting, but I have not had time to look into this much Mercury layer. So this is a new proposal for a layer 2, which supposedly allows for self Custody and also transactions off chain. So this would be a competitor to Lightning and to, well, for those of They use it liquid, but I'm not sure how this works, technically. I mean, there's not been an actual wallet released or anything, it's it's more like of a toolkit, with dev kit for people to build on, but, I've not seen this discussed much yet. So, don't know if you can fill in on
[00:46:41] Unknown:
this. I'll read the TLDR from their website. Mercury layer is an implementation of a layer 2 state chain Kola enables off chain transfer and settlement of Bitcoin outputs that remain under the full custody of the owner at all times While benefiting from instant and zero cost transactions, the ability to perform this transfer without requiring confirmation, basically mining of on chain transactions has advantages in a variety of different applications. I've listened to a couple of podcasts on this, and it's very, very, very complex and tends to blow my brain About 10 minutes in, I think the TLDR is it's like you're provably transferring private keys. That's how you can do it off chain without Having, like, a double spend problem, how that works, I've got no clue. But if they can pull this off and it kinda gains some traction, then it could be a cool scaling solution.
[00:47:30] Unknown:
As always, if it sounds too good to be true like that little snippet did, there's almost always gonna be some trade offs buried somewhere. I just haven't found them yet. That sounds wild. Because I mean, transferring the private key bit, you're rolling the private key as well, so it's a different private key or Well, I don't know. Or, like, some kind somehow wrapping it in in some kind of encryption and
[00:47:52] Unknown:
alright. I mean, this Just to put it into perspective how complex It's like I just scroll down from the the little blurb that I've just read, and there's, like, code snippets, and I'll just read one out to you. It's o two brackets s 1 +0one equals s2+0. N LockTime equals s 1, r o, s 2, p. Like, it doesn't make any sense to the layman. Yeah. No. I can't. Yeah. Oh, you got that? Yeah. Yeah. You got all that? Cool. No. That's a reasonable trade off, actually. I like that. There we go. Alright. He's got the seal of approval for Max. Okay. Well, with all these, things, I mean, we probably can probably revisit this in a in a couple of years and see if something is Yeah. I was gonna say, yeah, give it 10 years. Mhmm. Yeah. Alright.
[00:48:33] Unknown:
Yeah. Well, we'll see who's around in 10 years, coming to the next topic with Ledger fucking up at the end of the year once more. Ledger Connect. Kit exploded.
[00:48:46] Unknown:
Wouldn't be a Bitcoin monthly without a Ledger fuck up, would it? Well, it's not our choice. Right? We we can choose.
[00:48:52] Unknown:
They're pushing themselves on us. Exactly. Yeah. So this is a good reminder why it's valuable to have Bitcoin only products, especially in the in the self custody space. So, here, Bitcoin users, were mostly protected, but their connect kit, which allowed For third party websites to connect back to, your ledger to do quick and convenient spends, there was some exploit, in that software, which led to, hacks and stolen funds within the by the crypto ecosystem. This was live for about 2 hours and was then patched, but still there's Quite a large amount of of funds which are stolen.
[00:49:39] Unknown:
The other thing that's worth mentioning here is I believe that it was to do with web applications. And when you're doing, like, signings of these complex smart contracts on various chains that are not Bitcoin, they're so complex that You can't communicate what's going on on the tiny USB stick screen that Ledger has. So, basically, Ledger just says, Do you want to take this action? Yes or no? And the user basically just has two choices. So they can't verify anything that's happening. So if there is an exploit like this, they can't pick it up. They can't catch it. And Clearly, the ledger didn't catch it for whatever reason. I don't I don't know with the the ins and outs of the of the hack, but, yeah, just another, notch in the bedpost of Legit screw ups this year. Brilliant.
[00:50:25] Unknown:
Oh, yeah. Yeah. On that topic, it's also I was, going I got a lot of attention at the end of the year as well, was, some reporting, from a NIM on Twitter, have not got the handle. I don't know if you can find it until I'm finished. But, they Reported or did a bit of digging in the Ledger Live app for, like, how much tracking they do. Fuck and hell. And this was, It's, brutal. I mean, at the end of the day, it's not that surprising that they track literally everything you do within the app, But that it even goes all the way to balances and, yeah, highly sensitive information that does not have Much to do with, like, usual analytics that, companies use to improve their product.
So this actually was High level surveillance, of their users, and, their response was Very meager. That was just very, very limited and just basically, like, yeah. Well, you've kind of opted into this way signing the terms of service, And that's it.
[00:51:38] Unknown:
There was so much tracking in in this that this guy found that it basically Ledger knows what you're thinking before you think it. That's a joke, by the way, just before somebody comes after me with a lawsuit.
[00:51:52] Unknown:
Well, I heard on, McCormack show the best thing to do is buy a ledger, get tracked and surveilled, and then send it into Wasabi to get tracked and surveilled If you have anything left after that to go and gamble it, is that true? Not financial advice.
[00:52:11] Unknown:
Yeah. Don't do that, guys.
[00:52:13] Unknown:
Don't listen to any of those adverts ever. Whatever's being advertised is going to rape you. Yeah. Looking forward to the next one. So
[00:52:24] Unknown:
I think this is, one of the last points, on the list. The EU has, come out with another provisional agreement to increase the level of, surveillance And, the limits on, transaction amounts, which are available to to us citizens of the EU, well, me and my people over here, not you, let's go Brexit.
[00:52:55] Unknown:
Presumably, we'll follow suit.
[00:52:58] Unknown:
It seems like we talk about this sort of stuff every single month, but Once again, it's just a reminder that the net is closing in. The arbitrary limits that they set that you can transact privately via cash, Bitcoin, debit card, whatever it is, are set. They're not set permanently. They will get smaller and smaller and smaller whilst they're continuing to inflate the money supply so that things cost more and more and more until till you can't buy a package of chewing gum without giving them your inside leg measurement. So Yeah. We need an alternative.
[00:53:27] Unknown:
Do you know of any guys?
[00:53:28] Unknown:
No. I'll let you know if I hear of anything.
[00:53:31] Unknown:
Okay.
[00:53:32] Unknown:
The one good thing is this is I mean, with the EU, If they've demonstrated one thing, everything takes ages. So this is a provisional agreement, and now this has to be discussed and presented to all the different member states and so on, and then they'll come together to formally agree on this. So this could even be Blocked or revised, and then even once it's formally agreed upon, usually, there's a lead time of multiple years until the member states have to implement this. So, yeah, this is not something that will happen in 2024. But As, yeah, you just mentioned, this is pretty much inevitable. This that this will come and much expected, and we've discussed this many times.
And it's just one one step on the way. So prepare accordingly. Yeah.
[00:54:29] Unknown:
Never more freedom for the subject. It's always less, always more surveillance. Good to see. Did anyone watch? I know it's a politician. I know we'll see what actually happens and what he actually does. But did you watch Millet's speech at the WEF conference.
[00:54:49] Unknown:
No. I've seen it linked and retweeted did that many times into it on Twitter that I I'm pulling up a stand now, and I just don't wanna watch it. I'm just sick of the sight of his face.
[00:54:59] Unknown:
Fine. I watched it for you. It is still a politician, and it's probably lying, and it's probably bullshit. But I'll say this. He did stand up in front of the WEF And literally tell them to go fuck themselves, that they are murderous leeches, that all the things that they're pushing are complete bullshit, shit, and then he backed it up with a lot of data and facts. I just thought whether he does what he says he's gonna do or not, It was quite enjoyable to see that, to see at the WEF someone literally talking about how disgusting they are, Why you have to have sound money, why you shouldn't have government at all, and anyone who is building and creating is a hero, and anyone who's trying to control them is a disgusting leech.
[00:55:46] Unknown:
Fair play. Fair play. Yeah. Exactly. Fair play. News flash for next month. Listeners, turn off now if you don't want a spoiler. Melee has been found in his bathtub with a hairdryer and sand.
[00:55:58] Unknown:
Exactly that. I shouldn't laugh, Look. I took a bet at work yesterday about this. It was how long until he gets suicided. Gets Epstein ed. Yeah. Mhmm. He's either gonna get Epstein ed, or He's gonna suddenly be found with a load of, like, pedo stuff on his hard drive. Yes. Be one of the 2. And then I decided it's actually not gonna be that. It's both. What will happen is he will be suicided and then to discredit everything that he said. Millet found in the bathtub, killed himself after. We found Pido stuff on his drive. What a disgusting man. This is why You can never have freedom, and you have to have socialism.
[00:56:38] Unknown:
And then everyone will go, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that'll be it. Yep. I wouldn't take the over under on that bet. I think that's
[00:56:45] Unknown:
1 to 10. 1 to 10. I'm not bad.
[00:56:48] Unknown:
Oh, man. Oh, jeez. Did you I I didn't put it on the list, though. I I can't remember whether Whether I did or not, but did you guys see off the press this week that the samurai team have well, opened up their atomic swap to a public beta? No. Yes. So they've released the
[00:57:04] Unknown:
go back. You take it away.
[00:57:06] Unknown:
Well, you know more about it than me, I'm sure. But, basically, atomic swaps, Meaning that for your toxic change, where it gets to a point where it's too small to put in and mix again, where it's just Sat there and you're like, what the fuck do I do with this? You can then swap that into Monero with an atomic swap, and then you could collect as much of the Monero you wanted over time and then swap back out or spend it, whichever you wanted, which is a pretty big privacy gain. Cool to see.
[00:57:35] Unknown:
Yeah. Definitely. Just a point of clarification here. The app is a stand alone desktop application right now. I'm not sure what the end state is here, whether it's only gonna be a desktop app or whether this is, like, the testing ground before it gets moved into the wallet. I'm guessing it's the latter. But right now, if you wanted to Test, and it is, yeah, it's a it's a development based desktop UI just to get things, you know, test the the framework itself. But Love to see it. Looking forward to the usual crowd shouting, shitcoiner. But, yeah, this is a very, very useful tool, and like you say, perfect for for Doxygen. So,
[00:58:07] Unknown:
Once again, hats off, guys. Keep building. This is just a tool for the impatient, man. We just gotta wait for the 10 k, Paul.
[00:58:13] Unknown:
Yeah. I mean, the way the mempool's going, I can't see that happening.
[00:58:18] Unknown:
Yeah. You fucking shitcoiners. Anyone who actually uses Bitcoin And users of these tools will come across this problem. They'll be like, oh, what do I do with this? And and it would either sit in your wallet or you'll swap it out for Monero or you'll fuck yourself somehow and mix it by accident. So it is really useful. And then all the people who will attack People who actually use Bitcoin for doing this, either if you're using Monero or accepting Monero, they'll then attack you. And you're like, you're accepting fiat on your website. You keep calling that a shitcoin. So who's the biggest shitcoiner now? Yeah. And you're using wallet of Satoshi. Yeah. Exactly. I don't get that argument at all. I mean, I mean it's like this whole shit. At the end of the day, it's just use the tools. Right? And, I mean,
[00:59:03] Unknown:
do whatever you wanna do. Like, I I don't I don't really give a shit. Plus 1. Yeah. I mean, if if this serves a use case for people, go ahead. And, I mean, we spoke about this obviously with in regards to other projects as well. The the more different projects you incorporate and the more the the larger code base gets and all that kind of stuff, like, the larger the risk is for vulnerabilities and the the larger your dependency base gets. But, I mean, the adding one to the list Won't kill you, and I I mean, I'm not a developer, so I don't know exactly what the difference in code bases, from protocol side and and all that kind of stuff, like how much, has to be implemented there. You make a valid point about the increase
[00:59:46] Unknown:
in copaycess stuff. And just to be clear here, the way that this is Gonna work and state in summarize that there is no Monero wallet in there. You need an independent Monero wallet to receive too. And I guess that's probably one of the driving factors For them doing that is that they don't have that overhead then. Like, you have to just plug in a Monero address and say, like, send it here when you when the swap completes, Which is a wise thing to do because well, for the exact reason that you stated, Antimus. Takes out one step because at the moment, people are having to take that UTXO,
[01:00:13] Unknown:
Then send that to a swapping service, which is either centralized or, well, generally, they're centralized. And then you then have to get Changed for Monero and then sent to your own wallet. This just takes that out. And rather than it being a centralized entity doing it, You have this atomic swap where it either happens or it doesn't, and you don't get fucked, basically. So it is very useful. And then you're only doing it for I think most people would do something like they take their toxic change. If it's a larger amount, they'd put that larger amount back through the pool, And they keep doing that through all the different pools until they get to the smallest amount. And then you're like, oh, what do I do with the smallest amount? With that smallest amount, you would then Do the atomic swap. You'd either then change that straight out for Bitcoin, or you just make a spend. You either do a donation, Or you buy VPN with it or you do whatever you need to do with that smaller amount. Yeah. I just don't see where the issue is. It's useful.
[01:01:12] Unknown:
Agree. 100%. Any other business, gentlemen?
[01:01:15] Unknown:
One thing I wanted to add, which was really amazing over the last month, There have been 2 large grant rounds announced, one from OpenSats and one from the HRF. So there's been a whole list of different open source projects and individual developers, core contributors, and so on that have gotten funding for quite a significant amount of time now going forward to work on Specific things or just carry on their work in in regards to the these open source projects. So this is a major boost That came out. 1 that, I personally like to highlight is, Keith Mukai from SeedSiner, the lead maintainer, who Got a grant from the HRF to work on SeedSiner full time again. He did that couple of years ago with the grant, and this, gave a huge boost At the time, I think it was the 0.5.0 that came out, which was completely reworked.
And now, once again, he's got Time to ditch his fiat job and, and work on this full time, which is amazing. So, looking forward to seeing what comes out of that. But, as a short teaser, I think What he's, mainly working on now is rewriting the code base to be able to function on all sorts of different hardware platforms So that it's not dependent on the Raspberry Pi 0 anymore. And I think the main point is to port the code to MicroPython, and this will obviously be huge for DIY builders around the world, who Don't necessarily have access to the Raspberry Pi 0 and also people who may have concerns with that board or delivery shortages,
[01:03:00] Unknown:
Supply chain shortages and so on. So this would be That's pretty cool. Presumably, that makes it a bit less attackable as well. If it's MicroPython, Can that be used on lots of different boards?
[01:03:11] Unknown:
Exactly. I mean, they'd like one would be like the ESP 32 or something like that, which Like, the blockchain Jade runs on that as well. So so that's another board that that would work, or also, like, the Banana Pie, and so on. I mean, that Concern is is not 0, with the Raspberry Pi 0, but, it's they produce millions of these Devices. So it's it's not a niche product where the supply chain could be attacked to get to those Few Bitcoiners that use it. I mean, the overwhelming majority, is used for completely different things. So but, obviously, it's it would be Still better to have have more options.
[01:03:55] Unknown:
Very good to see. Are you selling, many of your new cases? I saw them. They're very sexy. The aluminum cases. Yeah. Oh, so nice. They are beautiful.
[01:04:06] Unknown:
Yeah. There's, actually a a new version coming out. Haven't officially announced these yet, on Twitter. I'm sorry. This is the official announcement. There we go. So this is a reworked, case. This is by Formerly Monero time, I think his account was nuked and and and now it's XMR Street or something like that. But he's he's a a hell of a guy, very, very talented who designed and Builds these, full aluminum milled cases for the seed signer. So this is under the label seed signer premium, And they're extremely thin and very, very high quality builds.
The first version came out a couple of months ago, and They had all the ports open, and now the new version will only have the power port open. I learned. There we go.
[01:05:03] Unknown:
How about time? I learned.
[01:05:08] Unknown:
Yeah. So so you're you're you're secured there. So only the power port is accessible? Exactly. Right. So you don't run the risk of connecting this via data. And now the new versions will be in full black and full orange. So looking forward to seeing how they're received.
[01:05:25] Unknown:
Yeah. I've heard a lot of people who have actually helped them as well and been like, yeah. This is really premium. Like, really, really nice. So that's good to see because I've always had a bit of a problem with plastic. All this 3 d printing stuff, It's like, yeah. Okay. It's kinda cool, but it's also kind of shit. Sorry to anyone who's printing it and making it, but Mhmm. I never, like, have that in my hand and go, oh, this is nice.
[01:05:47] Unknown:
Metal for the win. That's a big, big step up. And I mean, I've I've heard this from a lot of people, especially I mean, if you're a tinkerer and if you build it yourself, like, you kind of Know the value of the product, and and you don't really put that much weight into the feel and the aesthetic. But if you're a user that and you Just wanna wants things to work and and have a great experience with the whole thing. Getting a 3 d printed case into your hands, it's not like the most Trustworthy feel and and first impression. Mhmm. And this, obviously, completely flips that. And, yeah, but also just Just playing around with it and using it is so much fun. Even if this were not, like, sold on my website, I personally was absolutely blown away by the work This guy, Exima Street, who also, sells these on on his website. So that's, monerotime.com.
I think it's dotcom. But, as a caveat, you can only pay with Monero. So, samurai guys, you gotta get those swaps functioning quickly.
[01:06:52] Unknown:
Cool. Is that the, entire list? Are we done?
[01:06:56] Unknown:
That was it. That was a good one, guys. Absolutely.
[01:07:00] Unknown:
Clean. We're getting quite good at this, aren't we?
[01:07:03] Unknown:
Should be by now if I had enough practice.
[01:07:07] Unknown:
Alright. Cool. Nice. Catch up with you both next month, if not before. Good way to start a new year.
[01:07:13] Unknown:
Absolutely.
[01:07:14] Unknown:
That's fun. See you, fellas.
Bitcoin is close to becoming worthless. Now what's the Bitcoin? Bitcoin's like rat poison. Shit. Oh. The greatest scam in history. Let's get it. Bitcoin will go to fucking 0.
[00:00:42] Unknown:
Alright, you ungovernable misfits. I'm your host, Max. Everybody knows that Bitcoin is useless, worthless, and doomed to fail. But what if everyone's wrong? What if it's the system that is doomed to fail? Join me, as I speak to some of the brightest people in the space, and Sliver to the deepest, darkest depths of the Bitcoin rabbit hole. Welcome back. Today's episode of Bitcoin Monthly is recorded with Bitcoin q and a and Antimus. We do it every month, and we do this so that you don't have to spend hours every day searching through all the updates In the Bitcoin and open source world, we do our best to filter out all the noise and get to the signal.
But maybe there's a topic that you particularly want us to cover or you have questions on something that we cover in this episode. If you do, You can send us a boost on any of the podcasting 2.0 platforms, and we will cover it on the next show. Actually, we will probably cover it. If it's stupid or scammy or just nonsense, we won't cover And if you want your stats back, you can ask us. We might give them back. We might not. We might tell you to fuck off if it's scammy. Anyway, loads to cover in this episode, so we'll Crack on. Before we start, I wanna say thank you to Foundation Devices for sponsoring this show. We wouldn't be able to make it without them, And I appreciate that they sponsored this show despite knowing that I would show their product to friends and family and listeners anyway.
It really is the Best hardware out there. It's fully open source. It has the best team in the Bitcoin world, And they're doing everything that they can to keep you safe and secure. QR scanning is piss It's easy with this thing. Envoy, their companion app is beautiful, and the new UTXO management tool is amazing. We cover some of this in this show, so I won't bang on too much. But if you haven't already checked them out, you need to go to foundation devices dotcom. I've put a link at the bottom of the show notes, but you can use the code Ungovernable if you do decide to buy one. You'll get 3 months of IV pnusage for free. Foundation devices.com.
Finally, if you want the best Bitcoin node out there, again, fully open source and with the best team in the space. Go to roninddojo.com. I've put a link in the show notes. You can use the code Ungovernable. If you decide to buy one of their Tantos Or Tanto twos. You will get a discount, and I will get a few sats as a thank you for mentioning them. Everyone's a winner. Enjoy the
[00:03:45] Unknown:
show.
[00:03:49] Unknown:
Oh, here's his beautiful voice. Hey. Hey.
[00:03:52] Unknown:
Can you, Mike? Can you hear me? Oh, yes.
[00:03:57] Unknown:
Wow. Wow. You sound really nice, mate. A new year, a new voice. A new you. How do you feel about it? Now you're a real man. We can hear you.
[00:04:07] Unknown:
Exactly. I've just come up real close and just groan a bit. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:04:13] Unknown:
That's for the ladies out there. Exactly. What are you recording on? Now a blue,
[00:04:18] Unknown:
the one you recommended. Yeah. So it's a Yeti blue, and it's, it's wonderful. I mean, it's still Mhmm. Still on the stand. I haven't got the arm out yet. Don't get it. Yeah. I hate the arms. This shit. Yeah. I hate them. Okay. Okay.
[00:04:33] Unknown:
When you use the arm, which I'm using now, you swing it across, and you're like, oh, this is gonna go right in front of my face, exactly where it's supposed to be. Yeah. But the problem is, when you do that, it's directly in front of the screen, which is also supposed to be in front of your face so that you can see the screen. So now as I look at our Bitcoin monthly show notes, All I can see is a fucking microphone. So just consider that
[00:04:57] Unknown:
before you buy one. It's really annoying. You have to sort of peer around stuff to see. Yeah. I get that. The issue is that I've if you've got, like, notes here, the mic's standing where I'm supposed to be writing. Right? And I've got it, like, kinda leading down so that I I'm not too far away from the mic, and I wanna sound like this. You need, like, a minion to stand on the side, I hold it to you when you write notes. They take it away again. That's it. Thank you. Yeah. Boys, how have you been doing? Been doing pretty well. Yeah. Christmas came and went. Fairly uneventful.
[00:05:28] Unknown:
Didn't catch COVID like the rest of the world, which is a plus. Mhmm. Everybody that I know seems to be ill in some, Shape or form, I managed to, survive it unscathed even though everybody in the household was on their deathbed. So by not having the jabs, I've, got that pure blood in me that's, I can now take on the world.
[00:05:48] Unknown:
And you had to look after everyone else, I assume, by Christmas then. Yep. Yeah.
[00:05:53] Unknown:
So that's been a thing in the UK,
[00:05:55] Unknown:
COVID? Apparently. Yeah. Everyone in my family had it as well. I don't know whether it's COVID because I refuse to let my family test, but that sort of symptoms anyway. Okay. Same in my household. Our family Christmas was canceled Sold on one side of the family. Oh. And then we had another cancellation, and it's because people were flapping around and testing and Boomer stuff. Very frustrating. But outside of them, we had a lovely Christmas in my house. It was very nice. None of us were sick. We're all pure bloods. Pure buzz around here. Had a great Christmas. Apes are too much. My little one can't stop saying bulking right.
So They just walk into any room and see any protein shaker or any food and just go, Bulking. Oh, amazing. And that was what Christmas was about. What about you, Antimus?
[00:06:48] Unknown:
Yeah. Well, this year was really relaxed, really slow. That was amazing. Like, the last years because I've got a pretty, like, spread out Family, together with my missus. So, the over the last couple of years, there's been a lot of traveling and going backwards or forwards and the Split up and so on. So this year, we just kind of retracted from all of that and and just, had a really solitary Holidays, and that was absolutely beautiful. So, yeah, we got a puppy, and, so that's Oh. That was wonderful to have a bit of time with I'll be in there because the the the last 2 months have been pretty tough getting her up to speed, but, everything's wonderful now. Can we do some puppy news? Yeah. I was gonna say I need some puppy pictures when we get off, the recording. Let's just, yeah, know a little bit about the puppy, how old, Well, Breton docks too hard, but it'd be nice to know. No. No. She's fine.
Labrador, And she's now 17 weeks. I just have, 4 months. And, yeah. I mean, we've got it with, like, 8 weeks something, 7, 8 weeks. So at the beginning, I would see a lot of wiping and a lot of, And it just eats everything fucking hell. So, yeah, I stayed there from near death a few times. Exactly.
[00:08:09] Unknown:
By the way, anybody that tells you getting a puppy is preparation for having kids is a barefaced liar. Yeah. Ignore everything they have to say. I bet.
[00:08:18] Unknown:
Yeah.
[00:08:19] Unknown:
Yeah. I can confirm. I thought when I had a dog, I was like, fucking hell. This is So much harder. My life is so much harder now. Like, I've gotta think about this other thing and can't just go out and not come back. And, oh, it's really tough. No. No. Treasure these moments.
[00:08:38] Unknown:
Yeah. No. It is absolute I mean, and now it's amazing. I mean, obviously, the 1st few weeks when it's I'm just a little sleep and and all that kind of stuff. But, I mean, that goes over so fast. I mean, Doug, I mean, You you kind of notice how fucking slow human evolve. Like, it's like they'll keep Yeah. Fucking hell up. Like, it takes ages. Like, it's so vulnerable and helpless. Mhmm. I mean, these these little ones, I mean, you're out of it in, like, 2, 3 weeks. I mean, such. It's fine. Yeah. And now now it's a proper little dog, man. That's wonderful. Love it. In other news, the ETF came and pumped all of our Bags, and we've all retired now like Bitcoin Twitter said we were going to. Oh, wait.
[00:09:21] Unknown:
Oh, shit. I better send that boat back quick. Shit. Sell the yacht. Yeah. Good job I kept the receipt. Exactly.
[00:09:34] Unknown:
Oh, man. There was, like, one day where it pumped, and then, like, literally a day later, they're like, oh, fuck. It's ended. It's over. And then Jamie Dimon came on and was like, a well, I don't know. I have to confirm this with you guys whether this is possible. Apparently, Satoshi can just come back, and then he'll just delete all the Bitcoins. Is that right? That's what he said on CNBC.
[00:09:56] Unknown:
He's got god mode. He can, he can just come in and do what he wants. Yeah. Why has no one checked this? I wouldn't have got involved if I'd have known this. He'd just come back and delete it. If only it was open source. That would be good, wouldn't it? I didn't have many texts, to be honest with you. But for anybody that the few people that I have tried to Orange Pill and that did, get over the line. I always say if they do come back to me and they're like, yeah. Oh, it's going down. I'm just like, yeah. If you ever wanna sell, you know where to come.
[00:10:20] Unknown:
Well, not you. Because I keep trying to sell mine to you. You won't
[00:10:24] Unknown:
Wow. You're tainted.
[00:10:29] Unknown:
Oh, man. Yeah. I was I was kind of expecting, like, sell the news event, but not even that happened. I mean, it was just absolutely, like, anticlimactic,
[00:10:37] Unknown:
the whole thing. I was actually looking for Cheap sats after that. The best thing about the whole situation was the fact that the SEC completely botched the announcement. That was good to be fair. Beautiful. Just that was just a wild timeline that you just It instills confidence, doesn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. These people are there to protect Gee, from money launderers and criminals, and they can't even send a fucking tweet on the right day.
[00:11:04] Unknown:
Or update a website.
[00:11:05] Unknown:
Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah. The website went down the shop. Wasn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. And they didn't have, 2FA. Right? That was the issue.
[00:11:14] Unknown:
Apparently so. Well, I I I call bullshit that they got hacked. Really? Mhmm. You think they tweeted it out And then It's just too convenient. Yeah. They had it queued up for for the wrong day, and one of the interns did it wrong. They had to press the send button too early, or they just queued it for the wrong day It's my opinion. Maybe. I know Elon's come out and corroborated their story that they didn't have 2FA and they got hacked and stuff, but, You know, slip him some, Dogecoin, and he'll say anything.
[00:11:45] Unknown:
Or was it Elon? I've heard that one going around as well. I did actually
[00:11:49] Unknown:
say yeah. The fir the first comment we were talking about it in the work chat, and, that was my first comment was that I got, like, a a a little imagination thought here that Elon sat in his man cave in his fancy house in his underpants drinking beer just abusing Twitter god mode. Just fucking with the SEC.
[00:12:06] Unknown:
Because he did tell them to fuck off. Oh, did he? Yeah. I can't remember the exact phrasing, but in so many words, he told them to fuck off. Oh, yeah. Because of, like, the Tesla stuff. Right? I mean, because the the SSC was, like, investigating him and stuff like that. It was either fuck off or, like, they can suck my dick or they can Fuck off. It was something along those lines. Nice. The sort of thing you can do if you're Ironman. You can just say shit like that.
[00:12:32] Unknown:
Yeah. When you literally do have god mode. Mhmm. Alright. Antimus, take it away, mate. Yeah.
[00:12:39] Unknown:
Got quite a list. Thanks, Q, for for putting this together. So we've got, first of all, Sparrow Wallet v 1.8.2. So we've got some Some improvements here on on, like, labels and the transactions, and also a more visible effective fee rate, like a Statement, which is quite cool. So when you do, like, CPFP, like child pays for parent, you have to bump the fee. Right? So Both transactions together have an effective fee rate, which is now displayed more visibly, beforehand, or you'd have to go Going with the tooltip to to get that info. So there's some, like, minor improvements there. As always with Craig, there are quite a few things bundled up in these These updates, I don't know if anything else jumped out to you guys.
[00:13:26] Unknown:
Well, first off, he got it in by the skin of his teeth. I I messaged him yesterday that we're recording tomorrow and we've got nothing to talk about. So he's like, shit. Alright. Let me cobble something together. And this is what he came out with. So fair play. Not bad for that. Yeah. It could work. Yeah. The CPFP thing, is very cool with the effective fee rate because with the frothy mempool that we've had over the last 6 months, I've had a few messages from people that have kinda got caught out by doing Child Pays for Parent and not fully understanding kind of how it works and the fact that 9 times out of 10, you have to increase the fee rate quite drastically to pay for the parent transaction. Whereas some people get caught in the trap of they just bump it up a little bit thinking, well, you know, if I did 10 sats per byte before and now I do 15, and that's what Mempool says, then like you said, Antomous, that doesn't mean that the effective fee rate is the new one that you applied. It has to be much higher than that to carry the weight of the previous transaction. So being able to see that in Sparrow now before you hit the big red button to send it and commit is gonna save people of headaches, which is a good thing and, obviously, well thought out by Mr. Raw as well. The only other one from this release is that you can now reorder the outputs of a transaction, which will make no difference to the 99% of normal Bitcoin users.
Apparently, this is important for the ordinals, degens. 1 of the or the counting method that they do to kind of order their satoshis It's like a a first in, first out ordering system. And if you just kind of use a wallet like Sparrow or any other wallet just to blindly make a transaction, and it doesn't order them in the way that this Stupid ordinals framework says you can inadvertently send your yes, theory. Thank you. You can inadvertently send your, Quote, unquote, rare sat or whatever crap it is that's buried within the transaction to somebody else. And then, you know, as with Bitcoin, once it's gone, it's gone. So, it's not Specifically, like an ordinal support with Inspire or anything like that. It's just a case of if I've got 3 outputs to a transaction, I can choose which one goes in 0, 1, and 2 positions.
[00:15:29] Unknown:
Just going back to the chart paper preparing bit, what's the benefit of using that rather than RBF or Vice versa. I'm pretty sure I saw something the other day, which I didn't fully read. I just scanned it where it was saying something to do with privacy concerned with Child pays for parent, and RBF is gives less away or doesn't link other UTXOs.
[00:15:50] Unknown:
It depends a bit on on in what position you are. Right? So if you send coins to me, then you can only do RBF, and I can only do child pays per for parent, right, because I've got the output and you have the And you had the inputs. Right? But, obviously, if it's a self spend, you could do both. So if you wanna mimic That you're spending the coins, then you'd want to do child pays for parent. Although, no, at the end of the day, that doesn't matter. Right? Because it could still be both. So I I don't quite see the the privacy point. Maybe q there, but otherwise, it's just, like, the the depending on in what position you are. Right? Yeah.
[00:16:29] Unknown:
To my knowledge, the only privacy thing is with RBF, you can include additional inputs when you replace the transaction. And if you don't have a a say on what inputs are used, then obviously, you might be adding additional inputs to the transaction that are not desirable.
[00:16:44] Unknown:
Yeah. I think that was the point. I suppose if you're not labeling or you're you're using something, then that links. Yeah. Okay. So there's that As a plus point, I guess, for child pays for parent, but the flip side to that is
[00:16:57] Unknown:
doing child pays for parent versus RBF. There's 2 transactions with CPFP, so it's gonna cost you a lot more. And like I said before, you need to really jack up that fee rate. So, you know, to complete that, it costs a lot more Versus just replacing one transaction with another that then posts a higher fee rate. So there's trade offs to both. But that depends
[00:17:16] Unknown:
on Unless I'm I'm mistaken, but with child pays for parent, it only costs a lot more to bump the fee if you had multiple inputs with the Charles transaction. Right? Because that would increase the the weight. If you had just, like, one input, one output on the first transaction, Then it wouldn't take that much to bump it. But the second one, obviously, is just one input, one output. So the weight would be a lot Lower with the second one, so you'd have to bump it higher. Right? Or am I?
[00:17:45] Unknown:
Yeah. I think you're going down the right lines. It does the the the the Way in which you need to kind of bump the the fee does grow with the size of the transaction in terms of inputs, outputs, and signatures and stuff. So, yeah, you're right. But it that the the point of sale is still more expensive even in the most simplistic of transactions compared to r RBF. I had a situation now where I caught myself,
[00:18:05] Unknown:
with Wanting to do, child pays for parent, I had to do a a large transaction and, wanted to merge from different wallets Into one wallet and then do a large transaction. So I sent over some some coins from another wallet to the spending wallet and lowballed the fee because I knew I was gonna pass it on anyway, so, I could do child pays for the parent. The issue was I put in such a low fee that it didn't even show up in the in the mempools. And the issue is with it was on a a BTC pay server, and there it was showed as spent, so I can't respend it. And in the other one, it doesn't show show up, so that took quite a while to to get that undone.
[00:18:44] Unknown:
What did you do in that scenario there? Did you just wait until the fees dropped Then it got rebroadcast.
[00:18:50] Unknown:
Now I had to recover the wallet in a different wallet because it wasn't possible to do that out of, in my b two c pay server, it was from a lightning on chain wallet I was spending out. And inside RTL, it wasn't possible to rebroadcast. So I had to recover that wallet in a different wallet and then rebroadcast,
[00:19:11] Unknown:
and that worked. Was it blue wallet by any chance that it used for recovery? Yes. I was gonna say because there's not that many wallets outside of LND that support that c type because they don't use BIP 39, do they? Yeah. Yeah. Cool. Good to know. Wow. So that's a good segue. Right? Look at that. You see? What a Such a pro. It's that pure blood, isn't it? Exactly. Firing on all cylinders this morning, guys.
[00:19:36] Unknown:
Just as well, didn't do it in the evening. So we've got 2 releases actually here. So this is v 6.4.1215. And in the first, we've got a new tool to generate the last, mnemonic word. So if you draw your words out of a hat or or however you wanna do that with Chips or something like that. You can do this and then generate your 12th or 24th word within BlueWallet, which is definitely a cool feature. And then in the second release, we've also got and this is, pretty disturbing. I don't know if this, also, like, affects other projects, but they've removed Tor support. So, yeah. The and this is due to A dependency they've been using has not been maintained for a year or so. So they've deemed this insecure or not compatible anymore, And this is especially with, their framework, UI framework, which is, like, React Native so that they can use this on all different platforms.
And, yeah, I don't know how many other wallets use this this framework,
[00:20:44] Unknown:
the React Native, and have the same issue. But they have definitely said, we'll Taking out Tor support, and people should use it with the Orbot. Which is the worst app in the world. Yeah. I hate Orbot. I fucking hate Orbot. It is so shit. The fact that Blue Wallet have removed Tor from the app, although it sounds bad, like, it there's probably no change for the end user because it never fucking worked anyway. So I can kinda see why they would take that out and just have one less thing to worry about. But, you know, it's not great for, know, if you're a blue wallet user and you wanna talk to your, your node when you're not home, then you've gotta go through some hoops. You either gotta deal with the headaches of all bot, which I wouldn't even wish that on my worst enemy. Or, you know, set up a a tails girl side of things, which then massively raises the barriers to entry because not everybody's gonna be comfortable in setting that So if you're looking for an alternative, envoy.
[00:21:35] Unknown:
Don't worry. We'll get onto the shill.
[00:21:37] Unknown:
Shill. Oh, nice. Nice. Shill. Alert. Starting the year strong. I like it.
[00:21:46] Unknown:
It's all not working in blue wallet. Is that something to do with their implementation or how they're setting it up? Or is that just something with tool generally that it's just very unreliable? Because when you say it never works, it's not changing anything because it never works. It works in Envoy for me. Not always, but It does work. Like, you know, I was contacted you the other day. I was, oh, I'm trying to send this payment. It's not fucking connecting. It's not working. And I had to refresh and fuck around and Do it a couple of times, and then it worked. And that's, for me, a trade off that I'm willing to take. I'm like, it's not often I have to send a payment. Like, oh, it has to go this second. It's like if it takes me another 5 minutes, I'm like,
[00:22:28] Unknown:
I'm okay with that. Yeah. I sounded a little bit harsh before. Tor on mobile is difficult. I've never used a mobile wallet That has Tor built in and never not had a problem at some point. Every single one I've used has faces different challenges. The 1 Bit Blue Wallet is, as Antrima said, they they use a React Native to kind of as a framework to build their app. The Tor Library that they use that's compatible with React Native is not maintained and clearly didn't work very well. So reading comments on GitHub by one of the the main devs, Basically, they've just taken it out because it didn't work, and they're looking for an alternative.
[00:23:04] Unknown:
Fine. So it it is to do with how they've implemented it. Because both with Phoenix and with Envoy, it's not always perfect, but it's pretty good and usable. And so, like, I never understand this thing where people are like, oh, I just can't be bothered. With you, with your tail scale and stuff like that, like, okay, fine if you found a workaround. But A lot of people who are just like, I'm not gonna bother because Tor's too unstable. It's like, I don't personally experience that. Maybe that's me being lucky, but it's a bit shit, but it's workable.
[00:23:32] Unknown:
Yeah. It's, sadly, it's just,
[00:23:34] Unknown:
for the BlueBot situation that there isn't another alternative that they can look to that's compatible with their current App architecture, I guess. I'm not sure of any apps or other apps that use React Native, to be honest. Yeah. Like Zeus or something like that. I I mean, these are all also projects that that run on all sorts of different, platforms. I mean, that's one of the main benefits of using React Native. Right? What I understand is that you can very easily
[00:23:59] Unknown:
create your app and then deploy it for Android and macOS and for iOS and all this kind of stuff. Right? Yeah. Absolutely. You mentioned Zeus, actually. I just quickly checked, and it does that is, it's built on TypeScript and React Native. So Not sure what they're using under the hood, but, maybe the blue whale guys could see what going on on the Zeus side of things.
[00:24:19] Unknown:
Robosats, this is a big release On their side, great new features, that's been on the robot for a while. It's a horrible name in my opinion, but It's introducing the Robosats Federation. I was bracing myself for what was gonna come now, but It's not a new organization, that's been set up. This is their attempt to decentralize the whole Ecosystem, so you can now set up your own coordinator or multiple coordinators can exist In parallel and as a user, you can choose which one you wanna sign up for. So this is definitely great to see. To stabilize this, project and make it more resistant against, outside attacks.
Obviously, as a user, you should, watch out because It doesn't matter which one you choose. The the coordinator always has the power to steal funds from you. So, this is It that's one of the reasons why it's important to have multiple coordinators, so you don't have to trust one of them. But this is definitely interesting to see how this will, evolve and and shake out in the long term.
[00:25:31] Unknown:
Yes. I think there is a Reputation system for these new coordinators that come online as well. So whilst you are absolutely correct that, you know, one could go rogue and steal from you mid trade, The idea being that, obviously, if they did that, they'd quickly gain a terrible reputation and then cannibalize their own revenue stream. But, yeah, this is great to see the option to have multiple Different coordinators up there, all crucially within a single order book, so it's not like you need to know the onion addresses for all our different coordinators. Like, they're all visible from within the same master order book. One unanswered question I have here, and maybe you can answer it, Anthemas, is while it's great that we're decentralizing the coordinators, and we have multiple options, and hopefully we get to a stage Somewhere down the line where this is lucrative enough that there's enough of an incentive that we get 100 of these. If they're all coming into a single order book, Then if I was a 3 letter agency, wouldn't that order book just be the main target then? Because if I take that down, then nobody else can Discover that there's a 100 coordinators.
I know that's kinda hand waving. That probably is not an easy thing to do, especially if it's been hosted over Tor, but it still seems like there is a little bit of a Single point of failure or single point of attack at least? Yeah. That's the main difference, right, to Bisk because there you've got your your client server on on your machine At home, and they can connect directly here. You've got it running
[00:26:49] Unknown:
via this one website. Right?
[00:26:51] Unknown:
Are they partly thinking liquidity is relatively Small on Robosats as far as I understand it, and maybe they're thinking, well, we can adapt if things change, if we grow to a certain size because, Presumably, a 3 letter agency is gonna put their resources on something bigger first, I'd imagine. I don't know. I don't know how they think, but that may be part of it. They're definitely taking steps.
[00:27:17] Unknown:
And I think that the big 1 was decentralizing the coordinator, and I would imagine that the next step would also be to have multiple endpoints from which to to access the order book so that that's not dependent on this one access point. But I I haven't seen that vocalized by them, but that's definitely a good point.
[00:27:39] Unknown:
They might not vocalize it because that might put more of a target or whatever. But I just think Maybe if I was in that position, I'd be looking and going, this is probably okay as a trade off for now, but maybe on the road map, there's something different.
[00:27:53] Unknown:
Possible. Yeah. And I I don't wanna come across as as alarmist. You know? This is native to Tor, and it's nontrivial to try and take down an unknown onion address. Some dot net markets survive for years years years. Like, it's it's not an easy thing to do. So I don't wanna come off as, like, pooh pooh ing, you know, what they're doing here because this is absolutely a fantastic Step in the right direction and, you know, love to see what they're doing. So maybe I'll try and get an answer to it. I'll hop into the Robosatz Telegram group and just see if there's,
[00:28:20] Unknown:
There might just be a a simple answer to it, and I'm just being an idiot, but we'll see. And maybe it's even possible to do that. Right? I mean, I don't know how they get all the different Data from the different coordinators to bundle that up into this one order book. But, I mean, it's all open source. Is it, like, Via some kind of API system that you could just pull this data, and I could set up a website and just pull that data and create my own or order book.
[00:28:46] Unknown:
So I think I may have just answered my own question just been reading one of the links. I think that each new coordinator that comes on also hosts The whole thing as well. So they Oh, shit. Okay. So I'll read it verbatim here. Decentralized instances. The new version brings the power of decentralization to Robosats. By sporting new instances, we increase the robustness of the platform. In order to fully stop the peer to peer market of Robosats, every single instance must be stopped. So what I glean from that is that each coordinator is the host for the whole order book, not just their own orders. Mhmm. Okay. Or their own economic liquidity, so to speak. Yeah. Nice. Very nice. Good work. Boom.
[00:29:29] Unknown:
Right. Next on the list, we've got Foundation Passport, firmware v 2.2.0, and Envoy v 1.5.0. These were both released Beginning of January, if I'm not mistaken?
[00:29:42] Unknown:
Yes, sir. No. I think, late December, but definitely after we last recorded. The Envoy side of things, I won't go into full details because we basically covered it last time because the beta was out. So all of that info's covered within there, but the headlines are full tap group support for mobile wallets. We've now got a full Spanish translation, and then the rest of it was kinda quality of life sorts of things. So, Yeah. Go check it out. On the passport side of things, release 2.2.0, the main headliners were if you're signing a larger transaction, Larger in terms of data, so it might be a multisig transaction or just a single sig with a shit ton of inputs. We will automatically detect that as soon as you Start to scan the the PSBT from Sparrow, Envoy, Nunchuk, whatever it is, and just say, hey, by the way, this is a very large transaction. Do you want to Sign it via micro SD card instead because it might be quicker. You can then say yes or no, and then you know, obviously, if you say yes, you'll be switched into the micro SD card sign in flow. If not, then you'll just continue with the QR code scanning flow, and it'll just continue to read all of those inputs.
It only triggers you know, you'll only see this when you are Signing very large transactions, but it's just to give you that option to say, hey. You know, it might be quicker to do this via a micro SD card. And once you've signed the transaction, You can also let's say you did it with QR codes. You can then once it's signed, the passport is displaying the signed PSPT on screen via QR codes. You can now save that to a micro SD card if you want to kind of keep it and broadcast it later. If you're away from a coordinator or something like that or or you haven't got Internet connection, You can just save that signed PSBT to a micro SD card and keep it for broadcast later. And the flip side is also true that if you are signing via the micro SD flow and then you're like, you know what? I wanna pass this back to the coordinator via QR codes, then you can go back the other way as well. And the final, headline is that we now Support restoring seed QR seeds. So both formats, compact and normal. So you can now rather than having to type the words in to restore an existing wallet within Passport, you can now just scan a QR code if you've got one of those already backed up. Hell, yes.
[00:31:48] Unknown:
Be cool if someone made some, like, nice plates or something for that.
[00:31:54] Unknown:
That's wonderful to see. That's definitely something on my to do list To to get that checked out.
[00:31:59] Unknown:
Do you know what I've been really enjoying with the passport? It's basic, but I really like it. It's just being able to check addresses. I know that's simple, but sometimes when I'm putting in passphrase, and then I'm like, oh, have I actually put the right one in? Am I actually using the right passphrase here Before I send or do a self spend, just being able to scan a QR with the passport and confirm, yes, you are actually sending where you want be sending, you're not fucking yourself over here, is a really nice little feature. Yeah. Literally, for me, one of the best parts of a QR code based signer is Just scanning a QR code and being sure that it is one of yours, be it a receiver or a change address before you go and do a big transaction, just to get that peace of mind is worth its weight in gold. It saves a lot of concern. You know, for example, if you haven't written down is it fingerprint you call it? Like, when you enter a new passphrase in and then it gives you So, you know, if you haven't written that down or you're not sure it's right and then you're gonna do a larger spend, just being able to check that, it really It takes, like, one second to do it, and you're like, oh, okay. We're fine. That is really nice.
[00:33:07] Unknown:
So just to build on top of that, we've just started Quality assurance testing on 2.3.0, which should be out by the time that we record next time. We've got a full address explorer as well. So if If you, for whatever reason, don't want to or don't like to do the the verify QR code scan we've just been talking about, you can also go in and now view addresses By the account. So you can see a list of addresses that are controlled by the various accounts that you've got added to passport. You can view them 1 by 1, skip By 10 at a time, if you've you know, you're looking for, like, index 670 or something stupid like that, and then you can also view a QR code version of each and every address as well. So technically speaking, you could, if you wanted to, and I don't advise this, use passport Without a coordinator to receive only if you wanted to. Obviously, there's lots of caveats there that you obviously, Passport doesn't know the state of the blockchain and and the wallet itself, so doesn't know whether addresses have been reused or not. So that's one of the main reasons why I say I don't advise this. But, yeah, Address Explorer, very cool feature, especially if you're, like, you're Looking for, like, a a a specific address, a specific index so you can go and check on device for any of your accounts.
[00:34:17] Unknown:
One question I had to the signing with large transactions and the the micro SD card option, this was for passport. Right? So On your passport, when you start scanning, it will ask you if you wanna transfer via micro SD card.
[00:34:31] Unknown:
Yes. Only when it detects a really large transaction. So most people are never gonna see this unless you're, like, a a 3 or 5 multisig user or you're a miner and you've got hundreds of inputs and you're kind of, consolidating them all or something like that. Okay. But in Envoy,
[00:34:46] Unknown:
is that also detected? So when I set up a transaction, Envoy would already know, right, that this is a large transaction And that it could directly be transferred via micro SD card.
[00:34:57] Unknown:
We don't support micro SD card signing in Envoy yet, so everything is on the Passport side. So as soon as it reads the PSBT, doesn't matter where it comes from, could be Sparrow, Nunchuk, anything that we're compatible with, Passport will surface the morning. I understand. Right. Okay.
[00:35:12] Unknown:
Then next on the list, we have got Bitcoin Keeper v 1.1. 8, and this is, custom multisig. So now you can set up any m or n multisig you want And also coin selection, which is something we approve here. So that's that's great to see. Yeah. I think
[00:35:37] Unknown:
previously, they only had, like, specific plans. So you could you could set up a single sig, like just connect your passport, Or you could do a 2 or 3, which they gave them names. I think it was, like, the pleb plan and the money budget plan or something like that, and the latter being a 3 of 5. This release now basically means that you can go and do a a one of 3 or a 7 of 12 or something, whatever you've you know, you can make it fit your your specific use case If you wanted
[00:36:03] Unknown:
to. What's the open source status of Keeper at the moment? I I did not follow this, So now maybe I missed this, but they had that on the road map. Right?
[00:36:14] Unknown:
Yes. And I am frantically trying in the background to find an update because I don't know. Still not seeing any GitHub links on their website, so my gut feeling is it's still not open source.
[00:36:26] Unknown:
Well, Bitcoin Keeper, release, but this is on GitHub. Release fee 1.1.2.
[00:36:33] Unknown:
Found it?
[00:36:34] Unknown:
Yes. Oh, nice. Ah. It's a start. Oh, look. Built on React Native.
[00:36:41] Unknown:
Interesting. They've They have a tool yet. Oh, they have? I think so. But they use Whirlpool? So No. You can't connect to Whirlpool, over Clearnet. There is a Clearnet API. Oh, okay. Or or more. I'm looking for Yes. License. Here we go. Yeah. It's MIT. Oh. Good job, guys. Well done. Love to see it. Is there any clauses? Hang on. Nope. Shortly, MIT. Well done, guys. When did this happen?
[00:37:10] Unknown:
Cool.
[00:37:11] Unknown:
6 months ago, the license was updated.
[00:37:14] Unknown:
Oops. Missed that one. Cool.
[00:37:17] Unknown:
I believe the, Bitcoin keeper guys have just got a 2 Bitcoin bounty from HRF, border wallets. Did you see that? Oh,
[00:37:26] Unknown:
because they implemented it. I saw I saw the bounty that were we spoke about that a few months ago, right, when the the bounty was put out, but I didn't see that they got it. Looks like it's just been paid out. Yeah. Cool.
[00:37:37] Unknown:
Was it in Bitcoin keeper? Because don't because the the same team makes a couple of wallets. So I think it might have been in their other wallet.
[00:37:44] Unknown:
That could also be. I can see it's v 1.1.0. Pierce, we have also open sourced the code under the MIT license, and that was on the 1st August 2023.
[00:37:55] Unknown:
Yeah. Oh, but then for being behind.
[00:37:58] Unknown:
Nice. Because that was always my well, the the one hold back I had with that. I mean, they do it, and the Max does do amazing job, and the the UI is great. It all looks cool, and they're doing the right stuff. But it was always like, oof, don't really wanna trust this with live funds or recommend it to people, Not being open source, but, I mean, now it's been open for for 6 months. Love to see it. We've got also Phoenix wallets for iOS fee 2.1.0. They also support the request inbound liquidity feature. I'm not a 100% sure if this was now just an update for the iOS Versions and it was also already implemented beforehand?
You are correct. Okay. So this way around. Yeah. I mean, the the request inbound liquidity feature is wonderful. I think I saw this the first time in, like, November or something. November, December. I don't know. This is coming up. Do you wanna give a recap for the listeners as in what it is and why it's cool? Well, for those of you who want to or who receive a lot of lightning transactions, this is a great feature to have because, obviously, it's a one-sided liquidity stream. So you've got the Sats always coming coming in from your your channel Partner, and at some point, the channel is gonna be empty. So you'll have to rebalance if you can or set up new channels, especially in a high fee environment. This can be very costly.
Phoenix is now offers a new feature that you can plan ahead and request A certain amount of inbound liquidity for a certain amount of time, and they'll set that aside for you. And you're paying a small fee, but it's it's Very minor.
[00:39:31] Unknown:
What's small?
[00:39:33] Unknown:
Don't have the exact numbers in here, but I remember Sorry. I stepped away for 10 seconds. What was the question? Of, like, how high the fees are for the liquidity provided, but I remember that it was pretty low. But at the at the end of the day, it's a great way to secure your inbound liquidity For a relatively low price without having to set up new channels and rebalance and and splice your way out of it. Yeah. Especially for those of you who are selling products Via lightning or just, receiving your salary or getting donations or whatever. If you've if you've got a lot of Inbound liquidity coming in, and you're not sending a lot of it out via lightning. This is a great way to kind of cover your risk of future high fees.
[00:40:16] Unknown:
With, explaining that you're incentivized here to do one big receive to open a large channel and pay a single fee So that you can you know, if you then wanna receive any further over and above that in the future after you've spent some down, it doesn't result in additional splice, Which is essentially an on chain transaction, which is then the fees are passed on to you. So if you make one big fee from the outset, you can save yourself quite a lot in the long run if you plan to to use Phoenix long term and to do lots of payments in and out with it. In the short amount of time, I couldn't find the the exact numbers on the cost for the liquidity.
[00:40:53] Unknown:
It's 1%.
[00:40:55] Unknown:
Oh, that's alright.
[00:40:57] Unknown:
There we go. Samurai Dojo v 1.22.0 new API endpoint. So this is just an option to be able to check your Addresses and if they've been used before and exclusion of incompatible clients. I don't have more information on that. I don't know, exactly what that is. That's why I included this.
[00:41:18] Unknown:
Render.
[00:41:21] Unknown:
Yeah. Yeah. And I think Max has got a great couple of podcasts you wanna deep dive onto this, but, basically, there's a a fork of Bitcoin Core maintained by Luke g dash junior dasher called Bitcoin Knots, which is also used or one of the options within the Ocean Mining Pool. Anybody that runs that Knots Client, it has certain restrictions that limit op return data or the size of it, which makes a lot of privacy preserving spends that are common within the samurai wallet ecosystem. They won't be relayed by those Knots nodes because Knots sees them as Spam or whatever you wanna call it, and it it won't relay them. So if you're a Dojo user, it makes absolutely zero sense to have any peers that are running not because When you send the transaction, the knot's peer will not relay it. So this update with Dojo basically just cuts all of the knot's clients and makes them, You know, not able to talk to Dojo Software. Yeah. I mean, that whole
[00:42:17] Unknown:
saga, right, has been quite a a large, topic. The the last time we spoke, That hadn't all gone down. Right? It's the first time we're on air with all those developments.
[00:42:28] Unknown:
Yeah. Max did a a great couple of podcasts and and Twitter livestreams to cover it. But, yeah, I I think this makes from the Dojo perspective, this makes perfect sense. People are there's a few people screaming censorship and whatnot, but it's It's literally like, well, why would I want a Bitcoin peer connected to my node that isn't gonna relay my transactions?
[00:42:46] Unknown:
Yeah. Just makes no sense. Mhmm. Dojo Koda broke it down really nicely on our call, which I then posted live on my feed as well. But, yeah, he goes into why, and I can't see any reason why you wouldn't do that. And, also, it's kind of not irrelevant, but not many people use Knots. It's like it's such a small percent of the network that the amount of times where this is actually gonna happen is is so minor. And it's a bit of a fuck you as well. It's like It's an important thing that they're working on, and Luke and his games are, fucking around with it unnecessarily
[00:43:22] Unknown:
as far as I can see. So yeah. That also will pass downstream to all Ronin Dojo users as well because, obviously, that Mhmm. Runs the Dojo software. So I think that's already been implemented by the Ronin team as well. Yeah. And with Ronin, they've come out with a new Whirlpool UI for those of you who've been using Ronin Dojo for a couple of years. Think it was about a year ago or 14, 16 months ago or something that they came out with the Ronin Dojo UI, which was a huge STEP and now also they've improved on this with their Whirlpool UI, which, just visualizes, all the work Whirlpool workflows directly from your dojo, so major boost there. Whirlpool unspent capacity, also Jumping over 10,000 Bitcoin, this was obviously going on during the drama.
I think no one could have scripted this one better. So, that was that was quite quite nice. They came out with a new s code to give a small fuck you. Was that filter this, wasn't it? Filter this. Yeah. 50% off. Lovely. That was beautiful. So that was that was sometime
[00:44:31] Unknown:
around Christmas. Right? I think it was New Year's Eve. Oh, New Year's Eve. Alright. It was when it when it tipped over 10,000. It was either Christmas Eve or New Year's Eve, but, yeah. Awesome to see. Massively vindicated for the team. Huge congratulations to everybody involved, and it's still going strong even after 10 k. I think we're up to 10 and a half k now.
[00:44:48] Unknown:
And you were right for a change?
[00:44:51] Unknown:
Yeah. The one call, well, I made 2 calls last year. One of them is still open. It's a bet with, O'Dell about Menpool's clearing. Currently, he's winning, unfortunately. I think I've got until the halving to lose that bet. Mhmm. And then the other one, I think I said it in March, Well, liquidity was about 6 and a half 1000 Bitcoin. I called, 10 k liquidity by the end of the year, and I got it By literally the skin of my teeth, I'm pretty sure it was New Year's Eve. Yeah. But that wasn't a bet with anyone. It was just an off the cuff comment to back to T Dev because T Dev Regularly, post updates about the liquidity, especially when it hits all time highs. And I just, off the cuff comment just said, you know, back in March, 10 k by end of year, and then I commented it on pretty much all of his updates after that just to drive the point home, and it seemed to manifest itself. I'm not saying that I had much to do with that with my, you are. You are. 3 times 100,000 sat UTXOs in Whirlpool. I was gonna say, how high are the interest rates on your loan for Yeah. I'm sweat I'm sweating a little bit. Yeah. But you're right. Just remember that.
That's the important point.
[00:45:58] Unknown:
So, next on the list, this is something that's potentially interesting, but I have not had time to look into this much Mercury layer. So this is a new proposal for a layer 2, which supposedly allows for self Custody and also transactions off chain. So this would be a competitor to Lightning and to, well, for those of They use it liquid, but I'm not sure how this works, technically. I mean, there's not been an actual wallet released or anything, it's it's more like of a toolkit, with dev kit for people to build on, but, I've not seen this discussed much yet. So, don't know if you can fill in on
[00:46:41] Unknown:
this. I'll read the TLDR from their website. Mercury layer is an implementation of a layer 2 state chain Kola enables off chain transfer and settlement of Bitcoin outputs that remain under the full custody of the owner at all times While benefiting from instant and zero cost transactions, the ability to perform this transfer without requiring confirmation, basically mining of on chain transactions has advantages in a variety of different applications. I've listened to a couple of podcasts on this, and it's very, very, very complex and tends to blow my brain About 10 minutes in, I think the TLDR is it's like you're provably transferring private keys. That's how you can do it off chain without Having, like, a double spend problem, how that works, I've got no clue. But if they can pull this off and it kinda gains some traction, then it could be a cool scaling solution.
[00:47:30] Unknown:
As always, if it sounds too good to be true like that little snippet did, there's almost always gonna be some trade offs buried somewhere. I just haven't found them yet. That sounds wild. Because I mean, transferring the private key bit, you're rolling the private key as well, so it's a different private key or Well, I don't know. Or, like, some kind somehow wrapping it in in some kind of encryption and
[00:47:52] Unknown:
alright. I mean, this Just to put it into perspective how complex It's like I just scroll down from the the little blurb that I've just read, and there's, like, code snippets, and I'll just read one out to you. It's o two brackets s 1 +0one equals s2+0. N LockTime equals s 1, r o, s 2, p. Like, it doesn't make any sense to the layman. Yeah. No. I can't. Yeah. Oh, you got that? Yeah. Yeah. You got all that? Cool. No. That's a reasonable trade off, actually. I like that. There we go. Alright. He's got the seal of approval for Max. Okay. Well, with all these, things, I mean, we probably can probably revisit this in a in a couple of years and see if something is Yeah. I was gonna say, yeah, give it 10 years. Mhmm. Yeah. Alright.
[00:48:33] Unknown:
Yeah. Well, we'll see who's around in 10 years, coming to the next topic with Ledger fucking up at the end of the year once more. Ledger Connect. Kit exploded.
[00:48:46] Unknown:
Wouldn't be a Bitcoin monthly without a Ledger fuck up, would it? Well, it's not our choice. Right? We we can choose.
[00:48:52] Unknown:
They're pushing themselves on us. Exactly. Yeah. So this is a good reminder why it's valuable to have Bitcoin only products, especially in the in the self custody space. So, here, Bitcoin users, were mostly protected, but their connect kit, which allowed For third party websites to connect back to, your ledger to do quick and convenient spends, there was some exploit, in that software, which led to, hacks and stolen funds within the by the crypto ecosystem. This was live for about 2 hours and was then patched, but still there's Quite a large amount of of funds which are stolen.
[00:49:39] Unknown:
The other thing that's worth mentioning here is I believe that it was to do with web applications. And when you're doing, like, signings of these complex smart contracts on various chains that are not Bitcoin, they're so complex that You can't communicate what's going on on the tiny USB stick screen that Ledger has. So, basically, Ledger just says, Do you want to take this action? Yes or no? And the user basically just has two choices. So they can't verify anything that's happening. So if there is an exploit like this, they can't pick it up. They can't catch it. And Clearly, the ledger didn't catch it for whatever reason. I don't I don't know with the the ins and outs of the of the hack, but, yeah, just another, notch in the bedpost of Legit screw ups this year. Brilliant.
[00:50:25] Unknown:
Oh, yeah. Yeah. On that topic, it's also I was, going I got a lot of attention at the end of the year as well, was, some reporting, from a NIM on Twitter, have not got the handle. I don't know if you can find it until I'm finished. But, they Reported or did a bit of digging in the Ledger Live app for, like, how much tracking they do. Fuck and hell. And this was, It's, brutal. I mean, at the end of the day, it's not that surprising that they track literally everything you do within the app, But that it even goes all the way to balances and, yeah, highly sensitive information that does not have Much to do with, like, usual analytics that, companies use to improve their product.
So this actually was High level surveillance, of their users, and, their response was Very meager. That was just very, very limited and just basically, like, yeah. Well, you've kind of opted into this way signing the terms of service, And that's it.
[00:51:38] Unknown:
There was so much tracking in in this that this guy found that it basically Ledger knows what you're thinking before you think it. That's a joke, by the way, just before somebody comes after me with a lawsuit.
[00:51:52] Unknown:
Well, I heard on, McCormack show the best thing to do is buy a ledger, get tracked and surveilled, and then send it into Wasabi to get tracked and surveilled If you have anything left after that to go and gamble it, is that true? Not financial advice.
[00:52:11] Unknown:
Yeah. Don't do that, guys.
[00:52:13] Unknown:
Don't listen to any of those adverts ever. Whatever's being advertised is going to rape you. Yeah. Looking forward to the next one. So
[00:52:24] Unknown:
I think this is, one of the last points, on the list. The EU has, come out with another provisional agreement to increase the level of, surveillance And, the limits on, transaction amounts, which are available to to us citizens of the EU, well, me and my people over here, not you, let's go Brexit.
[00:52:55] Unknown:
Presumably, we'll follow suit.
[00:52:58] Unknown:
It seems like we talk about this sort of stuff every single month, but Once again, it's just a reminder that the net is closing in. The arbitrary limits that they set that you can transact privately via cash, Bitcoin, debit card, whatever it is, are set. They're not set permanently. They will get smaller and smaller and smaller whilst they're continuing to inflate the money supply so that things cost more and more and more until till you can't buy a package of chewing gum without giving them your inside leg measurement. So Yeah. We need an alternative.
[00:53:27] Unknown:
Do you know of any guys?
[00:53:28] Unknown:
No. I'll let you know if I hear of anything.
[00:53:31] Unknown:
Okay.
[00:53:32] Unknown:
The one good thing is this is I mean, with the EU, If they've demonstrated one thing, everything takes ages. So this is a provisional agreement, and now this has to be discussed and presented to all the different member states and so on, and then they'll come together to formally agree on this. So this could even be Blocked or revised, and then even once it's formally agreed upon, usually, there's a lead time of multiple years until the member states have to implement this. So, yeah, this is not something that will happen in 2024. But As, yeah, you just mentioned, this is pretty much inevitable. This that this will come and much expected, and we've discussed this many times.
And it's just one one step on the way. So prepare accordingly. Yeah.
[00:54:29] Unknown:
Never more freedom for the subject. It's always less, always more surveillance. Good to see. Did anyone watch? I know it's a politician. I know we'll see what actually happens and what he actually does. But did you watch Millet's speech at the WEF conference.
[00:54:49] Unknown:
No. I've seen it linked and retweeted did that many times into it on Twitter that I I'm pulling up a stand now, and I just don't wanna watch it. I'm just sick of the sight of his face.
[00:54:59] Unknown:
Fine. I watched it for you. It is still a politician, and it's probably lying, and it's probably bullshit. But I'll say this. He did stand up in front of the WEF And literally tell them to go fuck themselves, that they are murderous leeches, that all the things that they're pushing are complete bullshit, shit, and then he backed it up with a lot of data and facts. I just thought whether he does what he says he's gonna do or not, It was quite enjoyable to see that, to see at the WEF someone literally talking about how disgusting they are, Why you have to have sound money, why you shouldn't have government at all, and anyone who is building and creating is a hero, and anyone who's trying to control them is a disgusting leech.
[00:55:46] Unknown:
Fair play. Fair play. Yeah. Exactly. Fair play. News flash for next month. Listeners, turn off now if you don't want a spoiler. Melee has been found in his bathtub with a hairdryer and sand.
[00:55:58] Unknown:
Exactly that. I shouldn't laugh, Look. I took a bet at work yesterday about this. It was how long until he gets suicided. Gets Epstein ed. Yeah. Mhmm. He's either gonna get Epstein ed, or He's gonna suddenly be found with a load of, like, pedo stuff on his hard drive. Yes. Be one of the 2. And then I decided it's actually not gonna be that. It's both. What will happen is he will be suicided and then to discredit everything that he said. Millet found in the bathtub, killed himself after. We found Pido stuff on his drive. What a disgusting man. This is why You can never have freedom, and you have to have socialism.
[00:56:38] Unknown:
And then everyone will go, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And that'll be it. Yep. I wouldn't take the over under on that bet. I think that's
[00:56:45] Unknown:
1 to 10. 1 to 10. I'm not bad.
[00:56:48] Unknown:
Oh, man. Oh, jeez. Did you I I didn't put it on the list, though. I I can't remember whether Whether I did or not, but did you guys see off the press this week that the samurai team have well, opened up their atomic swap to a public beta? No. Yes. So they've released the
[00:57:04] Unknown:
go back. You take it away.
[00:57:06] Unknown:
Well, you know more about it than me, I'm sure. But, basically, atomic swaps, Meaning that for your toxic change, where it gets to a point where it's too small to put in and mix again, where it's just Sat there and you're like, what the fuck do I do with this? You can then swap that into Monero with an atomic swap, and then you could collect as much of the Monero you wanted over time and then swap back out or spend it, whichever you wanted, which is a pretty big privacy gain. Cool to see.
[00:57:35] Unknown:
Yeah. Definitely. Just a point of clarification here. The app is a stand alone desktop application right now. I'm not sure what the end state is here, whether it's only gonna be a desktop app or whether this is, like, the testing ground before it gets moved into the wallet. I'm guessing it's the latter. But right now, if you wanted to Test, and it is, yeah, it's a it's a development based desktop UI just to get things, you know, test the the framework itself. But Love to see it. Looking forward to the usual crowd shouting, shitcoiner. But, yeah, this is a very, very useful tool, and like you say, perfect for for Doxygen. So,
[00:58:07] Unknown:
Once again, hats off, guys. Keep building. This is just a tool for the impatient, man. We just gotta wait for the 10 k, Paul.
[00:58:13] Unknown:
Yeah. I mean, the way the mempool's going, I can't see that happening.
[00:58:18] Unknown:
Yeah. You fucking shitcoiners. Anyone who actually uses Bitcoin And users of these tools will come across this problem. They'll be like, oh, what do I do with this? And and it would either sit in your wallet or you'll swap it out for Monero or you'll fuck yourself somehow and mix it by accident. So it is really useful. And then all the people who will attack People who actually use Bitcoin for doing this, either if you're using Monero or accepting Monero, they'll then attack you. And you're like, you're accepting fiat on your website. You keep calling that a shitcoin. So who's the biggest shitcoiner now? Yeah. And you're using wallet of Satoshi. Yeah. Exactly. I don't get that argument at all. I mean, I mean it's like this whole shit. At the end of the day, it's just use the tools. Right? And, I mean,
[00:59:03] Unknown:
do whatever you wanna do. Like, I I don't I don't really give a shit. Plus 1. Yeah. I mean, if if this serves a use case for people, go ahead. And, I mean, we spoke about this obviously with in regards to other projects as well. The the more different projects you incorporate and the more the the larger code base gets and all that kind of stuff, like, the larger the risk is for vulnerabilities and the the larger your dependency base gets. But, I mean, the adding one to the list Won't kill you, and I I mean, I'm not a developer, so I don't know exactly what the difference in code bases, from protocol side and and all that kind of stuff, like how much, has to be implemented there. You make a valid point about the increase
[00:59:46] Unknown:
in copaycess stuff. And just to be clear here, the way that this is Gonna work and state in summarize that there is no Monero wallet in there. You need an independent Monero wallet to receive too. And I guess that's probably one of the driving factors For them doing that is that they don't have that overhead then. Like, you have to just plug in a Monero address and say, like, send it here when you when the swap completes, Which is a wise thing to do because well, for the exact reason that you stated, Antimus. Takes out one step because at the moment, people are having to take that UTXO,
[01:00:13] Unknown:
Then send that to a swapping service, which is either centralized or, well, generally, they're centralized. And then you then have to get Changed for Monero and then sent to your own wallet. This just takes that out. And rather than it being a centralized entity doing it, You have this atomic swap where it either happens or it doesn't, and you don't get fucked, basically. So it is very useful. And then you're only doing it for I think most people would do something like they take their toxic change. If it's a larger amount, they'd put that larger amount back through the pool, And they keep doing that through all the different pools until they get to the smallest amount. And then you're like, oh, what do I do with the smallest amount? With that smallest amount, you would then Do the atomic swap. You'd either then change that straight out for Bitcoin, or you just make a spend. You either do a donation, Or you buy VPN with it or you do whatever you need to do with that smaller amount. Yeah. I just don't see where the issue is. It's useful.
[01:01:12] Unknown:
Agree. 100%. Any other business, gentlemen?
[01:01:15] Unknown:
One thing I wanted to add, which was really amazing over the last month, There have been 2 large grant rounds announced, one from OpenSats and one from the HRF. So there's been a whole list of different open source projects and individual developers, core contributors, and so on that have gotten funding for quite a significant amount of time now going forward to work on Specific things or just carry on their work in in regards to the these open source projects. So this is a major boost That came out. 1 that, I personally like to highlight is, Keith Mukai from SeedSiner, the lead maintainer, who Got a grant from the HRF to work on SeedSiner full time again. He did that couple of years ago with the grant, and this, gave a huge boost At the time, I think it was the 0.5.0 that came out, which was completely reworked.
And now, once again, he's got Time to ditch his fiat job and, and work on this full time, which is amazing. So, looking forward to seeing what comes out of that. But, as a short teaser, I think What he's, mainly working on now is rewriting the code base to be able to function on all sorts of different hardware platforms So that it's not dependent on the Raspberry Pi 0 anymore. And I think the main point is to port the code to MicroPython, and this will obviously be huge for DIY builders around the world, who Don't necessarily have access to the Raspberry Pi 0 and also people who may have concerns with that board or delivery shortages,
[01:03:00] Unknown:
Supply chain shortages and so on. So this would be That's pretty cool. Presumably, that makes it a bit less attackable as well. If it's MicroPython, Can that be used on lots of different boards?
[01:03:11] Unknown:
Exactly. I mean, they'd like one would be like the ESP 32 or something like that, which Like, the blockchain Jade runs on that as well. So so that's another board that that would work, or also, like, the Banana Pie, and so on. I mean, that Concern is is not 0, with the Raspberry Pi 0, but, it's they produce millions of these Devices. So it's it's not a niche product where the supply chain could be attacked to get to those Few Bitcoiners that use it. I mean, the overwhelming majority, is used for completely different things. So but, obviously, it's it would be Still better to have have more options.
[01:03:55] Unknown:
Very good to see. Are you selling, many of your new cases? I saw them. They're very sexy. The aluminum cases. Yeah. Oh, so nice. They are beautiful.
[01:04:06] Unknown:
Yeah. There's, actually a a new version coming out. Haven't officially announced these yet, on Twitter. I'm sorry. This is the official announcement. There we go. So this is a reworked, case. This is by Formerly Monero time, I think his account was nuked and and and now it's XMR Street or something like that. But he's he's a a hell of a guy, very, very talented who designed and Builds these, full aluminum milled cases for the seed signer. So this is under the label seed signer premium, And they're extremely thin and very, very high quality builds.
The first version came out a couple of months ago, and They had all the ports open, and now the new version will only have the power port open. I learned. There we go.
[01:05:03] Unknown:
How about time? I learned.
[01:05:08] Unknown:
Yeah. So so you're you're you're secured there. So only the power port is accessible? Exactly. Right. So you don't run the risk of connecting this via data. And now the new versions will be in full black and full orange. So looking forward to seeing how they're received.
[01:05:25] Unknown:
Yeah. I've heard a lot of people who have actually helped them as well and been like, yeah. This is really premium. Like, really, really nice. So that's good to see because I've always had a bit of a problem with plastic. All this 3 d printing stuff, It's like, yeah. Okay. It's kinda cool, but it's also kind of shit. Sorry to anyone who's printing it and making it, but Mhmm. I never, like, have that in my hand and go, oh, this is nice.
[01:05:47] Unknown:
Metal for the win. That's a big, big step up. And I mean, I've I've heard this from a lot of people, especially I mean, if you're a tinkerer and if you build it yourself, like, you kind of Know the value of the product, and and you don't really put that much weight into the feel and the aesthetic. But if you're a user that and you Just wanna wants things to work and and have a great experience with the whole thing. Getting a 3 d printed case into your hands, it's not like the most Trustworthy feel and and first impression. Mhmm. And this, obviously, completely flips that. And, yeah, but also just Just playing around with it and using it is so much fun. Even if this were not, like, sold on my website, I personally was absolutely blown away by the work This guy, Exima Street, who also, sells these on on his website. So that's, monerotime.com.
I think it's dotcom. But, as a caveat, you can only pay with Monero. So, samurai guys, you gotta get those swaps functioning quickly.
[01:06:52] Unknown:
Cool. Is that the, entire list? Are we done?
[01:06:56] Unknown:
That was it. That was a good one, guys. Absolutely.
[01:07:00] Unknown:
Clean. We're getting quite good at this, aren't we?
[01:07:03] Unknown:
Should be by now if I had enough practice.
[01:07:07] Unknown:
Alright. Cool. Nice. Catch up with you both next month, if not before. Good way to start a new year.
[01:07:13] Unknown:
Absolutely.
[01:07:14] Unknown:
That's fun. See you, fellas.
