In this episode, I kick things off with some midweek mayhem, then dive into a riveting two-guest lineup exploring human potential and world-shaping tech. First up is Tom Matte, whose life-changing recovery sparked a phenomenon he calls Upsight Vision—the ability to see and interact with holographic-like imagery that reveals subconscious signals and symbolic patterns. We discuss how he uses this capacity in 1:1 sessions to help people uncover blocks, navigate decisions, and interpret recurring archetypes—plus the forthcoming academic paper from the Institute of Noetic Sciences analyzing his EEG data. Tom’s journey from crisis to consulting is a powerful look at transformation, intuition, and the edge of cognitive science.
In hour two, inventor and futurist Pablos Holman joins to talk creating technology that matters, from Blue Origin’s early days to factory automation, energy breakthroughs, and how AI becomes a creative copilot rather than a replacement. We get into practical optimism: choosing problems worth solving, voting with your life’s work, and why the future needs all of us—not just scientists and coders, but builders, operators, and sellers too. Pablos shares insights from his new book, Deep Future, and why embracing fast-evolving tools (robots, AI, and more) can help us build a better world faster.
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Special thanks to:
Executive Producer Wayne Rankin
Executive Producer Rosanna Rankin
Executive Producer Carolina Jimenez
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(00:03:37) Cold open, theme, and a rocky start
(00:04:02) Host intro, housekeeping, and live show setup
(00:09:08) Community engagement, contact info, and support model
(00:10:37) Guest 1 intro: Tom Matt and the origin of Upside Vision
(00:16:50) From addiction to a new perception: defining Upside Vision
(00:24:35) Interpreting holographic images, limits, and uses
(00:32:16) Live readings, symbolism, and session flow
(00:37:37) Wellness, grounding practices, and empathic effects
(00:43:46) Archetypes, animals, and cultural meaning in readings
(00:50:26) EEG findings and what the science suggests
(00:56:14) Human evolution, Akashic ideas, and possible futures
(01:00:13) Takeaways, book plug, and how to learn more
(01:01:41) Break and interlude
(01:06:00) Hour 2 kickoff and sponsor mention
(01:07:11) Guest 2 intro: Pablo Holman on inventing the future
(01:12:40) From hacker roots to Blue Origin and long horizons
(01:16:47) Choosing problems that matter: energy, health, scale
(01:20:20) From crazy idea to working prototype
(01:22:15) Deep Future: the book, podcast, and mission
(01:24:34) Robotics reality check: fingertips, fabric, and factories
(01:27:10) Beyond software: bringing hard tech to life
(01:30:10) Personal stories, accessible tech, and why it matters
(01:34:07) All hands on deck: careers that build the future
(01:43:43) AI, jobs, and focusing attention on what you can change
(01:54:46) AI and creativity: tools that expand human reach
(02:01:43) Parting thoughts, how to follow, and resources
(02:03:27) Closing remarks, local events, and producer shout‑outs
(02:09:46) Sign‑off and show close
- Wayne Rankin
- Rosanna Rankin
- Carolina Jimenez
[00:02:02]
Unknown:
One 73467321476 Charlie three 2 78977764376. Walk when I have plucked the rose. The o gray hot. Longing still for that which longer nurseth the deceit. In faith, I do not love
[00:03:38] Unknown:
That's an interesting twist. Transmitting live from the asylum studios deep in the bowels of Southwest Texas, it's the Joe Ruge Show. The show where we talk about anything and everything. Where nothing is sacred, nothing is watered down, and nothing is PC. Alrighty. Hey, folks. This is Joe Roos. It is great to be with you once again, transmitting live from the asylum studios from the pimple on the backside of Texas, the beautiful city of Eagle Pass, and doing the very best that we can to bring you the best quality talk radio we could muster without all the bluster.
Welcome to the Joe Ruse Show. Forgot to put the phone on. Do not disturb. Sorry. Well, it is Wednesday. And as you know, folks, if there's one thing about the Joe Ruse Show is this. Something always happens right at the beginning to mess it up. And I forgot to put my phone on do not disturb and that's what did it. But that's alright, we recovered and we are back in good shape here. Alrighty, folks. Guys, I hope you guys had a good week so far. It's midweek. It's hump day, if you wanna call it that. To me, this is the, fourth Monday of the week. You know, because Sunday is Monday. Sunday is Monday light. And then you have Monday, Monday. Then you have Monday. You have Tuesday, Monday. Now today is Wednesday, Monday. The only day that's not a Monday is Saturday, but then that's pre Sunday, Monday light.
Make sense? I don't know. It made sense to me when I was thinking about it, but it's okay. It doesn't have to do. It's fine. Man. So we got a lot of to talk about tonight. We got two great guests that will be joining us here momentarily. But as always, before we get into anything that has to do with our guests, we have housekeeping and all that stuff, bills to pay, and, you know, the usual stuff that we do. So, let's, let's get into that. Folks, I wanna tell you about one of our sponsors here tonight, podholm.fm podholm.fm.
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That's podhome.fm. Okay. Also, would like to mention our new sponsor that we had just recently brought on. That's TNE Energy. TNE Energy. Electricity is essential folks. You need electricity. And at TNE Energy, they make it affordable and personal. There are over 1,000,000 subscribers across The US that trust them with their homes, their energy for their home, to power their homes, and free energy for referring their friends and family as well. You can visit tne.energy and explore all of the options that are available to you for your home today. Check them out. Great company. As a matter of fact, Monday, on Monday's show, we had the, CEO of t n e dot energy here with us in the studio, and that was a lot of fun. We had a we had a great conversation, a lot of laughs.
Great guy. You're gonna like it. So check him out. T n e dot energy. And, also, if you wanted, you could also email me directly about it, and I'll be happy to refer you over that way. So t n e dot energy. Find out what plans are available for you. Alright. Also, don't forget, head over to our website, joroos.com. Joroos.com. And when you get over there, open up the contact form. Look for that little section we have up there for contact us. Open up the form. Send us over any questions, comments, cares, or concerns that you have, any issues, any complaints. Actually, no. Don't don't send the complaints. If you have any issues, any concerns, send them on over to us. Let us know what you're thinking. We love to hear from you guys. If you have any suggestions for a guest or a topic you'd like to talk about, let us know. We try to to to accommodate everybody as much as we possibly can. So let us know.
Joe roos dot com contact form. If you don't wanna use that, email us at [email protected]. And actually, great idea, by the way, right down below, if you're if you're on Rumble, YouTube, or wherever, there's a comment section. Drop it down there. Let us know what you're thinking. We'll see those. If you put it in the chat, it disappears after the show, but put it down the bottom, it'll be there in perpetuity. Alright. So do that. Do that. Also, while you're on the website, if you would, please look for the support button. And, if you could, remember this is a value for value show. And all that basically means is that, if you've received anything of value from the content that we're putting out, we're asking that you return that value to us in the form of a donation. And your donation could be your time, your talent, or your treasure.
And, usually at the end of the show, I lay out all the different ways you can help us out. You can even become a producer of the show through a monthly recurring donation. And, we'll work all that stuff out, toward the end of the show. Alright. Now, with all of that great stuff said, we are going to bring in our first guest tonight. Now tonight, we'll be diving into a story of transformation, perception, and potential with Tom Matt, a man whose life changed in ways even science is still trying to understand. Once a successful Atlanta ad agency owner and devoted family man, Tom's world turned upside down thirteen years ago when a personal crisis brought him to rock bottom. After his journey back to health and sobriety, Tom experienced a profound shift in how his brain functioned, unlocking a new kind of perception he calls Upsite Vision.
The ability to see holographic images that reveal subconscious thoughts, hidden truths, and untapped talents. Over the past twelve years, Tom has refined this gift into a consulting practice, Upside Vision Consulting, where he helps individuals and organizations decode the unseen uncovered potential and spark meaningful growth. His work bridges spiritual insight with cognitive science and is now attracting the attentions of doctors and researchers alike. Tom, welcome to the show. It's great to have you here. I'm glad to be here. Thanks for having me on. It is this is very, very interesting to me. I know we we kinda chatted a little bit before the show. I told you, unfortunately, we didn't get a lot of the information, about about what you work on, rather late in the day. So I couldn't really do too much of a background on it. So I'm just being completely honest with everybody in the audience.
But from what I have been able to look at, this is fascinating to me. It truly is. And, I'm really looking forward to getting into talking about this. But before we do anything like that, as always, I have a couple of questions I always like to ask our guests when they first come on the show. The first guest the first question is, is what is something that most people don't know about you but should?
[00:12:26] Unknown:
I don't like ledges.
[00:12:28] Unknown:
There you go. I don't know why they should know that. I don't like ledges. I don't mind heights, but I don't like ledges. Really? That's interesting. See, I remember when I saw the new I probably would have given you a heart attack when I was a kid growing up in Brooklyn. At my grandmother's house in, in in Brooklyn, we had, I when when they weren't home, so I can say this now because grandma's passed on, mom and dad has passed on, so I can I can say this stuff now? When they weren't home, I used to go up onto the roof. And this is a two family house, so it's a two, like a two level house, bit pretty big. And, I used to go up there, and I would freely walk the ledges Wow. Around the around the the the perimeter of the house.
And now, I am so deathly afraid of heights that I won't even go up on the roof.
[00:13:12] Unknown:
So Well, that's interesting. That's interesting because I didn't have this as a kid. Right? I didn't I didn't realize well, I didn't have it. So when when I was a jolt when I was on my honeymoon about thirty years ago, I was in, England, and I was in the, I guess, Saint Paul's Cathedral. And you're up two stories, And you're commit and there's one part of it where you go out in the middle of the cathedral and you walk around, and it's a stairway. It's a it's a ledge that's, like, just enough for a body to go around and look down. It's only two about 20 feet high, but at that moment, I had vertigo. It was like Alfred Hitchcock movie. Oh, yeah. Since then since then, I'm like, no. Height's no good. I can I'm fine in an airplane, but that is not okay with me. Not only not even a little bit. I I know what you mean. I I love the reference to the Hitchcock movie. There was another great movie too that's a it was a spoof of Hitchcock. It was put out by Mel Brooks. I don't know if you know this one called High Anxiety.
[00:13:59] Unknown:
Yeah. I do. I remember when it came out on that old. Well, so am I. I saw it, you know, when it came out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not that far behind you. To the theater. I'm really I'm not that far behind you. I don't let the color fool you, man. I I just dye this stuff. Right. Otherwise, I am all white. But, but, yeah. So, the the heights, I I can't do heights. I when I when I fly, the rare occasion that I do, I I have to get an aisle seat because I can't be near the window. I can't look out the window or anything like that. I'm horrible with it. I'm I'm like, I got blinders on. I'm just looking straight ahead dude. I can't. I hate heights.
I hate them. But, but, so another question for you. What is your go to beverage that helps you unwind at the end of the day?
[00:14:47] Unknown:
Embarrassing to say it. Diet Mountain Dew.
[00:14:50] Unknown:
Another Mountain Dew person. Wow. Diet Mountain Dew. It has to be Diet Mountain Dew. Okay. No. That's fine. But but it it's like I've been on the streak with getting guests talking about their Mountain Dew, addictions.
[00:15:02] Unknown:
Yeah. Yeah. It's I mean, it's a good drink. It's it's but my wife my wife's been drinking it since she was a child in the mountains of Virginia, Southwest Virginia, and she introduced me to it. And so it's always around, but now I real I drink it without her. I I will go to the fridge again at Dime Mountain Dew. So that's obviously not her anymore. This, this is a good drink. Coffee during the day, Diamandew at night. Well, I'm having my coffee now, and I don't know if you've noticed at the beginning of the show here, I I took a sip. Don't take a sip of piping hot coffee before you start to speak.
[00:15:33] Unknown:
Burn the mouth. But, but coffee's been my thing. I love coffee. I'm actually doing better with it. I I reduced it. I don't know. You know those big 64 ounce coffee Sure. Insulated things? I would drink, like, two, maybe sometimes three of those a day. That's hardcore. That is well, I used to work overnight, so I'm I'm used to it. So it doesn't really affect me like that. But I have been trying to. So this is this is what I do now. This is only this is number two for the day. So I went from two of those mon three of those monstrous big ones to just two of these a day. This is great. And That's a good one. And, but, my usual go to on the weekends, not not during the week, is, I I love a good bourbon.
[00:16:15] Unknown:
And so I'll, I'll I'll I'll crack a bottle, and I'll sit out in the backyard, have a cigar, a little bit of bourbon, and just kinda relax. And that's that's usually my weekend. And just one or two of those during the weekend. Yeah. I have a lot of friends that go do bourbon too. The thing the thing you're gonna find out about my story, I stopped doing all kinds of any kind of mind altering drugs thirteen years ago. That's part of why one of the reasons I'm here. So even if I actually, I didn't like bourbon. I was more martini vodka and stuff like that. But, but, yeah, when I came out of this crisis that I had, I I needed to stop using because that was part of what happened to my brain. You know, that's one of the reasons in the beginning why I thought I have this ability I call upside vision. Well, we're gonna get into that. Because, as I was reading, more about it prior to the show and then going through your your bio again,
[00:17:03] Unknown:
it really it's it's a fascinating thing. So why don't you take us back to the first moment that,
[00:17:08] Unknown:
you experienced what you call upside vision. What did it look like? What did it feel like to you? So let let me let's let me define it first, and then we'll do that. Right? Because I wanna I wanna make sure people listen get it. Because every time I say this, people have an immediate response. So I wanna get into the minds of the listener and tell you what it's not. So upside's vision is the ability to see and interact with holographic images that seem to be everywhere around me, around us. Right? Not only can I see them, I can interact with them and change them with a thought? If you've seen, there was a show on Netflix called The Queen's Gambit about nine about five years ago where the protagonist would lay on the bed, and she was a chess champion, and she could move the pieces. She would she would imagine them or she would see them. When I saw this, she would move them around, and she could plan her moves because she was a chess master. It kind of looks like that. If you haven't seen that, most people have seen the Iron Man with Tony Stark Mhmm. In his office when he's surrounded by all the holograms.
It's that clear and in focus, but I can't swipe left or right with it. Okay. So to be clear, it's not a vivid mind's eye. Right? It's not a, it's not good memory recall. And the reason we know this is because I actually had my brain waves tested at the Institute of Noetic Science. So there's an academic paper coming out later this year about what exactly this is. And the first time I had it was the last time I used. There you go. The first time I did it was the last time I did coke because I was addicted to coke. I had a real strong problem, and I I have I talk I will get into that in a minute, but, I wrote a book about this one unhinged year I had. I lost everything. But the last time I was on the couch and I did drugs, and I looked over and I saw four different things, literally just holograms. It was the back of a dinosaur, blood cells moving through a body. It was a slot machine and then the Grim Reaper. And even though I was using at the time, I knew instinctively. I don't know how I knew. I was like, I can see these, without being on drugs. I knew, you know, obviously, I was on drugs. I was high. I was like, I could do this without drugs. And as soon as I, you know, I came down, the next day, the day after that, I started seeing it, and I did could do it every day.
So I got clean and sober because I wanted to get my family back because, like I said, I lost everything, and and I was on a mission to find out what this was. If I'm tell if you this happened to you, first thing you would do is go to a clinician, and you'd say, get me an MRI, do some tests on something wrong. So I did that. I had two m different MRIs. There's no brain damage, no tumors, no lesions, nothing from the drug use. Thank god. And, yes, so there's nothing clinically wrong. After that, I was on a mission to find out. I thought people would know. I thought there would be some research or some academic somewhere would say that this is not on not completely unusual or something. I hadn't found anything. I couldn't find it re I I emailed hundreds of scientists. No joke. Neurologists, over the last twelve years. Finally, in 2023, I got out into Institute of Noetic Science, and we did some tests. And like I said, that paper's coming out this year. So that's what that's the first time I did it. That's what it looks like. I I as you're describing it, I'm thinking of there there was a movie that I saw,
[00:20:19] Unknown:
years ago. I think it came out in 2002, 2001. So A Beautiful Mind with Russell Crowe, where he he played, John Nash, mathematician. And in the movie, I I don't think it happened to him in the real life character, but in the movie at least, they showed that he was able to see mathematical problems and equations in almost like a holographic form. And I'm wondering if it was kinda similar to that. So that's great. That's a good reference because,
[00:20:48] Unknown:
even though yeah. I can see those. Yes. The answer is yes. And it's funny. I acquired in a better a better understanding of mathematics after this happened. Right? I was a business owner before. I had an advertising agency. Mhmm. So I understood numbers, percentages, and margins, and stuff like that. But I hadn't done algebra and geometry since high school. At after this, when my brain changed, I became like a visual spatial super ninja. You know how they do the test where you see what side of an image is? You could turn it. Oh, yeah. There's no there's no topological space or manifold or anything that I cannot see in my field of vision and spin it around and dissect it. So, and I use him actually in my book. I wrote Jesus Goes to Hollywood, a memoir of madness. I use John Nash as an example, because, you know, there's an element to that what I can do. So I use him as an example. So there was an, an improvement in cognitive ability, and there was an improvement about spatial awareness, which led to better mathematical understanding.
Now to be clear, I'm not a mathematician, but I do, have some skills in certain areas of mathematics that I never had before.
[00:21:54] Unknown:
How did you move from from, I guess, from that really, because that's a that's a very deep awakening experience that you went through to, to developing the upside vision, as and and and then from that into a and and using upside vision into a a structured consulting practice.
[00:22:14] Unknown:
Okay. So that was a long time. So let's be clear about that. Let's this is really important. I just started doing the consulting this year Okay. Because I realized that I can connect with someone else. Just Joe, you and I are talking now. I know what your voice sounds like, and you know what my voice sounds like. I've learned that if I'm given permission and that somebody wants me to, I can tap into this part of them that is radiating outwards. Right? It's almost like I'm seeing a part of their unconscious if they give me permission and they invite me in and say, yeah. It's okay to do that, like a waking dream analysis. But I just started doing that this year. We'll come back to that. So for twelve years, I was just realizing that number one, I could do it. I could see these images. Number two, I could change them with a thought. So you and I are talk let's say you and I were talking about how to make a pizza. Right? Let's say, you know, you you're talking about a fame the best pepperoni pizza in the world. You would think on that topic if I looked over and, oh, by the way, all I have to do is to shift my attention to get it there, to see them. Right? Okay. So you would think if I looked over there, it would be some form of what I'm thinking about when we're discussing a pizza. Now there's the 50% chance that it's that would happen. Just as again, 50% chance it could be an elephant riding a bicycle or something completely unrelated.
Now if it is an elephant riding a bicycle, right, I now I can engage with it. Right? It's like there's some kind of external intelligence that I have this communication with. Where that's coming from, we have yet to you know, we don't know. I know, like I said, when I tune connect with another person, I know it's coming from them. But where this one is, it's just floating around. I I like it to an antenna. Right? I am we're receivers. Something's there. It could be again, I we could speculate. But I once I see it, I can, I can exchange it all the same way once you hear something? But you and I talk, I hear what you're saying, and we can communicate. There's a part of my brain that can communicate whatever this, spiritual intelligence is, and it helps me navigate the world.
[00:24:19] Unknown:
Now are you able to, like, I guess, decipher what these these images that you're seeing are? Like, because you mentioned that you saw the Grim Reaper, you saw, an elephant, you saw Yeah. Yeah. Sure. And so sometimes so that's a great question too. And the answer is sometimes
[00:24:36] Unknown:
just like I'll I'll use something. I try to use something everybody can relate to. Most people, I think, maybe everybody, dreams. Right? When you wake up from a dream, it's like you were there. Mhmm. Right? Sometimes, you know, if you're worried about something, it's meaningful, but sometimes it's not. This is very, very much like that. The images that keep coming back, they seem to hold more truth than something that passes through. Right? So here's what I can't do. And, Joe, if you had this, I promise you you'd try to do this too. Because they're so clear and focused. Right? So I could watch I could picture the Kentucky Derby, and then you're like, okay. Wow. This is unbelievable. It's precognitive.
I was gonna bet on the Kentucky Derby. I tried this for the longest time in the beginning. That it doesn't work like that. It's not it's not precog. It's some even, again, even though it's clear in a focus, it's not like that. So, so that's interesting. So I again, we know it's not that, but the things that come back do hold some kind of awareness that can help guide me through life and the people I work with. You know, I've done hundreds of these over this year, and, you know, it's it's fun. It's extraordinary. It's it's not I'm not a therapist, so I don't wanna say that, but there isn't an analysis going on. I liken it to this when I work with people. I'm like the IKEA furniture of this space. I give you the tools. I give you the furniture, but there's still work needs to be done around the symbolism that shows up and the archetypes that show up. Another example you might say is, like, I'm a radiologist. I'll take a snapshot of what's there, but you still go to you should go to an expert. Or you a lot of people put the symbolism into AI, and they get good results from that.
So there's a lot of different things you can do with this, and it depends on business, move, relationship. There's so many things you can do with it. I would like to experience this just once. Just, you know I it's fun. Yeah. You know,
[00:26:25] Unknown:
now now, obviously, this isn't unique just to you or other people in the world. How about how many other people are do do you know of that deal with this? Or is there, like, a has better been a study done on this, like, percentage of post?
[00:26:38] Unknown:
My study is the first study. Right? So there's no date. There's no let's look up at the past first. Right? I was sure I was gonna find some kind of literature somewhere about somebody being see seeing these kind of things. I found nothing. Nothing. Nothing. One guy emailed me about some Muslim back in fourteen hundreds who said he had something like this, but that's the closest thing. So Interesting. So there's no historical information around this. Right? Now I'm the first, case study they've done. That said, I've talked about this on podcast over the last year Knowing that since my vision changed, right, and I thought mine was from drugs and changes in the brain because the clinicians said, well, something must have opened up in your brain and stayed open. I kinda thought that too. But guess what? That's that's not the thread that connects all the people that can do this to one degree or another, but it's some kind of trauma.
That's what activates this or change the genetic makeup or whatever it is, the mutation. And and some and they I I have a PDF. If people wanna get a free p it's free. It's called free PDF. It's called the eight stages of upside vision. These are the stages that I went through, to better these are the stages I went through, and I laid them all out. They're not and it didn't go through them in order, but it says you where you where you might be in the stages. Because even though some people can see them, right, they can't change them with a thought. Or some people can change them with a thought, but there's not there's not, like, this intelligence download. It's very it's nuanced. So it's really interesting. So people can do it, and I've got thousands of names. I they all can't do it. You know, I don't actually have a hard number, but I would say I would actually use probably close to a thousand. And I'm sure more than that. Clearly, more than that, but I haven't talked you know, I've only been talking about this on a podcast on podcast for about a year. And once the paper comes out, I think that's gonna get a lot more attention from popular science and general,
[00:28:33] Unknown:
general audience from bigger scientific people that like these kind of studies. Do you think that that this type of information is always there just filtered out by the brain?
[00:28:42] Unknown:
100%. So so think of so we have all the senses. There's a word I learned that when I was researching this. Right? There's a word called umwelt. I think I'm pronouncing it correctly. U m w e l t. It's the way a biological organism moves through the world, like the planet. So in other words, humans travel around Earth one way, elephants see it another, birds another, worms, fish. We all see the world in different way and experience in a different way, but it's still the same environment. Correct? Right. Now whatever happened, whatever opened up my brain, I am seeing my my visual senses have mutated wherever to see more of what is already there.
So there's and there's two parts of that too, Joe. Number one and I I I separate them. And I didn't separate them in the beginning, but the more I've studied it and live with it, the more it becomes clear. One of them is like this hidden biosphere that we can't see that's with us. So imagine compared to this microbiology. Right? We didn't know these we had we could see the very small items until Leeuwenhoek invented the microscope. Right? They were always there. We couldn't see them. This, I think, is the same way for this hidden biosphere that I'm I'm able to see. But, also, I access the the newest sphere or the Akashic record wherever this intelligence is. So they're both here. One is warier or closer. One is next to, and the next one is extra dimensional. And it's wild too. It's hard to articulate because I tell other people until we all get together and define it. It's just me trying to navigate this.
[00:30:21] Unknown:
It's it's I'm I'm, like, I'm listening to you, and I'm I'm fascinated by this. I I I I I would love to be able to experience this thing. And I and I and I know that you said a few minutes ago that that you you actually do, like, sessions with folks. Yeah. Right? So when you when you when you do these sessions, what what typically comes out? What comes out of those sessions?
[00:30:42] Unknown:
So let's say alright. So when I do it myself, right, when I'm doing this and I'm playing with that, because I it is a fun thing to do with myself, I can change it with the thought. Right? So I can sit there and, like, yo, well, I can have an idea or the best the best thing the most the biggest advance that I've made in my mathematics so I could see something, I would work on a math problem, and then I would get answers with help from this space. Okay. So now that's not what I do with people. When I tune if I was doing a session with a a person, the and it doesn't matter where you are. Right? It could be next to me, or it could be 500 or 3,000 miles, wherever. It doesn't matter. And and if you said, well, how is that possible? My answer is I have no idea. Quantum entanglement, that's the only thing I could tell you because I can't even begin to tell you, and I won't even try. But I could recommend people that I could refer you to people that have had great sessions. In any case, when we do this, I do a five minute reading. Let's say you're curious about a business deal that you wanna make. Right? You're like, alright. I want I've got a business deal. Is there anything standing in the way?
And and even though you asked that question, I'm telling you it's not precog, but what something is gonna come through. So, again, not mind reading. You cannot think of an, an animal, and I can see it. It's not your deepest, darkest secrets. Nothing you don't want anyone to know. It's this middle ground. It's like the waking dream state. Whatever is bothering you, you're unconscious, whatever is there, but, you know, you kinda put in the back, that seems to come forward. So back to the example. So if you're trying to make a deal, and you're curious about whether it's gonna go through, I'll do a first minute a five minute read. Let's and let's say you intentionally ask a question. You know, what's there? What what is what is radiating for me that's there? Now I could I've done this. I'll give an example kind of an example.
So there was a guy that there were all business deals. There was a the guy that I saw him, his shoelaces were getting cut by a a man. The same man walked around this whole outside of this bench area, and he was in front of him in a board meeting. Right? Same guy. So this is all happening, and I'm watching this. So I did the reading, and and I'm done. I'm like, well, that's kinda wild. You know? He's sabotaging you, but he's also in front of you at a board meeting. It's like, I know who that is. The the guy says this. I'm like, time out. You don't know anything. You clearly have an idea of somebody that you may be thinking about that might not be interested in this deal going through the same way you are. All because I'm seeing it clear and in focus, it does not mean that that is the guy. It means it's he's on your conscious or unconscious. And, obviously, by you saying you think it is him, you obviously think it's him. You should not go to him and say this. Now what I would suggest is maybe talk to him about it in a, in a in a, you know, a grown up way. And don't don't accuse. Just say, hey. Listen. I've had I'm having some thoughts around that. That's one example. People talk about relationships, and then we do it for an either a half hour, an hour. And it's really interesting. The longer the longer the more reads I do, it's wild how more things seem to come out.
The it's more like, there's a knowing. It's like, you know, it's like, if you and I were having this conversation for an hour, you would be more open to me at the end because we would trust each other. Sure. This really is very much the same way. And that's kind of, you know, fascinating. Don't get me wrong. You can get some good stuff in a half an hour, but that seems to be the case. Again, it's me seeing these things, and you and then by me saying it, you trust that it's true because you're like, oh, that's wild. And I've seen oh, let me give you another one. This is like a fun this is a this is a precog one. Right? So there's a woman. I do this thing, and there's a balloon a red balloon that comes down on the front of her car. And I tell her this is going on. And it doesn't make any sense, but like a dream. You know? You wake up from a dream. It doesn't make any sense. Three months later and I described the scene better than that, but you get the idea. Yeah. Three months later, she sends me an email. She said, you know how you said a red balloon came down on my car? It literally happened to her just like that day. It landed exactly where I said it was gonna I mean, where I saw it land on the car. So we are connected in ways that we can't even begin to understand, Joe. So I was thinking I I in my head, I was thinking that it was, well, maybe she maybe somebody bought her a car or something like that. They put balloons and something on it. You know? Like, you know, that's how people put bows and stuff. You know? It was mundane. It was mundane. That's what's so wild about it. I don't even know how to use it for that. But it the fact that it was so on point is pretty wild. Now the the sessions that you do, they typically last about an hour, you said? Yeah. Either thirty minutes or an hour. I'll do whatever they want. And a lot of people come just because they're curious. You know, they wanna they just wanna see what's there. And then then more people come. And I usually say I'm one and done,
[00:35:17] Unknown:
but people come back three months later. Yeah. That was my next question. I was gonna I was gonna ask if if this is like I because I come kinda picturing it almost like a therapy session. You know? Like, you you
[00:35:27] Unknown:
come back and sit down on the couch and talk some more stuff. And Well, here well, here so there we go. Again, I wanna be very clear. I'm not a therapist, but I've done this so long, and I do understand some of the symbolism because it's metaphorical symbolism. You know? It's very I I so I'm on the fence of what it's saying it's literal. Again, back to the reality, I've described something to for I'm doing this man, and I described this or I see this five minute things, and it's literally every event that he did that day. Right? So it was like a recap of his day. He goes, how do you know that's what I did? I'm like, I don't know anything, and I'm not I'm not saying I'm seeing this. That's it. I'm literally seeing it. So that's very important to understand.
Oh, coming back. So I say I'm one and done. Right? So I had a woman. I I did her when I just started doing this, and we had a great session, and and she comes back three months later. And and well, I've done hundreds and well, not I I shouldn't say that. About 200 plus people. When she came back, it was wild. It's almost like you push pause on a VCR. Some of the same things came up. Wow. It was totally, totally incredible. I mean, it was like one it was like, wow. I described I mean, the month three months before. And as I'm describing, I'm remembering it. I'm like, hold on a minute. And I'm seeing it, and she's and she's remembering it. So, so, yeah, it can be helpful, especially if you're trying to make, especially if you have I say it. If you're stuck, this might help point to where you're stuck.
Because sometimes I literally see people no. Not it's a metaphor, whatever. Walk around a tar pit with their foot inside. You know? You're like, obviously, something's going on. Whether you acknowledge it or not, there's something there that might well, you might wanna address with a friend, a mentor, a trust adviser, whoever.
[00:37:15] Unknown:
That's interest that that yeah. Okay. I think I wanna do this. Yeah. Yeah. We'll make we'll work it out. Yeah. I definitely wanna I definitely wanna try this because I I'm very curious as what you'd pick up, from me. So
[00:37:29] Unknown:
Well, you know, other piece so I there's a a blog post I wrote for the on the Institute of Noetic Sciences on their website. It's called is upside vision, psychic ability. Right? And it it as opposed to remote viewing, lucid dreaming, telepathy, and all that stuff in precog, Here's what I would say. Even though sometimes those things come in, this seems to be more of, unhapp tapped human potential, something we're evolving into and something that's opening up. It's like an additional sense or it's like an additional type of vision. Right? It's so specific that it is a vision. And people ask me, do you hear things? You know, do sounds come in? No. It is a visual thing. Sometimes, there's, like, thoughts I get with it, but it's it is definitely a visual, perceptual visual visual phenomena. And to make no mistake, it does not interfere with my day. Right? It's not like there's a I'm not thinking these things like, oh my god.
I believe everything I say. Now here's that I believe everything I see, and that's important. Now here's how I know that. You know? This is true profession because I was so unwell for that one year. I was really sick from drugs and so I I mean, I know what it is like to be unwell. You know? And my family knows what I look like when I'm on when I was unwell. It was a very horrible, horrible year. Homelessness. Everything you can imagine that you can do when you were mentally unwell happened to me. Psych ward, all that stuff. But that was a long time ago. Right? And since, like I said, since I don't put the drugs in your body, it's amazing what happens. You know? So so, and I and I work out a lot. I run to ground myself in this. Right? This is it it grounds me, and it, I know it's very fulfilling, and and it's really great to connect with people.
Because at the end of the session, I pretty much vibe with where that person is. So if you come in anxious, I I mean, I know it. Right? Now best case scenario, by the end of the session, you're not anxious because we've seen some things that have calmed your mind, but that doesn't always happen. Sometimes your anxiousness at the end, I feel like you do. Right? It's it's kinda wild. That that's like a I'm still learning how that works. It's kinda like empathic? It kinda is. And people that have done this a lot longer than I have or people that call themselves, you know, people that work in the space, they're like, yeah. You have to be careful of that. And, well, again, thank you. I know. Now I know. So but it's it's a it's a very fulfilling it's a very fulfilling thing. And I make a living at it. That's what's so wild too. Right? For twelve years, I did. And I did marketing. I was working for, I was still working for different businesses doing their marketing.
And, and I was like, this is not my calling anymore. I need to lean into this. And, again, this year, I just put my head down. I practiced and I I realized, look, this is something I'm supposed to be doing. The universe is calling me to do this. Yeah. I was I was gonna say the same thing. It's it's it's it's incredible how,
[00:40:24] Unknown:
you know, at certain stages of our of our lives, something usually happens that refocuses you and redirects you down a different path. And, sometimes you miss it. Sometimes people miss it. Yeah. I agree. And then sometimes people grasp a hold of it like you did, and that's that's fantastic.
[00:40:40] Unknown:
And sometimes people ignore it. Right? Sometimes, you know, Joe, sometimes people know they should do something else, but they're too scared. Actually, those are the perfect people to work with too. Let's be clear. Right? Mhmm. So that's actually a real almost a shout out. Because people are like, I shouldn't do it because I and make no mistake. You've got responsibilities and stuff like that. But if the universe keeps calling you and you ignore it, it's gonna affect you mentally, physically, emotionally. It's gonna affect you. And I I I use an example of synchronicities, you know, those unplanned occurrences. How could it you think of someone and they call you. Mhmm. That happened to me all the time.
And if you have a positive emotion around a synchronistic event, that that's one of the best ways for me to navigate the world now. Right? So if I see something and I have a good feeling around it, if I see something or if I'm reading somebody and they say they wanna buy a new house, I see them buy the new house and it's very successful and everything. I'm not telling them to buy the new house. What happens is a couple of weeks later, they're thinking about it. They'll turn to the right and, what what they'll think about something I've seen for them, but they'll also get a positive feeling.
[00:41:45] Unknown:
If that's the case, it means that I I, you know, I from my experience, the universe is saying, hey. You probably jumped. Go ahead and do it. Yeah. Now now talk about synchronicity and things like that. I I understand where you're coming from with that. I don't have any special gifts or anything like that. I don't wanna miss I don't wanna misrepresent that in any way. But, people close to me like I'll every now and then I'll get those I'll get that feeling that something's something's coming, something's gonna happen, and it's a very unsettling feeling. It it sometimes it makes me feel physically sick, Like, especially if it's gonna be something that's gonna be, or or potentially bad.
And, like, I'll I'll call my sister and I'll say, you know, I got this feeling like something like impending doom, like something is really bad coming. And more often than not, I'm right.
[00:42:29] Unknown:
Yeah. I I I listen. I hear loud and clear, and I think that's smart for you to pay attention to that. Right? Because even though maybe you can't change it, you can prepare for it. And, you know, you could be just watch just watch.
[00:42:41] Unknown:
And I what I do mean watch, just just get get on, heightened alert, you know, or whatever you wanna call it. Because sometimes you don't know what it is. You know? It it's not like it it I'm not getting a sense that, well, it's gonna be this exact thing that's gonna happen. It's just, like, just I feel it sometimes. There's something coming. I don't know what it is, but it's coming. It's almost like
[00:42:58] Unknown:
the event hap well, think about this. Think about it like this because I because this works for me. So imagine you throw a rock in the, you know, into the future Mhmm. And it lands in a lake, and the waves come back and hit you. Right? And you're that's what it is. Something's coming back even though it's in the future. That's how I liken it to. That's interesting. Yeah. That's a good way to look at it because I and by the way, jeez, this is really interesting. The things I see, a lot of this stuff interacts with our three d world, but it's not part of the electromagnetic spectrum. But that kind of thing, I literally see that represented. What I just described to you, I've seen that represented many times in this space.
[00:43:35] Unknown:
That's that's fascinating. I I love this conversation. This is great. You know, so so symbols and, and visual metaphors, how do they how do they help people uncover the that inner conflict in that direction? We may have touched on a little bit, but but how how does that exactly work?
[00:43:51] Unknown:
Well, then let's talk about just an animal symbol. Right? So because animals are the the one thing that come up a lot. Right? So what's interesting, if somebody is from Canada and, I'll I'll just use the word a moose. A moose comes up. Right? And if somebody is from Florida and a moose comes up, and if somebody I'm dealing with somebody in China or India and a moose comes up, that same moose is probably gonna have a different meaning for them from the environment they're in. Sure. So that's what's really interesting to unpack. Right? So the person can it could be more literal. Right? Because they're there. But so so that's the part that I like to tell people to work with their therapist or specialist with. Or I I think I don't know if I said this or not. People love re taking the recordings or and if you put this in chat g p t, they know what a session is with me.
If you put it in, AI will give you feedback around the symbolism, really articulate and smart things. It's not it's not the whole idea of telling you that you're awesome and incredible, but it you know, how it's everyone's making fun of AI for doing that now, which is great. This is not that. This is like, okay. Here's what that symbolism represents. And even you can drill down. Well, you know, I get it, but I'm not, I'm not I'm from China or whatever. You can put it whatever, and we'll it will guide you to what it could be. So the the animal symbolism is interesting. And then the archetypes, there's an archer or, there there's there are horoscopes and stuff like that, and it changes for each person. Now I'll tell you what. Mary Poppins, I don't know what you would call. I would just say she is an archetype of the nanny. She came up, for, like, five weeks in a row for all these different people, and I was fascinated by that. And everyone, I I mean, I maybe I should shouldn't say obviously, but, obviously, they all had kids. Right? Sure. So each one in each case, the way they dealt with their kids was different.
Interesting. And they and they took the meaning to be different. Like, maybe I should, you know it was again, I won't get into specifics because it's just a client. Of course. Yeah.
[00:45:57] Unknown:
Now now through the count through through these sessions that you do, have you ever witnessed a client experience like a like like a complete shift? You know, something that changed the course of their life entirely?
[00:46:07] Unknown:
Well, I don't know about that. But I I feel confident I could say, you know, there's so wow. Sometimes things come in. Again, I'm not a medium. Right? Right. But there's something that comes through. And this woman was convinced that was somebody that passed over. And I said, listen. I don't know what that is, but I just described to it, and it was it was wonderful. Right? It was very emotional, but she, you know, thought it was that. I didn't I didn't I'm not sitting there saying it's not, and I'm not sitting here saying it is. I'm telling you exactly what I see, but she was convinced it, it was that. So that was in true. I I love that. It was great. It was meaningful for her. But I told her as soon as she did, I said, that's not what I do. I do not you know, my goal is to not find a relative who's passed over. I do not say I do that at all. So so I don't know what it was, but I know it was meaningful to her. Another way, somebody wants to make a change in their life. As a matter of fact, this last month.
The stuff that I showed her potential within her, I I've never felt better at the end of a session. Because all these things I didn't know this. Right? So I see these things, and I don't know about this person. Right? But I see some specific things that they do in their life. Let's say she's a teacher, and she wants to teach a college, and then she wants to go on tour. So I'll see all these things happen, and then she tells me, well, I'm a teacher. I wanna write I'm I'm writing a book, and I wanna go on tour. And, you know, after I've seen the scene where she's very successful on a world tour. So when that happens, it's like the universe saying, okay. Maybe make a jump. Right? So those are great. Those are that those are as good as you can be. And the flip side of that, sometimes people if you come in it's not skepticism is fine because I'm still gonna see it. That's but Yeah. Don't come as skeptic skeptical and not wanna have to work because it's like waking again, I'll use the dream analogy. It's the best one. If you're like, oh, it's meaningless, then you're gonna it's nothing I can say. Even though I've seen it, it's not you don't care. So don't
[00:48:03] Unknown:
just don't do it. Yeah. You can be skeptical, but, you can be skeptical, but at least have an open mind.
[00:48:09] Unknown:
Well, sure. Sure. Yeah. Right. Absolutely. That's why but some people come in well, very few. Less than a handful have come in, and they're like, well, I don't get this. I'm like, well, that's fine. You don't have to get it. Now now you also work with companies. Right? And,
[00:48:22] Unknown:
and, you help them uncover, like, hidden strengths and, you know, help maybe align teams. How does the process work in a business session?
[00:48:30] Unknown:
Or setting up another? Offering. So that's a great one. So the the so I don't know. So I offer that. Right? Okay. So I have not had my first big group session. Now there's it's coming up. I think I'm gonna have one on Friday where they're gonna they're gonna bite and they're gonna do it. And what's really interesting about that, because that takes my experience as running business meetings and an ad agency and running those creative meetings and pulls in, let's say, a team of five creative people and what's coming through in their field, and it's matching up their unconscious projections around this topic. Let's just call it, they wanna market this, new form of hot sauce.
What's seen there and then my experience from the business side on how to market it and target market. So that's gonna be fun. So I'll let's check back in six months. You know? Actually, maybe nine because I have to execute it. Okay.
[00:49:22] Unknown:
The reason why I'm I I kinda laugh a little bit when you said the hot sauce thing is is just yesterday, I was talking to a friend of mine, because I make my own spices, like, rubs and and sauces and things like that. And we were talking yesterday, he was like, dude, you gotta bottle this stuff. You gotta sell this stuff. You gotta market this stuff. You can make a fortune with this. So that's that's what made me laugh when you said it. Well well, here so let's talk about that, Joe. So think about it. We're connected right now, and I didn't it's not hot sauces. I was using that as a placeholder. Mhmm.
[00:49:53] Unknown:
Because I maybe I picked up something from you. Maybe? I don't yeah. I mean, I'm just saying it's not hot sauces. I just use that as a fill in the blank because that's the first thing that you got. Early early when we first started the conversation, you said that you that the the person that you're dealing with has to be willing to let you,
[00:50:08] Unknown:
visualize. And and I've been I've told you already that I'm interested in doing this, so maybe that you know, you're picking up a little something off of that. That's
[00:50:16] Unknown:
Listen. Blows me away. The science or there's no there I I just should say this is what I'll say. The science around this is so far behind because there is no science. Now here, let me actually, let's talk about the science. That's not no science. So, when I went to the Institute of Know What Science is, they hooked my brain up to an EEG machine. Right? And they wanted to measure my brain waves, alpha, beta, theta, gamma waves against two things. One, as I said, it's good memory recall and a vivid mind's eye. Like, you and I, if I said, you remember the Jaws poster when we were kids, you'd say yes. And I could drive the car, and I could talk to you about it. When this if I look at the Jonas poster, I can't drive a car because it takes over my motor skill. So it I need to look at it. I can't keep my eye on the road and see this thing in front of me. Right. So we measured my brain states of good memory recall. I mean, yeah, against seeing it with upside vision. And the wild thing is the, well, I knew I knew it was gonna be the the changes from one to the other would be different. The two biggest changes, the ones that were, like, off the charts for, like, another one, was the theta state. And that's the one that medium say they are in or people that are meditate deeply, that's really in use. But the wild one was the alpha brain state, which is the state that is the brain is typically at rest.
So when I my alpha brain state, while I'm just seeing these upside images, is working pretty hard. Wow. Yeah. So that that's what the academic paper is around.
[00:51:42] Unknown:
So yeah. Well, it's it's I I was gonna actually get into some of the some of the science on it first, but I had I had one more question about the business applications. And it has to do with AI, because I know we mentioned AI earlier as well. So how would how would upside vision, give organizations,
[00:52:06] Unknown:
I guess, a a strategic edge, you know? So here alright. So let's let's let's take a step back. Because, like, this is I've had thought about this a lot. So everybody we all know AI is amazing. I think we can all agree that it's it is pretty amazing. I think it's amazing. Every business in the world is now leaning into AI for insights and every kind of thing you could possibly use AI for, they are. But let's use the word insights. Now if every ad agency or every corporation is pulling from the same wealth of knowledge, Right? Mhmm. All the human knowledge that's been uploaded to the computer and is regurgitated back to AI, that is we're all pulling from the same space. The space that I'm accessing is gonna offer other options that this AI will not offer or maybe you doesn't make the insights that you can there. So that's my answer to that question. Everyone is gonna be fighting for this space. This is something new and different.
[00:53:08] Unknown:
Alright. Let's see. Let's get to some of the science stuff. We already had gotten some of that. So, now sign now they're really just starting to study this, like like you you've indicated. But for the studies that have been done so far, what is, probably the most surprising or validating thing that you've learned, from the scientific side of the work?
[00:53:28] Unknown:
Well, the the most surprising thing was the alpha brain state is actually working hard. Right? And they say that the front left total area is suppressing some things. They're saying I I don't I'm again, I'm not a scientist. They're saying that left front of my brain is suppressing something so something else can get in. It's lead pushing something else so something else can get in. So that was the, the biggest surprise. What was the other question? What what was the,
[00:53:53] Unknown:
that was the It was the, what's surprising of validating?
[00:53:58] Unknown:
Well, validating that listen. I say I knew it was gonna show it. I was very happy that it was showing it up on the EEG machine. Because look. Let let me give you a couple other things. My eyes get tired when I do this just like watching a movie because people are people at in the beginning were like, well, it's just internal. It kept saying it's internal. It's internal. No. My eyes get tired. Either something called smooth pursuit eye movement. Right? When you follow something across the screen Mhmm. If it's external, you follow it, and you cannot fake that. So if they track your eyes, they know your if so if you and I were sent sitting in front of a wall that you you and you thought was blank, but I'm seeing a translucent or holographic leopard running across it, they could track my eyes. I see. I got you. That's one thing. Another one, my pupils dilate, or if something is arousing or exciting, so they change the shape.
Tired, dilating pupils, and the smooth pursuit are the ways that we knew it was external. The EEG machine is one way to validate that with science. You know? That was another way to validate the brain states with science.
[00:55:02] Unknown:
That's amazing. Now, it now if you if more people learn to see the world through upside vision, access those subconscious layers? How how how do you think that would change the way we live, the way we work, the way we innovate?
[00:55:17] Unknown:
So I so yeah. Great question, Joe. I do think this is a mutation for human's evolutionary survival, not to get scary or anything like that. I just I this didn't this is not a coincidence that I have this. Now why do we need that? Maybe we're gonna need to communicate through this way. I think if somebody has it to the degree I do, we're sitting next to you here, we could both see the same images. Just like I can we have a conversation. We can have a communicate holographically. They could change theirs with a thought, and we can communicate that way. The same way we're having a conversation now. Why why and and and and we can all both access the same place that has this other wealth of knowledge Mhmm. In the Akashic record, neosphere, or whatever is here with us, whatever hidden biosphere, whatever it contains.
Again, the the stuff that surround us is more like, I I'll use words like microbes and germs like something like that, but there's something else here with us that we can't see that's not necessarily small or just vision. We only see 1% of the electromagnetic spectrum anyway, so this should not be a surprise. This should not be like, oh my god. That's impossible. Most people should say and they have. They're like, well, that's really interesting, and it makes sense. So, survival communication, I think those are the two big ones. Two big ones, survival and communication.
[00:56:34] Unknown:
It's interesting you mentioned the Akashic record because that's exactly what I was thinking about with this question.
[00:56:38] Unknown:
Yeah. Well, I think we can access this. And there is knowledge there. Again, with our AI, Elon Musk just said this the other day. He wants to get all our knowledge and upload it to his Grokipedia now. This already exists in this sphere. This or this already exists. We don't have to do that because the all of history is being written, and it's there's, you know, a quantum entanglement and this quantum field that it exists in. Now can we see all of it? No. But something is definitely changing. And, you know, people are emailing me. I mean, like, I I feel really good about this. People feel so validated because there's someone else that can do it, and there people are telling them that they're crazy. There was a girl that did it when she was a child. Her mother told her, don't tell anyone. You can do this. In fact, there's an anecdote she told me. She had a sleepover. She was on her bed with her 10 year old friend, and she said, do you ever see things other people don't? And her friend said, you mean, like, the two fish that are above us now? And they both were like and the girl goes, you still saw that? Yeah. Right? And they both went through and they both went through puberty and and one moved away and and they she stopped doing it. It's because you're not you're not, teaching it. It's like, everybody can sing, but everybody can't be Adele or Frank Sinatra.
This is kinda like that.
[00:57:52] Unknown:
I I wonder I'm thinking about this now. I I wonder if this is something that man, ages past, had the ability to do, and then it it it kinda it faded out because lack of use maybe, I don't know, but and then and and now it's starting to to because, you know, you hear a lot about this type of Yeah. These type of abilities, not not necessarily upside vision, but but similar type of abilities that that seem to be more prevalent now and or or at least maybe just people just talking about it more.
[00:58:25] Unknown:
I think that's exactly right, what you just said. I think we did it How or whatever ten thousand years ago, we were wiped out or, you know, we forgot about it, and people are just remembering it. At the telepathy tapes, there's this podcast that's real popular about these kids who are autistic, and they communicate in a place called The Hill. And I say the middle ground that I say, maybe it's the same place. Yeah. I think this is something that we did in the past and is coming back, but there's no recorded,
[00:58:52] Unknown:
you know, it's not recent past. It's like Atlantis, that kind of past. Right? Yeah. Yeah. I I I think that that might be the case. Yeah. I I see I I follow that stuff. I I I I find all of that fascinating, you know, and, and I I try to find as much information on these things as I possibly can. I think they're just I think I just think it's an amazing study to do in itself just to to to go back in time to to look at them at some of the things that were accomplished ages ages ago that, that we can't even duplicate today. Like like for example, the the the most common thing is, like, the pyramids. You know? Yeah. We can't duplicate those today. Even with all the equipment and technology that we have, we cannot do what the ancient Egyptians did with that in building those things.
[00:59:39] Unknown:
Without a doubt. And it meant maybe so we knew they had the scribes and all that kind of communication. But what if they could also one one of them were the people that could do it. The guy was a 100 miles away, but they could communicate it like that. Right? They're like, you know, they're like, should I get this rock or this rock? You know, we think they had to go back. What if they're like, no. Pick the rock on the right or whatever if they're seeing the same thing. So, yeah, I don't know. I I I I do I do think it's it seems like it's coming back. I'm saying evolving into it, but I do think we must have I do think we probably had this in the past. I think so too. I think so too. Alright. So what do you what do you hope that the audience takes away from the conversation tonight? Well, number one, if you're going through hell, keep going. You can come out of it. If I could get my life back together, anybody can. My book is Jesus Goes to Hollywood, a memoir of madness. If you wanna check it out on Amazon, it's a it is just about my one life of complete hell, how I got everything back together and starting to learn about upside vision, but it does not talk about upside vision. Okay. So that's on Amazon. Free PDF, the eight stages of upside vision, if you think you might have it or curious more about what it is. That, you could check that. You could go to my website, tom-matt,matte,.com.
And if there's also if you wanna sign up for a session there. But, we're changing. And if you know somebody that says they have this, they're not out of their minds, probably.
[01:00:53] Unknown:
Alright. Outstanding. Well, you you gave all the information out there we I was gonna ask you next. So our next guest is is waiting out there in the wings. So, what we're gonna do, we're gonna we're gonna sign off here with with, with Tom Matt. Thank you so much for this. This was great. And, I, just do me a favor. If you could, just text me your website information because I didn't get that from from, the PR people. Yeah. So, so I can put that in the show notes so people can reach out to you. And, and and I would love to talk to you at some point, during the week here if we could, maybe over the weekend. If you have some time, I I would I'm really curious. I would love to get a session in with you and get a reading. Let's do it. Alright. Alright. Tom, Matt, thank you so much my friend. God bless you. Have a great one. Thank you.
Alright, folks. Wow. Amazing. Great conversation. I love that. I'm and I'm our next guest is here waiting in the wings. So what we're gonna do is we're gonna take a quick break here. I gotta use the restroom. Gonna take a quick break, and when we come back from the break, we'll get to, Pablo's Holman, who is waiting for us. And, folks, don't forget this is a live show weeknight 7PM central time. You can don't forget to like, subscribe, and share it with your friends, your family, and your followers. This way it helps us with the algorithm here, you know, try to get noticed and, really happy with the level of growth we've been experiencing over the last couple of weeks.
So download's been great. It's been fantastic. Audio, video side been really good, so thank you so much for all that stuff. And, let's let's keep the whole thing going. Alright. Well, with that said, we will be back here in, maybe three minutes or so. Alright. We'll be back. Stay with us. If I could find the break thing. Here we go.
[01:02:52] Unknown:
My fans, I have arrived. Me too.
[01:02:57] Unknown:
Melting your mouth.
[01:03:01] Unknown:
They look so cheery. You're an M and M. There's no point in wondering where your portraits are. Tasty, smooth, creamy, you're an M and M. It's alright.
[01:05:01] Unknown:
With peanuts or plain.
[01:05:06] Unknown:
Mike wonder. Mike wonder.
[01:05:48] Unknown:
I'd say that's a wrap. Alrighty, folks. Where am I? There we go. First hour is in the books. Moving into hour number two here momentarily. Great conversation there. Tom Matt. That was awesome. I was not expecting that. Really wasn't. Very interesting. Very interesting. Hey, folks. Pro HVAC, our solutions, leverages over thirty years of expertise to provide premier HVAC sales and sales and repair services. Specializing in both residential and commercial installations, our team of skilled technicians are dedicated to providing efficient heating, ventilation, air conditioning solutions for your home or business with a focus on quality workmanship and customer satisfaction, Pro HVAC Solutions ensures your comfort all year round. Contact Pro HVAC r Solutions today for reliable HVAC services tailored to your needs. Just visit prohvacrsolutions.com, pro hvac r solutions dot com. Alrighty.
Well well, let's make sure I set the audio set correctly. There we go. Alright. Alright. Now, next up here, we have Pablo Hohman, someone who quite literally builds the future. Pablo Hohman is a hacker, an inventor, a technology futurist whose fingerprints are on some of the most groundbreaking innovations of our time. He's helped launch spaceships at Blue Origin, pioneered three d pioneered three d printing at MakerBot, and even designed laser systems to fight malaria with Bill Gates with more than 70 patents to his name. He's one of the most prolific inventors in America. Today, he leads Deep Future, where where he supports visionary entrepreneurs tackling civilization scale challenges from sustainability to space exploration. Pavlos, welcome to the show.
Hey, man. How you doing? I'm doing fantastic. How are you? I'm rocking. You are a busy guy. I'm busy, but I like it that way. That's good. That's great. Now, I'm like like I told Tom earlier, in in the in the first hour, we didn't get all of your information from the publicist up until until, like, two maybe 03:00 this afternoon. So Oh, okay. So I'm not You don't know what you're getting into? No. I I did but I did do this though. I I did find you, and I did listen to a couple of your podcast, which were which were incredibly incredibly informative, and and I love the content.
And, a little bit I felt a little bit diminished in some of the No. No. Conversations you guys are having, but, you know, but that that's great. Like, one of the I think one of the, descriptions you put, you know, two geeks talking about, whatever it was.
[01:08:48] Unknown:
Yeah. Right. Okay. So Well, that's the my podcast is just nerds having long, deep conversations about technical stuff, and that's how I learn
[01:08:59] Unknown:
by picking other people's brains. So, you know, I record some of those and share them. That's the idea. Outstanding. So, I always like to start my interviews with a couple of basic questions. So if you've had a chance to listen to any of my shows, you maybe you've known them already, but if not, what's something about you what's something about you that most people don't know but should?
[01:09:18] Unknown:
Oh, man. Most people don't know. I'm an obsessed salsa dancer. So That is a first. Speak up in the middle of the night and dance salsa. You could do it anywhere in the world. You don't need to speak the language.
[01:09:32] Unknown:
It's great. That's awesome. You know, that's the first out of out of all my guests, you're the first one. I'm the first salsa dancer? First salsa dancer. That's awesome, man. I love that. That's that's great. So which You're in Texas? Where at? I am on, I'm on the pimple on the backside of Texas, the beautiful city of Eagle Pass. Okay. Which we are right down I love that one. We're right down here on the border. I don't I don't Okay. Know if you remember in the last administration, there was a confrontation over here at a place called Shelby Park. Okay. A little standoff between the state and the feds, and that is literally, like, a few blocks away from where I live. The state, actually. Oh, right on. Yeah. So Texas independence, buddy. We should just let Texas run the rest of the country. We should. We should. And you know something? It might just happen someday.
Another conversation, another another time. Alright. Fair enough. Yeah. So, what what's your go to beverage to help you unwind at the end of the day?
[01:10:24] Unknown:
End of the day. Oh, I'm I have Red Bull once a day, but I I don't know if that's unwinding. I don't drink any alcohol, so I guess my go to beverage at the end of the day is a milkshake.
[01:10:36] Unknown:
Well, that could be worse. You know? It it it could it could be Mountain Dew. Yeah. Well, I used to be on Mountain Dew. That's good stuff. I really like it. Mountain Dew, you know with sugar. Then the reason why I say it well, the reason why I bring it up is because so many people, that that when I ask that question, it's been all it's been like a trend. The last several guests have been Mountain Dew's, Mountain Dew's, Mountain Dew's.
[01:10:57] Unknown:
Wow. I thought it was kind of anachronistic. No. You know, there's so many energy drinks now that Mountain Dew kinda got pushed aside. Yeah. Tom Tom does, diet Mountain Dew. Oh, that's
[01:11:10] Unknown:
sinful. I I I I I'm not gonna disagree with you on that one, but, I'm not I, you know, I I
[01:11:17] Unknown:
I I went through I just can't I I don't think the the sweet the artificial sweeteners don't seem to be better for you than sugar. No. So, like, just it just go for the sugar. That's what I do anyway. The best You know? The best Coca Cola I've ever had has been was a Coca Cola from Mexico.
[01:11:33] Unknown:
Oh, yeah. Those are good. Because yeah. Yeah. Real sugar. It's casino is real sugar. Absolutely. Completely different taste altogether. There's a difference
[01:11:40] Unknown:
in the molecule in high fructose corn syrup, and I think that is causing some of the problems. I don't I'm not an expert in this stuff, but I've listened to some experts talk about it. It sounds like sugar is bad for you, but all the other stuff is worse. Yeah. Yeah. Well, everything in moderation. Right? That that I try to have just less sugar. That's why I switched to Red Bull. It's got less sugar than the shit I was drinking before that. Nice. Nice. Nice. But again, like I said, everything's in moderation though. That's that's I think that's the key to it, you know, just moderation. And I think if you use more natural things to begin with, you're better off than the synthetic stuff. So Probably right. So, so you've been called, one of the world's most prolific
[01:12:18] Unknown:
inventors,
[01:12:19] Unknown:
but before I don't know if that's actually true. My team was for sure, because we we kinda turned invention into a team sport. Okay. And we got more patents than anybody, but I don't know if I'm in the ranking.
[01:12:31] Unknown:
You know, I probably only have, like, a 100 patents or something. So Yeah. But still, that's that's quite an accomplishment. But, but so but before all the patents and the TED Talks and all that stuff, who was Pavlos Hohman?
[01:12:41] Unknown:
Oh, before all that. So I'm a computer hacker. So so version Pavlos one point o was computer hacker, and, you know, what we were trying to do is, you know, just break everything and scare the shit out of people for for our own entertainment Nice. And and, you know, to take the moral high ground and show that we were smarter than everyone and that everything was totally insecure. And, that was what I was doing up through kinda through the nineties. And then, and then I sort of graduated to hacking everything else besides computers.
[01:13:15] Unknown:
Nice. When you look back, was there was there a single project or a or a particular moment that that shifted how you think about the future of technology?
[01:13:24] Unknown:
For sure. And the the one that is very clearly responsible for me is I mean, there's probably a bunch of those, but the one I really think it was the biggest was in 2001, we started Blue Origin. So that's spaceship company. Mhmm. And at the time, you know, there was no such thing as a private space program. Only governments could play that game. But Jeff Bezos had started Amazon and was worth $7,000,000,000. So we thought, hey. Maybe for what can we do with one of those billion? Maybe go to space. And so that so that was the idea. And and people think of this whole, you know, space race that's going on now is just like billionaires with their big swinging rockets having a pissing contest in space. But the truth is what I learned from working on Blue Origin with Jeff is that, you know, his vision is really about the future of humanity.
It's really about what happens in the you know, when, Earth is no longer viable. Like, it melts into the sun is kind of the best case scenario, if something doesn't get us before that. So you might wanna have some kind of plan b or planet b, and and a project like that would take thousands of years. And so what I what I really got out of that was that, you know, everybody around me was so focused on, you know, paying rent and getting their kids in college and quarterly earnings report and just such myopic stuff by comparison that it was super refreshing to be able to sort of think on these longer time horizons and work on a project that, you know, we might not see real success in on on that kind of thing for hundreds of years or thousands of years, but even that would start with one small step. And ours was to try to figure out how to reduce the cost of getting into space. And and that was twenty five years ago. And so, you know, now largely thanks to SpaceX, that's that vision is fully realized, of getting a getting kind of a highway to space. Blue Origin is catching up and helping out now with their new launch vehicles.
But the point is, you know, it took twenty five years, and these are still just in the beginning. And that's that's so that changed me, and now I really try to think on longer time horizons. I I I still I I can't believe it's been twenty five years since Blue Origin first came around. I mean, it I went to speak at Blue last month, and it was the anniversary. That's why I even
[01:16:14] Unknown:
registered it. You know? Pretty funny. But it's I I feel like it was honestly, I feel like it was yesterday that you first started hearing about Blue Origin, and I can't believe twenty five years have gone by so fast. Well, they were quiet. They they didn't talk about it much,
[01:16:27] Unknown:
you know, just because they didn't have anything to show for a long time. So now they've started being a little more public about their launches and things. Do you still have any involvement with the program? I'm not involved at all. No. I'm just a fan. Oh, awesome.
[01:16:41] Unknown:
Now you built tools that are I look at it like science fiction stuff, but, you know, like hurricane suppression machines, laser Yeah. Malaria zappers, and surgical technology. What what makes a problem worth solving for you?
[01:16:59] Unknown:
Well, that's that's a good question because if you're you know, we were trying to invent sort of in general, you know, figure out what problems we could solve. And it turns out that the bigger the problem, the better because invention is such a haphazard expedition that you're unlikely to succeed anyway, so you might as well go after bigger problems. And so we would try to find the biggest problems in the world and understand them and and see if we could help with them. You could it's just as much work to work on a small problem.
So we might as well start with the big ones, and that's kinda how I think about it. And and, you know, so we would so you get to some obvious things like infectious disease and feeding people and, you you know, for a lot of problems, it turns out you end up just ending up at energy. You know, if you try to take on solving something like, you know, recycling or climate change or something, well, you could maybe put a dent in those things, but you're gonna use a lot of energy to do it. So you might wanna go solve energy first. So a lot of what I work on these days, probably the biggest thing is energy. Awesome.
[01:18:16] Unknown:
Now when you're looking at a blank slate, a new idea, big problem, would you create a process for turning, I guess, a wild concept into a working prototype?
[01:18:28] Unknown:
Well, the the wild concept, you know, these things sound like wild concepts at the beginning just because you can't see them.
[01:18:41] Unknown:
Oh, I think we lost you.
[01:18:48] Unknown:
Now you're back. I'm in. I'm gonna I'm gonna go back to I'll go to, like, a less intensive video. Maybe that'll help. How's that?
[01:18:57] Unknown:
All good.
[01:18:58] Unknown:
I think when you're trying to do something new, it sounds crazy. It sounds like a wild idea because people haven't gotten to see it working before. And so almost all the things I work on have that nature about them. They sound like Pablo's doing some crazy high-tech stuff. But once you get them working, then they just flip, you know, acclimate to a new version of normal once they can see it and feel it and use it and get it, build a little bit of confidence in it. You know, a great example of that is if you are ever in a city that has Waymo, then, you know, these are the self driving taxi cabs. Mhmm. And it's so fascinating because you could take your friends in there, and as soon as the thing starts moving because there's no driver, they're, like, hanging on for dear life, and they're like, oh my god. It's driving. It's and then five minutes later, they've forgotten all about it. They're totally used to it.
They're just talking about where they're going for lunch. They never think about it again for the rest of their life. And so you could just see that transition in real time in in an experience like that. And and so something like that happens with every new technology when it comes to life, and it just takes a while to get it to come to life. But once it does, people internalize it really quickly. So, anyway, I'd say, you know, for me, I'm working on these things usually in the window that's kinda five or ten years before they can come to life. And it's and and the creative process is mostly about trying to figure out, you know, what's gonna keep us from making it happen. And that could be, you know, we don't know how to do it. Usually, we don't get started if we don't think we know how to do it. But it could be a regulatory environment or, you know, it's too expensive and we gotta get the cost down or it could be you know, we're gonna run out of money or, you know, things like that. Right. Right. We're gonna get squashed by something better. So you kinda have to navigate all those things at once, and and I think that's where most of the creativity is is once you once you have the invention and you know what you wanna build.
[01:21:14] Unknown:
Now let's talk about your book a little bit, Deep Future. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Because, I I I took a look at your website today, when I finally got a link to it. And and, It's so easy to find. Yeah. Well, actually, you know what? When they sent me the link Yeah. Before I even clicked the link, I I just put you into a search engine. And Okay. You and before I even finished typing your first name, you were the top of the list.
[01:21:37] Unknown:
Okay. Good. That's what I like to hear. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. So I'm
[01:21:43] Unknown:
Go ahead. You were just Trying to be trying to be available, you know? Well, yeah. I mean, it really easy to find and that was which was great. And then I got to look at some of the pieces that were the the articles and stuff that were up there about you and the information that was available about you. And then I checked out your website. I love your website by the way. It's very it's very Oh, thanks. Easy to navigate through. I mean, it's just like like one page really and it's it's I like that. It's very minimalistic and I don't know. I'm I'm kinda trending more on the minimalistic side of things lately. So so I I I don't wanna waste people's time, so I try to give them some meat right away. Oh, yeah. You do. You get a lot of good information in there and I was able to check out your shows and and, really like and then like I said, folks, I'm not b s ing because he's sitting here. I'm I'm being honest with you. If you this is he has really, really good content. You need to check it out. I know you're on Apple, you're on Spotify, you're on all the major platforms, so you need to check him out.
You're gonna learn something. I learned a few things today listening. I listened to the show about the earbuds, Oh. And the, automate or the the, the automated, clothes manufacturing. Oh, yeah. Good. That was that was Yeah. Those are real. Those are both things we're working on now. Yeah. And they were just it was fascinating to hear the the conversation about it too. And it's like, you know, you don't you don't think about all the work that goes into that. Into Mac well, especially, I was talking about the clothes too. That's that's the one I was able to listen to the most. You don't realize all the work that actually goes into that and and just the finesse and the and the and the fine detailing that goes into it, and the fact that we're building technology that can actually duplicate that, you know, what what the human hands can do. Because because you always say, I like to cook. Right? So so then Okay. And when I learned how to cook, I was I was taught that there's no better tool in your kitchen than your hands, you know. Right. And I'm sure that's the same in just any other, any other, manufacturing business or any anything like that.
But to understand now that we're we're actually developing technology that can duplicate Yeah. The finesse of the human hand Yeah. Is just blows me away. Well, that's it's an interesting you
[01:23:45] Unknown:
honed in on one of the real cruxes of where we're at with robotics because what we when we've tried trying to make robots is hard because, they don't have fingertips. They can't they can feel like ours. And what's crazy is they do have vision that's better than ours. So you would think that vision would be harder to solve than feeling, but it's been the other way around. And so robots have incredible vision, but they really don't feel. And when you think about what is a seamstress doing shoving fabric into a sewing machine, they're feeling just the most mind, you know, changes in how that fabric is stretching and flowing and warping. And and so, we haven't really been able to make robots. Like, we can't right now, we can't make a robot that feeds a sewing machine the way a human does.
That's out of the window of what we've been able to accomplish with robotics. Mhmm. But what CreateMe, the company that you that was in that podcast is doing is they've gotten around it by they've made machines that can instead of using a a sewing machine that does stitches, they're using glue the same way your iPhone is made. It's the guys it's the same kind of guys who made the factories that make iPhones. So they use bonding, and so they have a a look, kinda like an inkjet head, just puts down these little dots of glue on the fabric, and it keeps it all flat. And a and a robot can deal with flat stuff. And then once they've done all the stuff they can on flat, then for sleeves and collars and stuff, it goes on to a kind of a a jig that holds it in shape Mhmm. And they can bond the collar on. Things like that. So, yeah, they've come up with a bunch of clever ways of getting around the fact that robots don't really have fingertips.
Yeah. It Eventually, they will. But
[01:25:42] Unknown:
It's amazing. It it really is a technology that and and it just seems like technology is just growing faster and faster and faster. It's like Yeah. You turn around one day and it's it's it's completely different than it was the day before.
[01:25:55] Unknown:
Yeah. It's exciting. And and also because, you know, we're getting to a point now where the technologies can start going places that they haven't been able to go before. I think we've been in this world where the technology has been kind of unimpressive in a lot of ways for the last twenty years because all we're doing is making software. You know, we're making a lot of iPhone apps, but we aren't making new technologies. I gotcha. Yeah. So that's really starting to change, and that's why I'm so excited because now we get to use tech to go make clothes, like you said, and use technology to go, you know, solve inflammation in your body with an earbud. I mean, there's just crazy stuff that's possible, but Silicon Valley sort of gotten drunk on software, and it's been a long time since we got to bring these other kinds of technologies to life at a large scale. Right. And it's it's it's fascinating. And and Yeah. Just to tie back to your book. So, you know Yeah. Deep Future Creating Technology That Matters.
[01:26:54] Unknown:
And like I said earlier, I mean, you're you're a busy guy. When did you when did you find time to add author to your bio?
[01:27:01] Unknown:
I just wrote it on airplanes. A buddy of mine had done that, and he said, oh, yeah. I wrote my book on airplanes. I'm like, I'm on airplanes. I could write a book. So I I did that, and it worked out. Simple enough. Right? Yeah. But, yeah, the book is really, I mean, it's really accessible. I mean, it's not you don't need a PhD to read it. This is a book that tries to explain some of the big problems in the world and the technologies that we see coming Mhmm. That can help solve them. And that's really kind of a hopeful position to be in. You know? It's exciting because you read this book and you'll it's hard to not be excited about the future because there's so much cool stuff happening. And then along the way, I tried to, you know, explain a little bit about how we can make these things become real, and how do we invest in them, and how do we develop them. And and so people who wanna work on cooler technologies, hopefully, might might find a way to do that in their career. We need everybody it's kind of all hands on deck. We need all kinds of help. So that's what that book is about. And and,
[01:28:04] Unknown:
so far, people seem to really love it, which is very rewarding. Yeah. I just wish I would have gotten informate more information about you first. I would love to have read the book before you sat down. Yeah. We could do this again sometime. Oh, absolutely. For sure. I would love to do that. Yeah. So so in the book, which which story or chapter in the book challenged you the most personally?
[01:28:23] Unknown:
Oh, that's a good one. There's so the oh, man. Challenge me personally. Look. I I wanted to write a book that people would enjoy reading. Right? It can't just be all nerd stuff. I kinda like all the nerd stuff, but I forced myself to put kind of a part story from my weird career in each chapter. Since I've been on a lot of, you know, gone a lot of places and worked a lot of things most people never get to do, I figured I'd share some of that. Okay. And it turns out that's what people like the most. You know? I would have been fine with a book that was just robots and lasers and nuclear reactors, but people wanted to people really like that human connection, and I'm really trying to make these things that seem super complex into much more accessible, things that anybody could understand. And so, so those stories really help a lot. You know, there's a couple of, you know, there's a couple of stories in there from, you know, my experience as a parent with my daughter.
There's you know, it's such I don't know that they're challenging so much, but, you know, I definitely had wasn't sure what all I wanted to put in the book and had to grapple with that a little bit. But Sure. Yeah. It's and so the book ended up being pretty personal,
[01:30:00] Unknown:
but, that worked out. So how did writing the the book shift your, your own thinking about technology and and and what technology should aim to do?
[01:30:11] Unknown:
Yeah. The the theme of the book is creating technology that matters. Now it's not that I'm trying to tell you what technologies matter. You could decide for yourself what that is, but I wanna reframe what people think of as technology, you know, and help them see that, like, these are tools for humans to build our future. Mhmm. That's what it is. And, you know, we're gonna build the future with whatever tools we have. And if if our toolkit sucks, then we're gonna, you know, be pretty limited. And that has been true for lots of human history. Now we have the most extraordinary toolkit ever. So we ought to be looking at that and thinking, holy shit. We can build an amazing future now because we have all these possibilities. And, you know, we don't really live in a world where that that's the prevailing story. You know? People are are dealing with a lot of, you know, a lot of pent up frustration about the way things are going, but, you know, we have some volition in this. We get to choose what future we wanna build, and we have the tools to go build it. And so I'm trying to show people the ways we can do that. So there's, you know, there's things in there about about how we can save a million lives a year with kids who are dying of malaria and other infectious diseases.
You know? That's not a problem you and I have. Our kids are fine. But, you know, half of those kids are under five years old, and they live in the in countries where we haven't spent enough effort on trying to keep them keep them alive just at the very beginning. I mean, it's pretty sad stuff. So I don't I don't think this is controversial. Hopefully, anybody would agree that, like, probably worthwhile to, like, at least give these kids a fair shot at life like you and I had. Absolutely. And so and so, you know, if if we could develop a technology that could help, you know, eradicate the infectious disease or keep these kids from getting it in the first place or save them from it if they do, that seems to me like it's worth doing. And when you start tracing it back, well, what else is going on? Well, those kids don't have clean water. Why don't they have clean water? Well, you need a lot of energy to clean up the water. Well, where's that energy coming from? If you're burning coal, then you're polluting the air and cleaning up the water. So, you know, we gotta figure out, okay, how are we gonna make clean, cheap energy for everyone on earth? And so those are big problems that are really worth solving, I think, and we're the we're the folks who are good at doing new things. You know? We're in the position of being able to invent these things, to develop them, to get a bunch of rich people, to waste a lot of money on trying it out early on, get economies of scale up, and then set an example for how we want to the rest of the world to do these things. You know, if we can find a way of making energy that's cheap and clean, then we can export that around the world and really make a difference on these problems. And you could clean up the water and fix sanitation and save a lot of lives. And I think that's pretty cool stuff. I I do too. That that's that's it's it's noble.
[01:33:39] Unknown:
You know, it it's something it it it's securing the future. It's important work. It absolutely is. Now, I know we kinda touched on a little bit already, but, you know, for for people who aren't, or for readers of the book that aren't necessarily inventors or technologists, what what's Yeah. What what's what what's the one mindset or or, I guess, practice from the book that you hope that they would be able to adopt, like, immediately and and apply it to their everyday life, whether it's the job, community, you know?
[01:34:08] Unknown:
Yeah. I mean, one of the things I I'm trying to show in that book is, yeah, we need an inventor, and we need a scientist, and we need an engineer. But we've got those guys. What they need is everything else. You know? They need people who can do sales and figure out an HR policy and get, you know, the health care lined up and, you know, support customers and, you know, build a factory and make some stuff. Like, it's all hands on deck. Like, we need everybody to do these things. You know, if you look at Tesla or SpaceX, yeah, there's a bunch of guys with PhDs hanging out there, but 99% of the company is not that.
It's everything else. And so I think, you know, what I'm trying to show in this book is you can vote with your life. You know, you can vote with your career. Is the is the job you have now I mean, not to disparage anybody's career. Like, you know, if what you're doing is cool, keep it up. But maybe just think, you know, if what you're doing is making an iPhone app to have weed delivered to your dorm room by a drone, You know, once you're done with that, think of it as practice. That's a practice career. Now you know a lot. You know how to build a product and support customers and all the stuff that has to be done, but then take on a problem you don't have that a billion people have. Take on something that's actually cool and more important. And so I think there's those possibilities exist. And, you know, we're at a turning point in the tech industry now where we're getting to get a lot of these things started, and they're all gonna need all the help they can get. So I think there's a lot of opportunity for people to look beyond their current career and look at doing something they really believe in.
[01:36:03] Unknown:
Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Even with the skill set they have. Yeah. That's a great that's a great point. It really is. You you do you you like you said, you have you have you have the scientists, you have the invest you have the the inventors, you have the technology, specialists. You have all of that, but you need you need the foot soldier. That's right. You know, so you look at it like military terms. You have you have all the leadership, you have the generals, the colonels, all that stuff, but you need the actual grunt in the field to actually get out there and actually make the difference.
[01:36:31] Unknown:
Yep. I got the science. I got the invention. Most of the guys that for, not even just guys. It's a lot of women too, even the ones we invest in. Yeah. They're the technical people. They can't sell shit to save their lives. And I tell them that. I say, look. You know? We can't invest in this. You gotta find a frat buddy or a cousin or somebody who can sell some stuff and get them on the team. Then we have a business. That's the difference between a, you know, science project and a business is can somebody sell something. So, you know, I'm simplifying a lot, but you get the idea. I do. Absolutely. It's not just sales. It's a lot of other things too. So I'm one thing I'm excited about, like, the region you're in, I've been to, like, San Antonio, which is probably not too far from you. It's about three hours. Building all kind what's that? About three hours. Three hours? Okay. Well, Texas oddly bid. Yes. But, you know, even so, I don't know about where you're at, but, like, in San Antonio, it's amazing. People are building all kinds of stuff, big stuff. You know, they had all these military bases, and a lot of those people are in factories building stuff. It's so exciting. I think that's where, you know, a lot of the future of stuff is gonna get built is in places like that. So, you know, these are really important folks, and they have skills, and they can learn, and they can be helpful. And when we're trying to build humanoid robots or nuclear reactors or whatever we're doing, we're gonna need those folks to come help. And so, yeah, I think there's a there's a lot, and and I think it's important to just think about what world you wanna be in.
Is this and what world do you wanna leave for your kids? Mhmm. And is the job you're doing making that world better?
[01:38:12] Unknown:
And if not, like, maybe just try to figure out how you can help work on something you believe more in. Yeah. I, yeah, I agree with you on that. You know, I I have my own kids and, you know, I'm I'm always and a lot of times I I look at what's going on in the world geopolitically. You know, I don't wanna get into all politics and stuff, but but, you know, I look around what's going on in the world, you know, and I'm and I'm concerned about the world that's gonna be left for my children and my grandchildren. You know, I have three grandchildren too. I I don't, you know, I don't Wow. Cool. So, yeah, I'm I I I frequently think about these things. I I frequently concern myself with these things. And Well,
[01:38:48] Unknown:
I mean, look, I think there's a it's there there's a rationale for being informed. Right? So, you know, you wanna be educated. You wanna be honest with yourself about how things are going in the world. But I think most people are overdoing it in a sense. They're not gonna help with any of those things anyway. Yeah. Like, you aren't gonna like, you can't find that country on a map that you're listening to hourly updates about how the war is going. Mhmm. You're not gonna, you know, help save these hostages anyway.
You but you're following this story as if it matter. It doesn't actually matter to you. We want a world where that's not happening, but you're not gonna help. So every moment you spend, all the attention you spend paying attention to these scary stories from around the world is keeping you away from the thing that you actually can't help with. Mhmm. Right? So if you have something that is your mission or have something that you care about or have something you can help with, which might just be raising your kids. I'm not saying I'm not trying to tell you what matters. You decide for yourself. Of course. But the time you spend focused on all the bullshit being reported from all around the world, that's you're not that's keeping you from being effective. It's draining your capacity to matter in the world. And so I think people need to be more judicious and about how they devote their own attention.
[01:40:25] Unknown:
I agree with you. And, you know, as as far as I I I'm concerned, I'm not an isolationist Yeah. But I'm I'm a non interventionist. I Okay. In in addition to everything that you just said, because you were spot on, you know, it's also the amount of money that we're sending out to all of these places that Oh. That Oh, I see. You know, the the money could be much I I would rather invest the $40,000,000,000 that we just gave to Argentina for beef Oh, yeah. Here Right. In at home Yeah. To to help our own farmers and ranchers. Yeah. You know what I mean? So so I look at it like that. We we shouldn't be funding wars overseas. We shouldn't be funding.
There's there's no reason for us to have military installations in a 150 countries around the world. You know? I I I Yeah.
[01:41:17] Unknown:
It yeah. I mean, that that's a complex issue. No. It is. Absolutely. Yeah. I know I'm just giving a And I think it's and and, honestly, like, if you are any country in the world besides The US, it's a totally reasonable thing to be noninterventionist, and you can 100% go for that. Yeah. But the but there's a but the
[01:41:39] Unknown:
and and I think that we Oh, I wanna apologize first of all. Before you go on, I wanna apologize. My my my my little boy, my Charlie, my my my French bulldog, he's whine every every time I do a show at Yeah. At the 08:30 mark, he is at Oh, he's gotta go out. No. No. He's at the door. He's howling and and crying at the door because he he knows that the show is almost over and he wants to come in. Almost over. Okay. Cool. And he wants to come in and hang out. And I I can't let him. Oh, no. No. No. No. No. No. No. Okay. He'll be Well It'll be worse. So so I apologize. Oh, you don't hear him? Okay. Good. No. I don't think it's I think it's fine.
[01:42:15] Unknown:
Yeah. No. It's cool. But yeah. Anyway yeah. Look. I I get it. It's I I'm probably a noninterventionist to an extent too. I haven't really tried to draw that line exactly. But but, yeah, it's it's it's one of these things where I think in the book, I try to show people how to, you know, how to focus in on what they care about the most and how to and and and free them up to ignore all the other shit. Yeah. I mean, look. You weren't gonna save those hostages anyway, so forget about them. Mhmm. I mean, I'm like, it I it's I actually think that's okay. Right?
And I know that they're very important to save them and all this kind of stuff, but the but the truth is you're taking yourself away from the thing that you could actually have an effect on. Exactly. And we and you gotta be ruthless about that. And so, yeah, that's just one of the things I think, you know, matters to for people if they wanna make it make their life Make your if you wanna make your vote count, wanna make the the vote of your life count, then you've got to be ruthless about use aiming at it, the thing that you can make a difference in.
[01:43:33] Unknown:
Yeah. I I agree with you. I I do. Now now I wanna get into AI a little bit and, and and things like that because that obviously, that's a huge thing right now. Right. I saw an article today that Amazon, let go of, like, 30,000 corporate level positions and with the intention of replacing it with AI. So, you know, that's a big that's a big thing. And you were working with AI long before
[01:44:01] Unknown:
Amazon's
[01:44:01] Unknown:
scale is so vast that 30,000 isn't that big of a dent. Oh, no. No. Not not really. Yeah. I mean, when you think they have over a million, partners spread out around the world, is what the article said anyway. I don't I don't even think I have it here. Well, I do actually. Let me see.
[01:44:18] Unknown:
And, and, you know, I think some of these numbers are skewed because it's they're also talking about reducing hiring for those kinds of positions going forward. It says the article here says,
[01:44:34] Unknown:
where to go, Amazon employs a total of approximately 1.5 milli 1,550,000 people as of June 30. That's huge. That's huge. So so 30,000 is less than 1%. Yeah. So the corporate workforce, which will be affected by the 14,000 job cut, compromised 350,000 personnel representing 4% reduction in the segment. Interesting. In the segment. Okay. Yeah. So it's inter it's interesting.
[01:44:59] Unknown:
I think that's you know, Amazon's job is to figure out how to do what they do Agreed. As efficiently as possible. And there are times when it's not very efficient, so you throw manpower at it. So I don't think it it's reasonable to expect any job to be permanent. Mhmm. You know, computer nerds are oddly the first people to have to relearn their job. Like, if you are working in with computers, you every two years, you learn a new database, a new language, a new operating system, a new, you know, toolkit because it's been it's always a moving target. And I think, you know, we have a lot of people in corporate America who've gotten kinda complacent about their jobs. They think they're entitled to do to have the job.
A lot of them are doing work cosplay. They're not actually working very hard. So and I know there are some in Amazon. So, you know, there I don't know, 30,000 of them, but, you know, there's definitely some excess people there. Oh, I'm sure. Working very hard. I'm sure. So so I think, you know, these companies, it's very important for them to clean up their act and become more efficient. That's important because we have a lot of hard work that needs to get done. We need people to step up and do a better job. You know, you can see these, you know, these extreme cases in Silicon Valley, like, you know, like when Twitter got taken over and went from 20,000 people to 2,000 people. And as far as I can tell, it's just working at least as good or better. Yeah. So what did 18,000 people do?
You know? I don't know if Amazon is could handle that same ratio, but lots of things probably could. And and so I think people need to get you know, if you if you are in a job where you can't see how your work matters and you're just taking a paycheck, it's not just who who cares if it's immoral or unethical. It's soul crushing. Like, that is you wanna know why you're depressed or pissed off. That's why. Like, you don't do something meaningful. That's not gonna work. Humans are evolved to be needed by the people around them. Like, you need to be needed. Mhmm. So find a new job. That's what I think. Which, like, actually kinda leads into my question I I was gonna ask you is that so,
[01:47:29] Unknown:
so so so what do you think about people who worry about that technology is moving faster than our ability to adapt ethically?
[01:47:37] Unknown:
Yeah. I mean, look, it's it's a tough thing to stomach, and I think, you know, you need to be compassionate with people. I'm obviously not it's right before dinner for me, so I'm not being very compassionate. But You're hangry. Right? But but yeah. You got me got me in a hangry moment. But, look, I think, you know, it's a it you need to be able to, you know, start with compassion, help people because their their brain is not built for the transitions that they gotta make. And so that's hard, and a lot of them aren't ready for it. So I think that keeping that in mind, a lot of the point of bringing these technologies to life is to make things better. There's a life cycle to that. Mhmm. Right? So we're probably in, like, junior high with social media.
Still poorly behaved, kinda pimply, like, don't quite have it figured out, saying some dumb shit, you know, whatever. AI, we're not even in preschool yet. I agree with that. But when you look on the longer his a longer timeline, like, we're pretty good with spreadsheets. We're really good at hammers and fire and other dangerous stuff that everybody has access to. Even cars. You know? Cars are really dangerous. We let, you know, 16 year olds drive 4,000 pounds around and aim it at whatever they want. Like, that is really dangerous. And and so but we have a mature relationship with it. Right? We've learned no one's freaking out about cars anymore because we've gotten used to them. We figured out how to kinda contain the risk more or less. Where's the where's the trade off? We've set those things societally. We're all used to it. So, you know, now but we're not used to it with, like, self driving cars. So people are more freaked out about self driving cars than they are about cars.
Mhmm. Well, cars are, like, a thousand times more dangerous than self driving cars. But people don't use math in their little brains. You know? They use they use emotions that come from some other part of the body. So, look General's breakdown. It's just you gotta be honest about these things and and try to reason your way to your beliefs, and that's just not natural thing for people. But the technologies are moving faster because we got past a couple of major bottlenecks. So now we have this period where we're gonna be accelerating and and bringing a lot of new technologies really fast.
And, you know, you can you can actually kinda kick back and ignore it if you want. I don't think that is very exciting. I mean, I think it's actually kinda fun to go learn about these things. Try them out. You're not gonna hurt anything with AI. Just go poke at it and see what it does. Yeah. And and if you find a way to make and a lot of these things, the the ultimate goal is to make your life better. Like, all these AI companies, the reasons they're worth trillions of dollars is because we think we can see how they're gonna make your life better. If they fail at that and they aren't making your life better, you're not gonna make enough money, and they're gonna tank anyway. They'll get what's coming to them.
But they have to make something that's so useful for you that you can't not pay for it. That's where they're at. And we want that. You know? You should want that. You know? We wanna go look at the there's a new robot. I think it's called, X one or what's the name of the company? The the robot's called Neo, I think. They just announced it today. So there's videos of this, like, robot that just walks around your house and cleans up messes. Pretty great. You know? Like, you're gonna want one of these things. And and and the thing is, it's just these these things are coming.
It's gonna make that robot is gonna make so many awesome fail videos on TikTok for, like, the next three years. Right? Everybody who gets one is gonna be following it around with their camera phone all day long, trying to catch it, tipping over, doing something stupid. Absolutely. Yes. That's but then but in but then but over those years, it's gonna learn how to handle every weird edge case, and it's gonna get to the point where it's really rock solid. It's better cleaning up your house than than you are on Adderall. Get like a seamless integration. Yeah. And so that's exciting. And, you know, you could help. Get one of those robots, have it try to wash dishes, you know, file bug reports every time it fails. You know, you can help make it better. I mean, that that's kinda what's going on is there's a transitionary process that developmental
[01:52:22] Unknown:
it's like raising a kid. You know? We have to go through these stages. We can't just skip from preschool to college. So Yeah. You're you're That's the thing. Yeah. Your three year old doesn't know what your 10 year old's gonna know, and your 10 year old doesn't know what your 16 year old's gonna know.
[01:52:37] Unknown:
Totally. Yeah. So have some fun with it, and, you know, don't freak out. It's it's not it's not
[01:52:44] Unknown:
a existential crisis. You know? I always used to say my my kids were my experiments.
[01:52:49] Unknown:
Yeah. Good. I mean
[01:52:53] Unknown:
yep. Mine just turned 18, so I'm a pre range adult. There you go. You're getting there. My my my oldest is 29. Just turned 29. Oh, wow. Oh, wow. Good work. And she gave me, she gave me three beautiful grandchildren. And, so I'm very very proud of smart smart girl too. I mean, I don't know where she got it from. It wasn't wasn't from me. Alright. She graduated, she graduated while she was pregnant with baby number two. Alright. She worked full time, and she and she graduated from Columbia University with her MBA with honors. Wow. Very, very impressive. Great. Very proud of her. She's pretty her to get these kids out of the house so we can get her back to work. Yeah. Well, no. She's still working too. She's Still working great. Her her and her husband, they they they give the they give they give my grandkids a beautiful life. So I'm very happy. Wow. Good work. And then, my my son is 26, and I kinda wonder if he's gonna make 27 sometimes.
But but, yeah. And he's doing great. He he lives up in Pennsylvania. My my daughter lives up in New York. I'm from New York originally. I'm not from Texas. Okay. So Yeah. So it's been, you know, I haven't seen them in a bit personally. I mean, I have photos and videos and stuff like that. Yeah. But not, like, personally. But, you know, everything I try to do, I try to do with them in mind. And, Yeah. Yeah. I get it. And, like I said, I I experimented on my kids. They were great. You know, they they were good subjects, and, you know, they did they they they somehow managed to, be successful and everything. So I didn't do too much damage along the way. Yeah. Somehow mine turned out pretty well too, but That's great. That that is great. In spite of me. So yeah. Exactly. Good point. In spite of me, they did very well. Yeah. So last question on on AI stuff.
As far as, like, like, how AI is, the create affecting human creativity over the next, say, decade or so, then you think it's like Yeah. Distortions, I mean, how do you see that shaping all of that creativity?
[01:54:46] Unknown:
You know, I just did a TED talk, and, I had AI make all the slides. Every slide is a bobblehead that AI made for me, and I couldn't do that. Mhmm. I don't know how to make a bobblehead. I don't know how to draw one. I never could do it. I can't draw at all. But I had this story I wanna tell. This this TED Talk hasn't gone live yet online, but it but I was able to share the story the way I wanted to. I was able to show these images that I had in my head, but now I could show them to people. I was able to put that together pretty quickly because I could just sit there and talk to AI and say, make me a bobblehead of Brad Pitt.
And it does it. You know? Right. Yeah. And it looks and it's actually amazing. So, like, I'm able to steer this thing to tell the story I wanna tell. AI has no idea how to tell the story that I wanted to tell. I'm creative about the story I wanted to tell. Mhmm. That's what I created. I didn't create the bobbleheads, but they were a little they were a little, you know, set pieces or actors in my storytelling. Yeah. And I couldn't have done all that without the AI. So I'm using it to expand what I can do. You know? Otherwise, I if without the AI, I would have said, oh, man.
It's too much work to make slides, to tell this story. I don't have time for that. I'm gonna have put it off until I'm retired. You know? So I think that that's a pretty good way of thinking about it. Most people you know, you might be good at one thing, but you probably suck at a bunch of other things. So the AI is gonna be there to help you out and help do the things that you suck at. Mhmm. And, you know, that's what you would do if you were rich. You'd hire people to do the things you suck at. Right. Most of us aren't rich enough to hire people to make bobbleheads or whatever thing that we need, you know, or clean up the house or whatever. You know? There's a lot of things that you're having to do. And, you know, yeah, it's character building, but, you know, I don't think it's working. Like, most people don't have enough character anyways. There's gotta be some other way to do that. That's a great point. So we gotta we gotta figure out how you do that. So I I don't think it's fair to blame the AI for eroding creativity. These are tools to help you be creative. You know? A piano is a way to help you be creative with music.
Yeah. That's what it is. It's a tool for you. And, you know, you have to spend years learning to play a piano before you're gonna do anything creative with it. Yeah. Well, now you could just go to an AI and say, hey. I can't play piano, but will you make me a little tune that sounds kinda like this thing I'm humming? And then, I got these lyrics, and I wanna make a song about this, but I can't find a word that rhymes with mom's spaghetti. So, you know, there's kind of a game to play here and and where you can start to use these things as team members. You know, use them to help you out, and and that's creative thing to do.
So I think it's democratizing for creativity. Right? Before, you know, only people who could draw could make images. Like, I one thing I love I'm excited about this. I haven't done this yet, but I'm looking forward to. I love infographics. I love it when somebody can tell a story about data in a graphic format and show me, like, you know, here's how many windmills there are in Texas versus Alaska, you know, and you see it visually. Mhmm. Well, now we can have AIs help make those for us. Now I wanna play with that. I wanna have it say, like, have it make me an infographic for for the things I'm working on. So I just but that's just what I wanna do. You know? You anybody could pick something. And so I think this is a exciting moment because now even though I can't draw, I'll be able to make infographics. And maybe I'm not maybe they're just for me. You know? Maybe I'm making it to show other people, but maybe it's just like, I wanna get this idea in my head. Let's do an infographic because that's what I understand.
[01:59:17] Unknown:
That makes sense.
[01:59:18] Unknown:
Yeah. So there's just so much cool stuff happening. I think getting too wound up about about, you know, how, like, AI is gonna I mean, yeah, you if you get use it as a crutch and you don't learn to play piano, then you're not gonna have that skill, but maybe you'll use that time to build some other skill, like the skill of piloting AI piano players. You know? Interesting. Yeah. So that's and and, honestly, like, I think a easy way to contextualize this is just think about what would rich people do if well, you know, like, what would I do if I was rich? I hire somebody to clean up the house. I'd hire somebody to wash the car. I'd hire somebody driving around. I'd hire somebody to play the piano, and I would just sit here and think of cool shit for all my minions to do. Well, now you can.
[02:00:08] Unknown:
You have the ability now. You can do it. Yeah. That's awesome. Exactly. Well, it's kinda like like the
[02:00:14] Unknown:
the I wanted a picture of myself with a reptilian at the ranch wearing cowboy hats, and I used AI to create that. And it came out fantastic. It was great. Yeah. You know? Easy. Yeah. And right now, that's useless shit. I mean I mean, it's Yeah. Of course. Yeah. But but when you can imagine here's the here's another way to think about it. Have you ever had in your life an idea for a product or a project or something that you wanted to do, but you didn't have the time or money to do it? Sure. Every I'm sure everybody has Everybody has something. Yeah. Well, as as AI evolves, it's gonna be able to do that for you. Mhmm.
It's gonna be able to do that for you. And what kind of awesome world is it gonna be where, you know, you can just dream up an infomercial product? It'll make it'll design the product for you. You can give it some feedback to make it better or different. It'll make the whole infomercial for you, and then you can click buy now and get one three d printed and mailed to you. And even if nobody else in the world ever buys it, like, you've gotten to have that whole experience. Like, I don't know. I just think this is, like, such an exciting
[02:01:27] Unknown:
evolution. There's huge potential for it. There's Yeah. And the on on the positive and the negative sides. But, you know Yeah. And and you get Yeah. Because other assholes are gonna make infomercial products that suck, and they're gonna Yeah. Spam the world with them and whatever. But Yeah. It's my AI versus yours. Yeah. Exactly. Alright. So I know it's getting late for you over there, and you're getting hangry, and I got Charlie I got Charlie getting hangry outside the door here. So, Cool. So, last things. What do you hope that people take away from this conversation tonight?
[02:01:55] Unknown:
Well, look. I know I'm being a little bombastic, but the truth is I I think, what matters is, you know, that we are gonna build our future, and we really get some volition in this. I'm trying to show examples of that both in the book and on the podcast and that kind of thing. So I'm trying to, you know, indulge. But, you know, we also invest in these inventors, and I try to get more of these things brought to life. So if you find somebody with crazy hair and a DeLorean,
[02:02:29] Unknown:
send them my way, and we'll we'll sort them out. Alright. Outstanding. Alright. So where can the audience go to find your book and more information about you and follow your work?
[02:02:37] Unknown:
Yeah. All that's on our website that you described. So it's deepfuture.tech,tech. That's a good place to start. The book's there, the podcast's there, all kinds of random stuff, and, yeah, that's the best place. And we have email list that's really good. So get on the email list to the WhatsApp group I think I'm on it. And see what's happening. I think I'm on the email list. So,
[02:02:58] Unknown:
I I know I signed up for it today. Yeah. Yeah. So Okay. Alright. Outstanding. And, hey, Pablo, anytime you wanna come back on the show, please just let me know. I'd love to have you back on. Especially after I especially after I get a chance to read your book, man. I I I I I'm gonna order it and Alright.
[02:03:12] Unknown:
The audio book you'll like because I read it myself. Oh, cool. Yeah. I'll check that out. That wasn't hangry. So
[02:03:18] Unknown:
yeah. Outstanding. Alright. Pavel Solman, thank you so much, man. I appreciate you being here tonight. God bless you. Have a great night. Enjoy that dinner. You too. Alright, brother. You too. Take care now. Alright, folks. Pablo's home, and I hope that was that was a great I love that talk. You you know what? I'm gonna tell you honestly, you know, in in even though we we didn't get all the information that we normally would have for our guests, I didn't know what to expect walking into this tonight with either of the guests, and this absolutely I love this conversation tonight. I think we had a I think we had a great time. Two great guests, and I hope you guys got something out of that tonight. And, I hope you're gonna go and, you know, and share the show and let everybody else see this thing. This was this was really good tonight. Alright. So just a couple of quick announcements before we wrap up for the night. So don't forget to head over to the website, joeroos.com, sign up for the programming announcements email list that we have. Don't forget, this is not it's not a sales pitch. We're not gonna send you anything you don't want. We're just gonna send you information about upcoming shows, guests, schedules, whatever it might be, any little thing that changes, whatever it is. So get yourself on the mailing list, jo roos dot com. Little window is gonna pop up on the screen there. Just fill it out. Get yourself on the mailing list. It's free, which means it don't cost you nothing, and it's, it's it's really informative. So just get on the mailing list. Alright? Stay in the know.
Also, wanna remind you about the upcoming events coming over here in Eagle Pass. We have the Eagle Pass Public Library is hosting its Halloween event on the twenty eighth. Well, that was yesterday. I didn't take it off my notes. I am so sorry. Forget that. Yesterday's event went very well from what I understand. Okay. Sorry. Oh, I've got to take it out. Alright. The veterans food drive though, that's that's very important. That's coming up. That's November 3, 7AM to 12PM at the Maverick Food Pantry, 1823 South Veterans Boulevard. And if you want more information about that event, you can always call (956) 251-9093.
That's (956) 291-9053. If you wanna help out, you wanna volunteer, you wanna more some more information about it, very important, we need to support our veterans. Alright? We need to support our veterans. I mean, our veterans, men or women, doesn't matter, put their life on the line to defend your freedoms, my freedoms, every single day. And they are very often overlooked, and until recently the government did a very very poor job in taking care of our veterans. I think our veterans should get everything for free, to be honest with you. If any if anybody in this country is ending for free, it should be our veterans. Abs without a doubt.
You could disagree with me on that one, I don't really care. That's just my opinion on it, and you could drop a comment down below, let me know what you think. Alright. So the veterans food drive right here in Eagle Pass on November 3, 7AM to 12PM, or while supplies last at the Maverick Food Pantry on 1823 South Veterans Boulevard. Check it out. Alright? Very, very, very important thing. Alright. Socials, you wanna follow us on our socials on, you can get us on, on on Twix at Joe Ruse. It's right up there on the screen. Truth Social, Joe Ruse. Minds at Joe Ruse. Facebook, Joe Ruse Show. Instagram is not Joe Ruse. TikTok is jo dot ruse. And Getter is at Joe Ruse. Shout outs to our executive producing team, Wayne Rankin, Rosanna Rankin, Carolina Jimenez, Marissa Lee, and of course, anonymous Angela. Thank you guys so much for what you do. Your time, your talent, your treasure, greatly appreciated, incredibly thankful for it. So again, guys, just the best. I love you guys. Thank you so much.
Also, I just wanna give another another thank you and shout out to John Seeley for his donation this week of $25. Thank you so much, sir. Appreciate that. And I know I knew I recognized the name, John. I I knew I recognized your name, and, so again thank you for for your donation. I I remember you followed the other show and, it's it's been great that you were able to come back this way and find us again. So thank you so much for that, buddy. I appreciate it. And again, thank you for the donation. It's it's it's greatly appreciated. Now if you wanna help us out, you could always do a donation, a one time donation of 25 of, of any amount. You could do a recurring donation in any amount. You could also join up as a producer of the show. You could sign up for associate producer at $17.76 a month. Producer is $18.36 a month, and executive producer is $25 a month or more recurring donations. Okay?
All producers get the shout out on every show. They get included in all of our show notes. They get anything that we send out from the show. Your name is in there because you are producing this show through your contributions. Alright? So all of that is included in that. And then as an executive producer, you get to book a segment on the show with us live. Now we normally do our Wednesday nights with Wayne, but Wayne has been under the weather. He's not feeling great. He's recovering well. I heard from him today. Gonna keep him in prayer. He went for some tests today to get some results on at the end of the week. So let's keep him in prayer. Let's let's let's, let's let's get him back here on the show. We miss him, and, we look forward to having him here again very, very soon.
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Alright. And don't forget, folks, you could also find this show on all of your podcast wherever you wherever you get your podcast, this show is available to you there. You wanna check out the videos, the replays of the videos or the or download the videos, we're on Rumble, which is which is our home. We love Rumble. Rumble is our free speech platform, so check us out on rumble.com/joerus. You can also find us on YouTube at youtube.com/@joerus. We're on Twitch. We're on x. We're on Facebook. We're all over the place. So no excuse not to catch the show, so make sure you check us out. And listen, if you if you do check us out on on wherever platform it is, if you have the ability to do so, drop a review. Let us know. Like, subscribe, share it. Send it out to your friends, your family, your followers. Help us to grow this thing. Help us to get the word out. And, help us to build the audience. We've been doing really good. So, really really really very pleased and, you know, we're getting there. We're getting where we wanna be. So let's let's let's work on it together. Alright, folks. Alrighty. I think, I think that's it. Charlie is really howling at the door here. So we're gonna say, good night. So again, folks, thank you again for everything and for being with us tonight. Thank you to our guests. Don't forget to follow the show and, head to the website, joerus.com.
Let us know what you think. Alright, folks. Make Texas independent again. Go podcasting. Keep a steady stride. Keep talking. We'll see you Friday, have a good night folks.
[02:10:43] Unknown:
Weather. Happy trails to you to remain
One 73467321476 Charlie three 2 78977764376. Walk when I have plucked the rose. The o gray hot. Longing still for that which longer nurseth the deceit. In faith, I do not love
[00:03:38] Unknown:
That's an interesting twist. Transmitting live from the asylum studios deep in the bowels of Southwest Texas, it's the Joe Ruge Show. The show where we talk about anything and everything. Where nothing is sacred, nothing is watered down, and nothing is PC. Alrighty. Hey, folks. This is Joe Roos. It is great to be with you once again, transmitting live from the asylum studios from the pimple on the backside of Texas, the beautiful city of Eagle Pass, and doing the very best that we can to bring you the best quality talk radio we could muster without all the bluster.
Welcome to the Joe Ruse Show. Forgot to put the phone on. Do not disturb. Sorry. Well, it is Wednesday. And as you know, folks, if there's one thing about the Joe Ruse Show is this. Something always happens right at the beginning to mess it up. And I forgot to put my phone on do not disturb and that's what did it. But that's alright, we recovered and we are back in good shape here. Alrighty, folks. Guys, I hope you guys had a good week so far. It's midweek. It's hump day, if you wanna call it that. To me, this is the, fourth Monday of the week. You know, because Sunday is Monday. Sunday is Monday light. And then you have Monday, Monday. Then you have Monday. You have Tuesday, Monday. Now today is Wednesday, Monday. The only day that's not a Monday is Saturday, but then that's pre Sunday, Monday light.
Make sense? I don't know. It made sense to me when I was thinking about it, but it's okay. It doesn't have to do. It's fine. Man. So we got a lot of to talk about tonight. We got two great guests that will be joining us here momentarily. But as always, before we get into anything that has to do with our guests, we have housekeeping and all that stuff, bills to pay, and, you know, the usual stuff that we do. So, let's, let's get into that. Folks, I wanna tell you about one of our sponsors here tonight, podholm.fm podholm.fm.
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We have a media player on our website that is also streaming the show audio live right now. And, you can get that from Pod Home as well. And you know what? If you don't have a website, you can get one from Pod Home. Pod Home will set you up with your own website. Very, very easy to use, beautifully designed sites. They are fantastic. And, you know what? You're not gonna even pay extra for that. You get everything. Everything for one affordable subscription of $15.99 a month. That's $15.99 a month. It's great platform. I've been on it now for about three years. It it just keeps getting better and better and better, and now they've added their own, podcast player.
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That's podhome.fm. Okay. Also, would like to mention our new sponsor that we had just recently brought on. That's TNE Energy. TNE Energy. Electricity is essential folks. You need electricity. And at TNE Energy, they make it affordable and personal. There are over 1,000,000 subscribers across The US that trust them with their homes, their energy for their home, to power their homes, and free energy for referring their friends and family as well. You can visit tne.energy and explore all of the options that are available to you for your home today. Check them out. Great company. As a matter of fact, Monday, on Monday's show, we had the, CEO of t n e dot energy here with us in the studio, and that was a lot of fun. We had a we had a great conversation, a lot of laughs.
Great guy. You're gonna like it. So check him out. T n e dot energy. And, also, if you wanted, you could also email me directly about it, and I'll be happy to refer you over that way. So t n e dot energy. Find out what plans are available for you. Alright. Also, don't forget, head over to our website, joroos.com. Joroos.com. And when you get over there, open up the contact form. Look for that little section we have up there for contact us. Open up the form. Send us over any questions, comments, cares, or concerns that you have, any issues, any complaints. Actually, no. Don't don't send the complaints. If you have any issues, any concerns, send them on over to us. Let us know what you're thinking. We love to hear from you guys. If you have any suggestions for a guest or a topic you'd like to talk about, let us know. We try to to to accommodate everybody as much as we possibly can. So let us know.
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And, usually at the end of the show, I lay out all the different ways you can help us out. You can even become a producer of the show through a monthly recurring donation. And, we'll work all that stuff out, toward the end of the show. Alright. Now, with all of that great stuff said, we are going to bring in our first guest tonight. Now tonight, we'll be diving into a story of transformation, perception, and potential with Tom Matt, a man whose life changed in ways even science is still trying to understand. Once a successful Atlanta ad agency owner and devoted family man, Tom's world turned upside down thirteen years ago when a personal crisis brought him to rock bottom. After his journey back to health and sobriety, Tom experienced a profound shift in how his brain functioned, unlocking a new kind of perception he calls Upsite Vision.
The ability to see holographic images that reveal subconscious thoughts, hidden truths, and untapped talents. Over the past twelve years, Tom has refined this gift into a consulting practice, Upside Vision Consulting, where he helps individuals and organizations decode the unseen uncovered potential and spark meaningful growth. His work bridges spiritual insight with cognitive science and is now attracting the attentions of doctors and researchers alike. Tom, welcome to the show. It's great to have you here. I'm glad to be here. Thanks for having me on. It is this is very, very interesting to me. I know we we kinda chatted a little bit before the show. I told you, unfortunately, we didn't get a lot of the information, about about what you work on, rather late in the day. So I couldn't really do too much of a background on it. So I'm just being completely honest with everybody in the audience.
But from what I have been able to look at, this is fascinating to me. It truly is. And, I'm really looking forward to getting into talking about this. But before we do anything like that, as always, I have a couple of questions I always like to ask our guests when they first come on the show. The first guest the first question is, is what is something that most people don't know about you but should?
[00:12:26] Unknown:
I don't like ledges.
[00:12:28] Unknown:
There you go. I don't know why they should know that. I don't like ledges. I don't mind heights, but I don't like ledges. Really? That's interesting. See, I remember when I saw the new I probably would have given you a heart attack when I was a kid growing up in Brooklyn. At my grandmother's house in, in in Brooklyn, we had, I when when they weren't home, so I can say this now because grandma's passed on, mom and dad has passed on, so I can I can say this stuff now? When they weren't home, I used to go up onto the roof. And this is a two family house, so it's a two, like a two level house, bit pretty big. And, I used to go up there, and I would freely walk the ledges Wow. Around the around the the the perimeter of the house.
And now, I am so deathly afraid of heights that I won't even go up on the roof.
[00:13:12] Unknown:
So Well, that's interesting. That's interesting because I didn't have this as a kid. Right? I didn't I didn't realize well, I didn't have it. So when when I was a jolt when I was on my honeymoon about thirty years ago, I was in, England, and I was in the, I guess, Saint Paul's Cathedral. And you're up two stories, And you're commit and there's one part of it where you go out in the middle of the cathedral and you walk around, and it's a stairway. It's a it's a ledge that's, like, just enough for a body to go around and look down. It's only two about 20 feet high, but at that moment, I had vertigo. It was like Alfred Hitchcock movie. Oh, yeah. Since then since then, I'm like, no. Height's no good. I can I'm fine in an airplane, but that is not okay with me. Not only not even a little bit. I I know what you mean. I I love the reference to the Hitchcock movie. There was another great movie too that's a it was a spoof of Hitchcock. It was put out by Mel Brooks. I don't know if you know this one called High Anxiety.
[00:13:59] Unknown:
Yeah. I do. I remember when it came out on that old. Well, so am I. I saw it, you know, when it came out. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I'm not that far behind you. To the theater. I'm really I'm not that far behind you. I don't let the color fool you, man. I I just dye this stuff. Right. Otherwise, I am all white. But, but, yeah. So, the the heights, I I can't do heights. I when I when I fly, the rare occasion that I do, I I have to get an aisle seat because I can't be near the window. I can't look out the window or anything like that. I'm horrible with it. I'm I'm like, I got blinders on. I'm just looking straight ahead dude. I can't. I hate heights.
I hate them. But, but, so another question for you. What is your go to beverage that helps you unwind at the end of the day?
[00:14:47] Unknown:
Embarrassing to say it. Diet Mountain Dew.
[00:14:50] Unknown:
Another Mountain Dew person. Wow. Diet Mountain Dew. It has to be Diet Mountain Dew. Okay. No. That's fine. But but it it's like I've been on the streak with getting guests talking about their Mountain Dew, addictions.
[00:15:02] Unknown:
Yeah. Yeah. It's I mean, it's a good drink. It's it's but my wife my wife's been drinking it since she was a child in the mountains of Virginia, Southwest Virginia, and she introduced me to it. And so it's always around, but now I real I drink it without her. I I will go to the fridge again at Dime Mountain Dew. So that's obviously not her anymore. This, this is a good drink. Coffee during the day, Diamandew at night. Well, I'm having my coffee now, and I don't know if you've noticed at the beginning of the show here, I I took a sip. Don't take a sip of piping hot coffee before you start to speak.
[00:15:33] Unknown:
Burn the mouth. But, but coffee's been my thing. I love coffee. I'm actually doing better with it. I I reduced it. I don't know. You know those big 64 ounce coffee Sure. Insulated things? I would drink, like, two, maybe sometimes three of those a day. That's hardcore. That is well, I used to work overnight, so I'm I'm used to it. So it doesn't really affect me like that. But I have been trying to. So this is this is what I do now. This is only this is number two for the day. So I went from two of those mon three of those monstrous big ones to just two of these a day. This is great. And That's a good one. And, but, my usual go to on the weekends, not not during the week, is, I I love a good bourbon.
[00:16:15] Unknown:
And so I'll, I'll I'll I'll crack a bottle, and I'll sit out in the backyard, have a cigar, a little bit of bourbon, and just kinda relax. And that's that's usually my weekend. And just one or two of those during the weekend. Yeah. I have a lot of friends that go do bourbon too. The thing the thing you're gonna find out about my story, I stopped doing all kinds of any kind of mind altering drugs thirteen years ago. That's part of why one of the reasons I'm here. So even if I actually, I didn't like bourbon. I was more martini vodka and stuff like that. But, but, yeah, when I came out of this crisis that I had, I I needed to stop using because that was part of what happened to my brain. You know, that's one of the reasons in the beginning why I thought I have this ability I call upside vision. Well, we're gonna get into that. Because, as I was reading, more about it prior to the show and then going through your your bio again,
[00:17:03] Unknown:
it really it's it's a fascinating thing. So why don't you take us back to the first moment that,
[00:17:08] Unknown:
you experienced what you call upside vision. What did it look like? What did it feel like to you? So let let me let's let me define it first, and then we'll do that. Right? Because I wanna I wanna make sure people listen get it. Because every time I say this, people have an immediate response. So I wanna get into the minds of the listener and tell you what it's not. So upside's vision is the ability to see and interact with holographic images that seem to be everywhere around me, around us. Right? Not only can I see them, I can interact with them and change them with a thought? If you've seen, there was a show on Netflix called The Queen's Gambit about nine about five years ago where the protagonist would lay on the bed, and she was a chess champion, and she could move the pieces. She would she would imagine them or she would see them. When I saw this, she would move them around, and she could plan her moves because she was a chess master. It kind of looks like that. If you haven't seen that, most people have seen the Iron Man with Tony Stark Mhmm. In his office when he's surrounded by all the holograms.
It's that clear and in focus, but I can't swipe left or right with it. Okay. So to be clear, it's not a vivid mind's eye. Right? It's not a, it's not good memory recall. And the reason we know this is because I actually had my brain waves tested at the Institute of Noetic Science. So there's an academic paper coming out later this year about what exactly this is. And the first time I had it was the last time I used. There you go. The first time I did it was the last time I did coke because I was addicted to coke. I had a real strong problem, and I I have I talk I will get into that in a minute, but, I wrote a book about this one unhinged year I had. I lost everything. But the last time I was on the couch and I did drugs, and I looked over and I saw four different things, literally just holograms. It was the back of a dinosaur, blood cells moving through a body. It was a slot machine and then the Grim Reaper. And even though I was using at the time, I knew instinctively. I don't know how I knew. I was like, I can see these, without being on drugs. I knew, you know, obviously, I was on drugs. I was high. I was like, I could do this without drugs. And as soon as I, you know, I came down, the next day, the day after that, I started seeing it, and I did could do it every day.
So I got clean and sober because I wanted to get my family back because, like I said, I lost everything, and and I was on a mission to find out what this was. If I'm tell if you this happened to you, first thing you would do is go to a clinician, and you'd say, get me an MRI, do some tests on something wrong. So I did that. I had two m different MRIs. There's no brain damage, no tumors, no lesions, nothing from the drug use. Thank god. And, yes, so there's nothing clinically wrong. After that, I was on a mission to find out. I thought people would know. I thought there would be some research or some academic somewhere would say that this is not on not completely unusual or something. I hadn't found anything. I couldn't find it re I I emailed hundreds of scientists. No joke. Neurologists, over the last twelve years. Finally, in 2023, I got out into Institute of Noetic Science, and we did some tests. And like I said, that paper's coming out this year. So that's what that's the first time I did it. That's what it looks like. I I as you're describing it, I'm thinking of there there was a movie that I saw,
[00:20:19] Unknown:
years ago. I think it came out in 2002, 2001. So A Beautiful Mind with Russell Crowe, where he he played, John Nash, mathematician. And in the movie, I I don't think it happened to him in the real life character, but in the movie at least, they showed that he was able to see mathematical problems and equations in almost like a holographic form. And I'm wondering if it was kinda similar to that. So that's great. That's a good reference because,
[00:20:48] Unknown:
even though yeah. I can see those. Yes. The answer is yes. And it's funny. I acquired in a better a better understanding of mathematics after this happened. Right? I was a business owner before. I had an advertising agency. Mhmm. So I understood numbers, percentages, and margins, and stuff like that. But I hadn't done algebra and geometry since high school. At after this, when my brain changed, I became like a visual spatial super ninja. You know how they do the test where you see what side of an image is? You could turn it. Oh, yeah. There's no there's no topological space or manifold or anything that I cannot see in my field of vision and spin it around and dissect it. So, and I use him actually in my book. I wrote Jesus Goes to Hollywood, a memoir of madness. I use John Nash as an example, because, you know, there's an element to that what I can do. So I use him as an example. So there was an, an improvement in cognitive ability, and there was an improvement about spatial awareness, which led to better mathematical understanding.
Now to be clear, I'm not a mathematician, but I do, have some skills in certain areas of mathematics that I never had before.
[00:21:54] Unknown:
How did you move from from, I guess, from that really, because that's a that's a very deep awakening experience that you went through to, to developing the upside vision, as and and and then from that into a and and using upside vision into a a structured consulting practice.
[00:22:14] Unknown:
Okay. So that was a long time. So let's be clear about that. Let's this is really important. I just started doing the consulting this year Okay. Because I realized that I can connect with someone else. Just Joe, you and I are talking now. I know what your voice sounds like, and you know what my voice sounds like. I've learned that if I'm given permission and that somebody wants me to, I can tap into this part of them that is radiating outwards. Right? It's almost like I'm seeing a part of their unconscious if they give me permission and they invite me in and say, yeah. It's okay to do that, like a waking dream analysis. But I just started doing that this year. We'll come back to that. So for twelve years, I was just realizing that number one, I could do it. I could see these images. Number two, I could change them with a thought. So you and I are talk let's say you and I were talking about how to make a pizza. Right? Let's say, you know, you you're talking about a fame the best pepperoni pizza in the world. You would think on that topic if I looked over and, oh, by the way, all I have to do is to shift my attention to get it there, to see them. Right? Okay. So you would think if I looked over there, it would be some form of what I'm thinking about when we're discussing a pizza. Now there's the 50% chance that it's that would happen. Just as again, 50% chance it could be an elephant riding a bicycle or something completely unrelated.
Now if it is an elephant riding a bicycle, right, I now I can engage with it. Right? It's like there's some kind of external intelligence that I have this communication with. Where that's coming from, we have yet to you know, we don't know. I know, like I said, when I tune connect with another person, I know it's coming from them. But where this one is, it's just floating around. I I like it to an antenna. Right? I am we're receivers. Something's there. It could be again, I we could speculate. But I once I see it, I can, I can exchange it all the same way once you hear something? But you and I talk, I hear what you're saying, and we can communicate. There's a part of my brain that can communicate whatever this, spiritual intelligence is, and it helps me navigate the world.
[00:24:19] Unknown:
Now are you able to, like, I guess, decipher what these these images that you're seeing are? Like, because you mentioned that you saw the Grim Reaper, you saw, an elephant, you saw Yeah. Yeah. Sure. And so sometimes so that's a great question too. And the answer is sometimes
[00:24:36] Unknown:
just like I'll I'll use something. I try to use something everybody can relate to. Most people, I think, maybe everybody, dreams. Right? When you wake up from a dream, it's like you were there. Mhmm. Right? Sometimes, you know, if you're worried about something, it's meaningful, but sometimes it's not. This is very, very much like that. The images that keep coming back, they seem to hold more truth than something that passes through. Right? So here's what I can't do. And, Joe, if you had this, I promise you you'd try to do this too. Because they're so clear and focused. Right? So I could watch I could picture the Kentucky Derby, and then you're like, okay. Wow. This is unbelievable. It's precognitive.
I was gonna bet on the Kentucky Derby. I tried this for the longest time in the beginning. That it doesn't work like that. It's not it's not precog. It's some even, again, even though it's clear in a focus, it's not like that. So, so that's interesting. So I again, we know it's not that, but the things that come back do hold some kind of awareness that can help guide me through life and the people I work with. You know, I've done hundreds of these over this year, and, you know, it's it's fun. It's extraordinary. It's it's not I'm not a therapist, so I don't wanna say that, but there isn't an analysis going on. I liken it to this when I work with people. I'm like the IKEA furniture of this space. I give you the tools. I give you the furniture, but there's still work needs to be done around the symbolism that shows up and the archetypes that show up. Another example you might say is, like, I'm a radiologist. I'll take a snapshot of what's there, but you still go to you should go to an expert. Or you a lot of people put the symbolism into AI, and they get good results from that.
So there's a lot of different things you can do with this, and it depends on business, move, relationship. There's so many things you can do with it. I would like to experience this just once. Just, you know I it's fun. Yeah. You know,
[00:26:25] Unknown:
now now, obviously, this isn't unique just to you or other people in the world. How about how many other people are do do you know of that deal with this? Or is there, like, a has better been a study done on this, like, percentage of post?
[00:26:38] Unknown:
My study is the first study. Right? So there's no date. There's no let's look up at the past first. Right? I was sure I was gonna find some kind of literature somewhere about somebody being see seeing these kind of things. I found nothing. Nothing. Nothing. One guy emailed me about some Muslim back in fourteen hundreds who said he had something like this, but that's the closest thing. So Interesting. So there's no historical information around this. Right? Now I'm the first, case study they've done. That said, I've talked about this on podcast over the last year Knowing that since my vision changed, right, and I thought mine was from drugs and changes in the brain because the clinicians said, well, something must have opened up in your brain and stayed open. I kinda thought that too. But guess what? That's that's not the thread that connects all the people that can do this to one degree or another, but it's some kind of trauma.
That's what activates this or change the genetic makeup or whatever it is, the mutation. And and some and they I I have a PDF. If people wanna get a free p it's free. It's called free PDF. It's called the eight stages of upside vision. These are the stages that I went through, to better these are the stages I went through, and I laid them all out. They're not and it didn't go through them in order, but it says you where you where you might be in the stages. Because even though some people can see them, right, they can't change them with a thought. Or some people can change them with a thought, but there's not there's not, like, this intelligence download. It's very it's nuanced. So it's really interesting. So people can do it, and I've got thousands of names. I they all can't do it. You know, I don't actually have a hard number, but I would say I would actually use probably close to a thousand. And I'm sure more than that. Clearly, more than that, but I haven't talked you know, I've only been talking about this on a podcast on podcast for about a year. And once the paper comes out, I think that's gonna get a lot more attention from popular science and general,
[00:28:33] Unknown:
general audience from bigger scientific people that like these kind of studies. Do you think that that this type of information is always there just filtered out by the brain?
[00:28:42] Unknown:
100%. So so think of so we have all the senses. There's a word I learned that when I was researching this. Right? There's a word called umwelt. I think I'm pronouncing it correctly. U m w e l t. It's the way a biological organism moves through the world, like the planet. So in other words, humans travel around Earth one way, elephants see it another, birds another, worms, fish. We all see the world in different way and experience in a different way, but it's still the same environment. Correct? Right. Now whatever happened, whatever opened up my brain, I am seeing my my visual senses have mutated wherever to see more of what is already there.
So there's and there's two parts of that too, Joe. Number one and I I I separate them. And I didn't separate them in the beginning, but the more I've studied it and live with it, the more it becomes clear. One of them is like this hidden biosphere that we can't see that's with us. So imagine compared to this microbiology. Right? We didn't know these we had we could see the very small items until Leeuwenhoek invented the microscope. Right? They were always there. We couldn't see them. This, I think, is the same way for this hidden biosphere that I'm I'm able to see. But, also, I access the the newest sphere or the Akashic record wherever this intelligence is. So they're both here. One is warier or closer. One is next to, and the next one is extra dimensional. And it's wild too. It's hard to articulate because I tell other people until we all get together and define it. It's just me trying to navigate this.
[00:30:21] Unknown:
It's it's I'm I'm, like, I'm listening to you, and I'm I'm fascinated by this. I I I I I would love to be able to experience this thing. And I and I and I know that you said a few minutes ago that that you you actually do, like, sessions with folks. Yeah. Right? So when you when you when you do these sessions, what what typically comes out? What comes out of those sessions?
[00:30:42] Unknown:
So let's say alright. So when I do it myself, right, when I'm doing this and I'm playing with that, because I it is a fun thing to do with myself, I can change it with the thought. Right? So I can sit there and, like, yo, well, I can have an idea or the best the best thing the most the biggest advance that I've made in my mathematics so I could see something, I would work on a math problem, and then I would get answers with help from this space. Okay. So now that's not what I do with people. When I tune if I was doing a session with a a person, the and it doesn't matter where you are. Right? It could be next to me, or it could be 500 or 3,000 miles, wherever. It doesn't matter. And and if you said, well, how is that possible? My answer is I have no idea. Quantum entanglement, that's the only thing I could tell you because I can't even begin to tell you, and I won't even try. But I could recommend people that I could refer you to people that have had great sessions. In any case, when we do this, I do a five minute reading. Let's say you're curious about a business deal that you wanna make. Right? You're like, alright. I want I've got a business deal. Is there anything standing in the way?
And and even though you asked that question, I'm telling you it's not precog, but what something is gonna come through. So, again, not mind reading. You cannot think of an, an animal, and I can see it. It's not your deepest, darkest secrets. Nothing you don't want anyone to know. It's this middle ground. It's like the waking dream state. Whatever is bothering you, you're unconscious, whatever is there, but, you know, you kinda put in the back, that seems to come forward. So back to the example. So if you're trying to make a deal, and you're curious about whether it's gonna go through, I'll do a first minute a five minute read. Let's and let's say you intentionally ask a question. You know, what's there? What what is what is radiating for me that's there? Now I could I've done this. I'll give an example kind of an example.
So there was a guy that there were all business deals. There was a the guy that I saw him, his shoelaces were getting cut by a a man. The same man walked around this whole outside of this bench area, and he was in front of him in a board meeting. Right? Same guy. So this is all happening, and I'm watching this. So I did the reading, and and I'm done. I'm like, well, that's kinda wild. You know? He's sabotaging you, but he's also in front of you at a board meeting. It's like, I know who that is. The the guy says this. I'm like, time out. You don't know anything. You clearly have an idea of somebody that you may be thinking about that might not be interested in this deal going through the same way you are. All because I'm seeing it clear and in focus, it does not mean that that is the guy. It means it's he's on your conscious or unconscious. And, obviously, by you saying you think it is him, you obviously think it's him. You should not go to him and say this. Now what I would suggest is maybe talk to him about it in a, in a in a, you know, a grown up way. And don't don't accuse. Just say, hey. Listen. I've had I'm having some thoughts around that. That's one example. People talk about relationships, and then we do it for an either a half hour, an hour. And it's really interesting. The longer the longer the more reads I do, it's wild how more things seem to come out.
The it's more like, there's a knowing. It's like, you know, it's like, if you and I were having this conversation for an hour, you would be more open to me at the end because we would trust each other. Sure. This really is very much the same way. And that's kind of, you know, fascinating. Don't get me wrong. You can get some good stuff in a half an hour, but that seems to be the case. Again, it's me seeing these things, and you and then by me saying it, you trust that it's true because you're like, oh, that's wild. And I've seen oh, let me give you another one. This is like a fun this is a this is a precog one. Right? So there's a woman. I do this thing, and there's a balloon a red balloon that comes down on the front of her car. And I tell her this is going on. And it doesn't make any sense, but like a dream. You know? You wake up from a dream. It doesn't make any sense. Three months later and I described the scene better than that, but you get the idea. Yeah. Three months later, she sends me an email. She said, you know how you said a red balloon came down on my car? It literally happened to her just like that day. It landed exactly where I said it was gonna I mean, where I saw it land on the car. So we are connected in ways that we can't even begin to understand, Joe. So I was thinking I I in my head, I was thinking that it was, well, maybe she maybe somebody bought her a car or something like that. They put balloons and something on it. You know? Like, you know, that's how people put bows and stuff. You know? It was mundane. It was mundane. That's what's so wild about it. I don't even know how to use it for that. But it the fact that it was so on point is pretty wild. Now the the sessions that you do, they typically last about an hour, you said? Yeah. Either thirty minutes or an hour. I'll do whatever they want. And a lot of people come just because they're curious. You know, they wanna they just wanna see what's there. And then then more people come. And I usually say I'm one and done,
[00:35:17] Unknown:
but people come back three months later. Yeah. That was my next question. I was gonna I was gonna ask if if this is like I because I come kinda picturing it almost like a therapy session. You know? Like, you you
[00:35:27] Unknown:
come back and sit down on the couch and talk some more stuff. And Well, here well, here so there we go. Again, I wanna be very clear. I'm not a therapist, but I've done this so long, and I do understand some of the symbolism because it's metaphorical symbolism. You know? It's very I I so I'm on the fence of what it's saying it's literal. Again, back to the reality, I've described something to for I'm doing this man, and I described this or I see this five minute things, and it's literally every event that he did that day. Right? So it was like a recap of his day. He goes, how do you know that's what I did? I'm like, I don't know anything, and I'm not I'm not saying I'm seeing this. That's it. I'm literally seeing it. So that's very important to understand.
Oh, coming back. So I say I'm one and done. Right? So I had a woman. I I did her when I just started doing this, and we had a great session, and and she comes back three months later. And and well, I've done hundreds and well, not I I shouldn't say that. About 200 plus people. When she came back, it was wild. It's almost like you push pause on a VCR. Some of the same things came up. Wow. It was totally, totally incredible. I mean, it was like one it was like, wow. I described I mean, the month three months before. And as I'm describing, I'm remembering it. I'm like, hold on a minute. And I'm seeing it, and she's and she's remembering it. So, so, yeah, it can be helpful, especially if you're trying to make, especially if you have I say it. If you're stuck, this might help point to where you're stuck.
Because sometimes I literally see people no. Not it's a metaphor, whatever. Walk around a tar pit with their foot inside. You know? You're like, obviously, something's going on. Whether you acknowledge it or not, there's something there that might well, you might wanna address with a friend, a mentor, a trust adviser, whoever.
[00:37:15] Unknown:
That's interest that that yeah. Okay. I think I wanna do this. Yeah. Yeah. We'll make we'll work it out. Yeah. I definitely wanna I definitely wanna try this because I I'm very curious as what you'd pick up, from me. So
[00:37:29] Unknown:
Well, you know, other piece so I there's a a blog post I wrote for the on the Institute of Noetic Sciences on their website. It's called is upside vision, psychic ability. Right? And it it as opposed to remote viewing, lucid dreaming, telepathy, and all that stuff in precog, Here's what I would say. Even though sometimes those things come in, this seems to be more of, unhapp tapped human potential, something we're evolving into and something that's opening up. It's like an additional sense or it's like an additional type of vision. Right? It's so specific that it is a vision. And people ask me, do you hear things? You know, do sounds come in? No. It is a visual thing. Sometimes, there's, like, thoughts I get with it, but it's it is definitely a visual, perceptual visual visual phenomena. And to make no mistake, it does not interfere with my day. Right? It's not like there's a I'm not thinking these things like, oh my god.
I believe everything I say. Now here's that I believe everything I see, and that's important. Now here's how I know that. You know? This is true profession because I was so unwell for that one year. I was really sick from drugs and so I I mean, I know what it is like to be unwell. You know? And my family knows what I look like when I'm on when I was unwell. It was a very horrible, horrible year. Homelessness. Everything you can imagine that you can do when you were mentally unwell happened to me. Psych ward, all that stuff. But that was a long time ago. Right? And since, like I said, since I don't put the drugs in your body, it's amazing what happens. You know? So so, and I and I work out a lot. I run to ground myself in this. Right? This is it it grounds me, and it, I know it's very fulfilling, and and it's really great to connect with people.
Because at the end of the session, I pretty much vibe with where that person is. So if you come in anxious, I I mean, I know it. Right? Now best case scenario, by the end of the session, you're not anxious because we've seen some things that have calmed your mind, but that doesn't always happen. Sometimes your anxiousness at the end, I feel like you do. Right? It's it's kinda wild. That that's like a I'm still learning how that works. It's kinda like empathic? It kinda is. And people that have done this a lot longer than I have or people that call themselves, you know, people that work in the space, they're like, yeah. You have to be careful of that. And, well, again, thank you. I know. Now I know. So but it's it's a it's a very fulfilling it's a very fulfilling thing. And I make a living at it. That's what's so wild too. Right? For twelve years, I did. And I did marketing. I was working for, I was still working for different businesses doing their marketing.
And, and I was like, this is not my calling anymore. I need to lean into this. And, again, this year, I just put my head down. I practiced and I I realized, look, this is something I'm supposed to be doing. The universe is calling me to do this. Yeah. I was I was gonna say the same thing. It's it's it's it's incredible how,
[00:40:24] Unknown:
you know, at certain stages of our of our lives, something usually happens that refocuses you and redirects you down a different path. And, sometimes you miss it. Sometimes people miss it. Yeah. I agree. And then sometimes people grasp a hold of it like you did, and that's that's fantastic.
[00:40:40] Unknown:
And sometimes people ignore it. Right? Sometimes, you know, Joe, sometimes people know they should do something else, but they're too scared. Actually, those are the perfect people to work with too. Let's be clear. Right? Mhmm. So that's actually a real almost a shout out. Because people are like, I shouldn't do it because I and make no mistake. You've got responsibilities and stuff like that. But if the universe keeps calling you and you ignore it, it's gonna affect you mentally, physically, emotionally. It's gonna affect you. And I I I use an example of synchronicities, you know, those unplanned occurrences. How could it you think of someone and they call you. Mhmm. That happened to me all the time.
And if you have a positive emotion around a synchronistic event, that that's one of the best ways for me to navigate the world now. Right? So if I see something and I have a good feeling around it, if I see something or if I'm reading somebody and they say they wanna buy a new house, I see them buy the new house and it's very successful and everything. I'm not telling them to buy the new house. What happens is a couple of weeks later, they're thinking about it. They'll turn to the right and, what what they'll think about something I've seen for them, but they'll also get a positive feeling.
[00:41:45] Unknown:
If that's the case, it means that I I, you know, I from my experience, the universe is saying, hey. You probably jumped. Go ahead and do it. Yeah. Now now talk about synchronicity and things like that. I I understand where you're coming from with that. I don't have any special gifts or anything like that. I don't wanna miss I don't wanna misrepresent that in any way. But, people close to me like I'll every now and then I'll get those I'll get that feeling that something's something's coming, something's gonna happen, and it's a very unsettling feeling. It it sometimes it makes me feel physically sick, Like, especially if it's gonna be something that's gonna be, or or potentially bad.
And, like, I'll I'll call my sister and I'll say, you know, I got this feeling like something like impending doom, like something is really bad coming. And more often than not, I'm right.
[00:42:29] Unknown:
Yeah. I I I listen. I hear loud and clear, and I think that's smart for you to pay attention to that. Right? Because even though maybe you can't change it, you can prepare for it. And, you know, you could be just watch just watch.
[00:42:41] Unknown:
And I what I do mean watch, just just get get on, heightened alert, you know, or whatever you wanna call it. Because sometimes you don't know what it is. You know? It it's not like it it I'm not getting a sense that, well, it's gonna be this exact thing that's gonna happen. It's just, like, just I feel it sometimes. There's something coming. I don't know what it is, but it's coming. It's almost like
[00:42:58] Unknown:
the event hap well, think about this. Think about it like this because I because this works for me. So imagine you throw a rock in the, you know, into the future Mhmm. And it lands in a lake, and the waves come back and hit you. Right? And you're that's what it is. Something's coming back even though it's in the future. That's how I liken it to. That's interesting. Yeah. That's a good way to look at it because I and by the way, jeez, this is really interesting. The things I see, a lot of this stuff interacts with our three d world, but it's not part of the electromagnetic spectrum. But that kind of thing, I literally see that represented. What I just described to you, I've seen that represented many times in this space.
[00:43:35] Unknown:
That's that's fascinating. I I love this conversation. This is great. You know, so so symbols and, and visual metaphors, how do they how do they help people uncover the that inner conflict in that direction? We may have touched on a little bit, but but how how does that exactly work?
[00:43:51] Unknown:
Well, then let's talk about just an animal symbol. Right? So because animals are the the one thing that come up a lot. Right? So what's interesting, if somebody is from Canada and, I'll I'll just use the word a moose. A moose comes up. Right? And if somebody is from Florida and a moose comes up, and if somebody I'm dealing with somebody in China or India and a moose comes up, that same moose is probably gonna have a different meaning for them from the environment they're in. Sure. So that's what's really interesting to unpack. Right? So the person can it could be more literal. Right? Because they're there. But so so that's the part that I like to tell people to work with their therapist or specialist with. Or I I think I don't know if I said this or not. People love re taking the recordings or and if you put this in chat g p t, they know what a session is with me.
If you put it in, AI will give you feedback around the symbolism, really articulate and smart things. It's not it's not the whole idea of telling you that you're awesome and incredible, but it you know, how it's everyone's making fun of AI for doing that now, which is great. This is not that. This is like, okay. Here's what that symbolism represents. And even you can drill down. Well, you know, I get it, but I'm not, I'm not I'm from China or whatever. You can put it whatever, and we'll it will guide you to what it could be. So the the animal symbolism is interesting. And then the archetypes, there's an archer or, there there's there are horoscopes and stuff like that, and it changes for each person. Now I'll tell you what. Mary Poppins, I don't know what you would call. I would just say she is an archetype of the nanny. She came up, for, like, five weeks in a row for all these different people, and I was fascinated by that. And everyone, I I mean, I maybe I should shouldn't say obviously, but, obviously, they all had kids. Right? Sure. So each one in each case, the way they dealt with their kids was different.
Interesting. And they and they took the meaning to be different. Like, maybe I should, you know it was again, I won't get into specifics because it's just a client. Of course. Yeah.
[00:45:57] Unknown:
Now now through the count through through these sessions that you do, have you ever witnessed a client experience like a like like a complete shift? You know, something that changed the course of their life entirely?
[00:46:07] Unknown:
Well, I don't know about that. But I I feel confident I could say, you know, there's so wow. Sometimes things come in. Again, I'm not a medium. Right? Right. But there's something that comes through. And this woman was convinced that was somebody that passed over. And I said, listen. I don't know what that is, but I just described to it, and it was it was wonderful. Right? It was very emotional, but she, you know, thought it was that. I didn't I didn't I'm not sitting there saying it's not, and I'm not sitting here saying it is. I'm telling you exactly what I see, but she was convinced it, it was that. So that was in true. I I love that. It was great. It was meaningful for her. But I told her as soon as she did, I said, that's not what I do. I do not you know, my goal is to not find a relative who's passed over. I do not say I do that at all. So so I don't know what it was, but I know it was meaningful to her. Another way, somebody wants to make a change in their life. As a matter of fact, this last month.
The stuff that I showed her potential within her, I I've never felt better at the end of a session. Because all these things I didn't know this. Right? So I see these things, and I don't know about this person. Right? But I see some specific things that they do in their life. Let's say she's a teacher, and she wants to teach a college, and then she wants to go on tour. So I'll see all these things happen, and then she tells me, well, I'm a teacher. I wanna write I'm I'm writing a book, and I wanna go on tour. And, you know, after I've seen the scene where she's very successful on a world tour. So when that happens, it's like the universe saying, okay. Maybe make a jump. Right? So those are great. Those are that those are as good as you can be. And the flip side of that, sometimes people if you come in it's not skepticism is fine because I'm still gonna see it. That's but Yeah. Don't come as skeptic skeptical and not wanna have to work because it's like waking again, I'll use the dream analogy. It's the best one. If you're like, oh, it's meaningless, then you're gonna it's nothing I can say. Even though I've seen it, it's not you don't care. So don't
[00:48:03] Unknown:
just don't do it. Yeah. You can be skeptical, but, you can be skeptical, but at least have an open mind.
[00:48:09] Unknown:
Well, sure. Sure. Yeah. Right. Absolutely. That's why but some people come in well, very few. Less than a handful have come in, and they're like, well, I don't get this. I'm like, well, that's fine. You don't have to get it. Now now you also work with companies. Right? And,
[00:48:22] Unknown:
and, you help them uncover, like, hidden strengths and, you know, help maybe align teams. How does the process work in a business session?
[00:48:30] Unknown:
Or setting up another? Offering. So that's a great one. So the the so I don't know. So I offer that. Right? Okay. So I have not had my first big group session. Now there's it's coming up. I think I'm gonna have one on Friday where they're gonna they're gonna bite and they're gonna do it. And what's really interesting about that, because that takes my experience as running business meetings and an ad agency and running those creative meetings and pulls in, let's say, a team of five creative people and what's coming through in their field, and it's matching up their unconscious projections around this topic. Let's just call it, they wanna market this, new form of hot sauce.
What's seen there and then my experience from the business side on how to market it and target market. So that's gonna be fun. So I'll let's check back in six months. You know? Actually, maybe nine because I have to execute it. Okay.
[00:49:22] Unknown:
The reason why I'm I I kinda laugh a little bit when you said the hot sauce thing is is just yesterday, I was talking to a friend of mine, because I make my own spices, like, rubs and and sauces and things like that. And we were talking yesterday, he was like, dude, you gotta bottle this stuff. You gotta sell this stuff. You gotta market this stuff. You can make a fortune with this. So that's that's what made me laugh when you said it. Well well, here so let's talk about that, Joe. So think about it. We're connected right now, and I didn't it's not hot sauces. I was using that as a placeholder. Mhmm.
[00:49:53] Unknown:
Because I maybe I picked up something from you. Maybe? I don't yeah. I mean, I'm just saying it's not hot sauces. I just use that as a fill in the blank because that's the first thing that you got. Early early when we first started the conversation, you said that you that the the person that you're dealing with has to be willing to let you,
[00:50:08] Unknown:
visualize. And and I've been I've told you already that I'm interested in doing this, so maybe that you know, you're picking up a little something off of that. That's
[00:50:16] Unknown:
Listen. Blows me away. The science or there's no there I I just should say this is what I'll say. The science around this is so far behind because there is no science. Now here, let me actually, let's talk about the science. That's not no science. So, when I went to the Institute of Know What Science is, they hooked my brain up to an EEG machine. Right? And they wanted to measure my brain waves, alpha, beta, theta, gamma waves against two things. One, as I said, it's good memory recall and a vivid mind's eye. Like, you and I, if I said, you remember the Jaws poster when we were kids, you'd say yes. And I could drive the car, and I could talk to you about it. When this if I look at the Jonas poster, I can't drive a car because it takes over my motor skill. So it I need to look at it. I can't keep my eye on the road and see this thing in front of me. Right. So we measured my brain states of good memory recall. I mean, yeah, against seeing it with upside vision. And the wild thing is the, well, I knew I knew it was gonna be the the changes from one to the other would be different. The two biggest changes, the ones that were, like, off the charts for, like, another one, was the theta state. And that's the one that medium say they are in or people that are meditate deeply, that's really in use. But the wild one was the alpha brain state, which is the state that is the brain is typically at rest.
So when I my alpha brain state, while I'm just seeing these upside images, is working pretty hard. Wow. Yeah. So that that's what the academic paper is around.
[00:51:42] Unknown:
So yeah. Well, it's it's I I was gonna actually get into some of the some of the science on it first, but I had I had one more question about the business applications. And it has to do with AI, because I know we mentioned AI earlier as well. So how would how would upside vision, give organizations,
[00:52:06] Unknown:
I guess, a a strategic edge, you know? So here alright. So let's let's let's take a step back. Because, like, this is I've had thought about this a lot. So everybody we all know AI is amazing. I think we can all agree that it's it is pretty amazing. I think it's amazing. Every business in the world is now leaning into AI for insights and every kind of thing you could possibly use AI for, they are. But let's use the word insights. Now if every ad agency or every corporation is pulling from the same wealth of knowledge, Right? Mhmm. All the human knowledge that's been uploaded to the computer and is regurgitated back to AI, that is we're all pulling from the same space. The space that I'm accessing is gonna offer other options that this AI will not offer or maybe you doesn't make the insights that you can there. So that's my answer to that question. Everyone is gonna be fighting for this space. This is something new and different.
[00:53:08] Unknown:
Alright. Let's see. Let's get to some of the science stuff. We already had gotten some of that. So, now sign now they're really just starting to study this, like like you you've indicated. But for the studies that have been done so far, what is, probably the most surprising or validating thing that you've learned, from the scientific side of the work?
[00:53:28] Unknown:
Well, the the most surprising thing was the alpha brain state is actually working hard. Right? And they say that the front left total area is suppressing some things. They're saying I I don't I'm again, I'm not a scientist. They're saying that left front of my brain is suppressing something so something else can get in. It's lead pushing something else so something else can get in. So that was the, the biggest surprise. What was the other question? What what was the,
[00:53:53] Unknown:
that was the It was the, what's surprising of validating?
[00:53:58] Unknown:
Well, validating that listen. I say I knew it was gonna show it. I was very happy that it was showing it up on the EEG machine. Because look. Let let me give you a couple other things. My eyes get tired when I do this just like watching a movie because people are people at in the beginning were like, well, it's just internal. It kept saying it's internal. It's internal. No. My eyes get tired. Either something called smooth pursuit eye movement. Right? When you follow something across the screen Mhmm. If it's external, you follow it, and you cannot fake that. So if they track your eyes, they know your if so if you and I were sent sitting in front of a wall that you you and you thought was blank, but I'm seeing a translucent or holographic leopard running across it, they could track my eyes. I see. I got you. That's one thing. Another one, my pupils dilate, or if something is arousing or exciting, so they change the shape.
Tired, dilating pupils, and the smooth pursuit are the ways that we knew it was external. The EEG machine is one way to validate that with science. You know? That was another way to validate the brain states with science.
[00:55:02] Unknown:
That's amazing. Now, it now if you if more people learn to see the world through upside vision, access those subconscious layers? How how how do you think that would change the way we live, the way we work, the way we innovate?
[00:55:17] Unknown:
So I so yeah. Great question, Joe. I do think this is a mutation for human's evolutionary survival, not to get scary or anything like that. I just I this didn't this is not a coincidence that I have this. Now why do we need that? Maybe we're gonna need to communicate through this way. I think if somebody has it to the degree I do, we're sitting next to you here, we could both see the same images. Just like I can we have a conversation. We can have a communicate holographically. They could change theirs with a thought, and we can communicate that way. The same way we're having a conversation now. Why why and and and and we can all both access the same place that has this other wealth of knowledge Mhmm. In the Akashic record, neosphere, or whatever is here with us, whatever hidden biosphere, whatever it contains.
Again, the the stuff that surround us is more like, I I'll use words like microbes and germs like something like that, but there's something else here with us that we can't see that's not necessarily small or just vision. We only see 1% of the electromagnetic spectrum anyway, so this should not be a surprise. This should not be like, oh my god. That's impossible. Most people should say and they have. They're like, well, that's really interesting, and it makes sense. So, survival communication, I think those are the two big ones. Two big ones, survival and communication.
[00:56:34] Unknown:
It's interesting you mentioned the Akashic record because that's exactly what I was thinking about with this question.
[00:56:38] Unknown:
Yeah. Well, I think we can access this. And there is knowledge there. Again, with our AI, Elon Musk just said this the other day. He wants to get all our knowledge and upload it to his Grokipedia now. This already exists in this sphere. This or this already exists. We don't have to do that because the all of history is being written, and it's there's, you know, a quantum entanglement and this quantum field that it exists in. Now can we see all of it? No. But something is definitely changing. And, you know, people are emailing me. I mean, like, I I feel really good about this. People feel so validated because there's someone else that can do it, and there people are telling them that they're crazy. There was a girl that did it when she was a child. Her mother told her, don't tell anyone. You can do this. In fact, there's an anecdote she told me. She had a sleepover. She was on her bed with her 10 year old friend, and she said, do you ever see things other people don't? And her friend said, you mean, like, the two fish that are above us now? And they both were like and the girl goes, you still saw that? Yeah. Right? And they both went through and they both went through puberty and and one moved away and and they she stopped doing it. It's because you're not you're not, teaching it. It's like, everybody can sing, but everybody can't be Adele or Frank Sinatra.
This is kinda like that.
[00:57:52] Unknown:
I I wonder I'm thinking about this now. I I wonder if this is something that man, ages past, had the ability to do, and then it it it kinda it faded out because lack of use maybe, I don't know, but and then and and now it's starting to to because, you know, you hear a lot about this type of Yeah. These type of abilities, not not necessarily upside vision, but but similar type of abilities that that seem to be more prevalent now and or or at least maybe just people just talking about it more.
[00:58:25] Unknown:
I think that's exactly right, what you just said. I think we did it How or whatever ten thousand years ago, we were wiped out or, you know, we forgot about it, and people are just remembering it. At the telepathy tapes, there's this podcast that's real popular about these kids who are autistic, and they communicate in a place called The Hill. And I say the middle ground that I say, maybe it's the same place. Yeah. I think this is something that we did in the past and is coming back, but there's no recorded,
[00:58:52] Unknown:
you know, it's not recent past. It's like Atlantis, that kind of past. Right? Yeah. Yeah. I I I think that that might be the case. Yeah. I I see I I follow that stuff. I I I I find all of that fascinating, you know, and, and I I try to find as much information on these things as I possibly can. I think they're just I think I just think it's an amazing study to do in itself just to to to go back in time to to look at them at some of the things that were accomplished ages ages ago that, that we can't even duplicate today. Like like for example, the the the most common thing is, like, the pyramids. You know? Yeah. We can't duplicate those today. Even with all the equipment and technology that we have, we cannot do what the ancient Egyptians did with that in building those things.
[00:59:39] Unknown:
Without a doubt. And it meant maybe so we knew they had the scribes and all that kind of communication. But what if they could also one one of them were the people that could do it. The guy was a 100 miles away, but they could communicate it like that. Right? They're like, you know, they're like, should I get this rock or this rock? You know, we think they had to go back. What if they're like, no. Pick the rock on the right or whatever if they're seeing the same thing. So, yeah, I don't know. I I I I do I do think it's it seems like it's coming back. I'm saying evolving into it, but I do think we must have I do think we probably had this in the past. I think so too. I think so too. Alright. So what do you what do you hope that the audience takes away from the conversation tonight? Well, number one, if you're going through hell, keep going. You can come out of it. If I could get my life back together, anybody can. My book is Jesus Goes to Hollywood, a memoir of madness. If you wanna check it out on Amazon, it's a it is just about my one life of complete hell, how I got everything back together and starting to learn about upside vision, but it does not talk about upside vision. Okay. So that's on Amazon. Free PDF, the eight stages of upside vision, if you think you might have it or curious more about what it is. That, you could check that. You could go to my website, tom-matt,matte,.com.
And if there's also if you wanna sign up for a session there. But, we're changing. And if you know somebody that says they have this, they're not out of their minds, probably.
[01:00:53] Unknown:
Alright. Outstanding. Well, you you gave all the information out there we I was gonna ask you next. So our next guest is is waiting out there in the wings. So, what we're gonna do, we're gonna we're gonna sign off here with with, with Tom Matt. Thank you so much for this. This was great. And, I, just do me a favor. If you could, just text me your website information because I didn't get that from from, the PR people. Yeah. So, so I can put that in the show notes so people can reach out to you. And, and and I would love to talk to you at some point, during the week here if we could, maybe over the weekend. If you have some time, I I would I'm really curious. I would love to get a session in with you and get a reading. Let's do it. Alright. Alright. Tom, Matt, thank you so much my friend. God bless you. Have a great one. Thank you.
Alright, folks. Wow. Amazing. Great conversation. I love that. I'm and I'm our next guest is here waiting in the wings. So what we're gonna do is we're gonna take a quick break here. I gotta use the restroom. Gonna take a quick break, and when we come back from the break, we'll get to, Pablo's Holman, who is waiting for us. And, folks, don't forget this is a live show weeknight 7PM central time. You can don't forget to like, subscribe, and share it with your friends, your family, and your followers. This way it helps us with the algorithm here, you know, try to get noticed and, really happy with the level of growth we've been experiencing over the last couple of weeks.
So download's been great. It's been fantastic. Audio, video side been really good, so thank you so much for all that stuff. And, let's let's keep the whole thing going. Alright. Well, with that said, we will be back here in, maybe three minutes or so. Alright. We'll be back. Stay with us. If I could find the break thing. Here we go.
[01:02:52] Unknown:
My fans, I have arrived. Me too.
[01:02:57] Unknown:
Melting your mouth.
[01:03:01] Unknown:
They look so cheery. You're an M and M. There's no point in wondering where your portraits are. Tasty, smooth, creamy, you're an M and M. It's alright.
[01:05:01] Unknown:
With peanuts or plain.
[01:05:06] Unknown:
Mike wonder. Mike wonder.
[01:05:48] Unknown:
I'd say that's a wrap. Alrighty, folks. Where am I? There we go. First hour is in the books. Moving into hour number two here momentarily. Great conversation there. Tom Matt. That was awesome. I was not expecting that. Really wasn't. Very interesting. Very interesting. Hey, folks. Pro HVAC, our solutions, leverages over thirty years of expertise to provide premier HVAC sales and sales and repair services. Specializing in both residential and commercial installations, our team of skilled technicians are dedicated to providing efficient heating, ventilation, air conditioning solutions for your home or business with a focus on quality workmanship and customer satisfaction, Pro HVAC Solutions ensures your comfort all year round. Contact Pro HVAC r Solutions today for reliable HVAC services tailored to your needs. Just visit prohvacrsolutions.com, pro hvac r solutions dot com. Alrighty.
Well well, let's make sure I set the audio set correctly. There we go. Alright. Alright. Now, next up here, we have Pablo Hohman, someone who quite literally builds the future. Pablo Hohman is a hacker, an inventor, a technology futurist whose fingerprints are on some of the most groundbreaking innovations of our time. He's helped launch spaceships at Blue Origin, pioneered three d pioneered three d printing at MakerBot, and even designed laser systems to fight malaria with Bill Gates with more than 70 patents to his name. He's one of the most prolific inventors in America. Today, he leads Deep Future, where where he supports visionary entrepreneurs tackling civilization scale challenges from sustainability to space exploration. Pavlos, welcome to the show.
Hey, man. How you doing? I'm doing fantastic. How are you? I'm rocking. You are a busy guy. I'm busy, but I like it that way. That's good. That's great. Now, I'm like like I told Tom earlier, in in the in the first hour, we didn't get all of your information from the publicist up until until, like, two maybe 03:00 this afternoon. So Oh, okay. So I'm not You don't know what you're getting into? No. I I did but I did do this though. I I did find you, and I did listen to a couple of your podcast, which were which were incredibly incredibly informative, and and I love the content.
And, a little bit I felt a little bit diminished in some of the No. No. Conversations you guys are having, but, you know, but that that's great. Like, one of the I think one of the, descriptions you put, you know, two geeks talking about, whatever it was.
[01:08:48] Unknown:
Yeah. Right. Okay. So Well, that's the my podcast is just nerds having long, deep conversations about technical stuff, and that's how I learn
[01:08:59] Unknown:
by picking other people's brains. So, you know, I record some of those and share them. That's the idea. Outstanding. So, I always like to start my interviews with a couple of basic questions. So if you've had a chance to listen to any of my shows, you maybe you've known them already, but if not, what's something about you what's something about you that most people don't know but should?
[01:09:18] Unknown:
Oh, man. Most people don't know. I'm an obsessed salsa dancer. So That is a first. Speak up in the middle of the night and dance salsa. You could do it anywhere in the world. You don't need to speak the language.
[01:09:32] Unknown:
It's great. That's awesome. You know, that's the first out of out of all my guests, you're the first one. I'm the first salsa dancer? First salsa dancer. That's awesome, man. I love that. That's that's great. So which You're in Texas? Where at? I am on, I'm on the pimple on the backside of Texas, the beautiful city of Eagle Pass. Okay. Which we are right down I love that one. We're right down here on the border. I don't I don't Okay. Know if you remember in the last administration, there was a confrontation over here at a place called Shelby Park. Okay. A little standoff between the state and the feds, and that is literally, like, a few blocks away from where I live. The state, actually. Oh, right on. Yeah. So Texas independence, buddy. We should just let Texas run the rest of the country. We should. We should. And you know something? It might just happen someday.
Another conversation, another another time. Alright. Fair enough. Yeah. So, what what's your go to beverage to help you unwind at the end of the day?
[01:10:24] Unknown:
End of the day. Oh, I'm I have Red Bull once a day, but I I don't know if that's unwinding. I don't drink any alcohol, so I guess my go to beverage at the end of the day is a milkshake.
[01:10:36] Unknown:
Well, that could be worse. You know? It it it could it could be Mountain Dew. Yeah. Well, I used to be on Mountain Dew. That's good stuff. I really like it. Mountain Dew, you know with sugar. Then the reason why I say it well, the reason why I bring it up is because so many people, that that when I ask that question, it's been all it's been like a trend. The last several guests have been Mountain Dew's, Mountain Dew's, Mountain Dew's.
[01:10:57] Unknown:
Wow. I thought it was kind of anachronistic. No. You know, there's so many energy drinks now that Mountain Dew kinda got pushed aside. Yeah. Tom Tom does, diet Mountain Dew. Oh, that's
[01:11:10] Unknown:
sinful. I I I I I'm not gonna disagree with you on that one, but, I'm not I, you know, I I
[01:11:17] Unknown:
I I went through I just can't I I don't think the the sweet the artificial sweeteners don't seem to be better for you than sugar. No. So, like, just it just go for the sugar. That's what I do anyway. The best You know? The best Coca Cola I've ever had has been was a Coca Cola from Mexico.
[01:11:33] Unknown:
Oh, yeah. Those are good. Because yeah. Yeah. Real sugar. It's casino is real sugar. Absolutely. Completely different taste altogether. There's a difference
[01:11:40] Unknown:
in the molecule in high fructose corn syrup, and I think that is causing some of the problems. I don't I'm not an expert in this stuff, but I've listened to some experts talk about it. It sounds like sugar is bad for you, but all the other stuff is worse. Yeah. Yeah. Well, everything in moderation. Right? That that I try to have just less sugar. That's why I switched to Red Bull. It's got less sugar than the shit I was drinking before that. Nice. Nice. Nice. But again, like I said, everything's in moderation though. That's that's I think that's the key to it, you know, just moderation. And I think if you use more natural things to begin with, you're better off than the synthetic stuff. So Probably right. So, so you've been called, one of the world's most prolific
[01:12:18] Unknown:
inventors,
[01:12:19] Unknown:
but before I don't know if that's actually true. My team was for sure, because we we kinda turned invention into a team sport. Okay. And we got more patents than anybody, but I don't know if I'm in the ranking.
[01:12:31] Unknown:
You know, I probably only have, like, a 100 patents or something. So Yeah. But still, that's that's quite an accomplishment. But, but so but before all the patents and the TED Talks and all that stuff, who was Pavlos Hohman?
[01:12:41] Unknown:
Oh, before all that. So I'm a computer hacker. So so version Pavlos one point o was computer hacker, and, you know, what we were trying to do is, you know, just break everything and scare the shit out of people for for our own entertainment Nice. And and, you know, to take the moral high ground and show that we were smarter than everyone and that everything was totally insecure. And, that was what I was doing up through kinda through the nineties. And then, and then I sort of graduated to hacking everything else besides computers.
[01:13:15] Unknown:
Nice. When you look back, was there was there a single project or a or a particular moment that that shifted how you think about the future of technology?
[01:13:24] Unknown:
For sure. And the the one that is very clearly responsible for me is I mean, there's probably a bunch of those, but the one I really think it was the biggest was in 2001, we started Blue Origin. So that's spaceship company. Mhmm. And at the time, you know, there was no such thing as a private space program. Only governments could play that game. But Jeff Bezos had started Amazon and was worth $7,000,000,000. So we thought, hey. Maybe for what can we do with one of those billion? Maybe go to space. And so that so that was the idea. And and people think of this whole, you know, space race that's going on now is just like billionaires with their big swinging rockets having a pissing contest in space. But the truth is what I learned from working on Blue Origin with Jeff is that, you know, his vision is really about the future of humanity.
It's really about what happens in the you know, when, Earth is no longer viable. Like, it melts into the sun is kind of the best case scenario, if something doesn't get us before that. So you might wanna have some kind of plan b or planet b, and and a project like that would take thousands of years. And so what I what I really got out of that was that, you know, everybody around me was so focused on, you know, paying rent and getting their kids in college and quarterly earnings report and just such myopic stuff by comparison that it was super refreshing to be able to sort of think on these longer time horizons and work on a project that, you know, we might not see real success in on on that kind of thing for hundreds of years or thousands of years, but even that would start with one small step. And ours was to try to figure out how to reduce the cost of getting into space. And and that was twenty five years ago. And so, you know, now largely thanks to SpaceX, that's that vision is fully realized, of getting a getting kind of a highway to space. Blue Origin is catching up and helping out now with their new launch vehicles.
But the point is, you know, it took twenty five years, and these are still just in the beginning. And that's that's so that changed me, and now I really try to think on longer time horizons. I I I still I I can't believe it's been twenty five years since Blue Origin first came around. I mean, it I went to speak at Blue last month, and it was the anniversary. That's why I even
[01:16:14] Unknown:
registered it. You know? Pretty funny. But it's I I feel like it was honestly, I feel like it was yesterday that you first started hearing about Blue Origin, and I can't believe twenty five years have gone by so fast. Well, they were quiet. They they didn't talk about it much,
[01:16:27] Unknown:
you know, just because they didn't have anything to show for a long time. So now they've started being a little more public about their launches and things. Do you still have any involvement with the program? I'm not involved at all. No. I'm just a fan. Oh, awesome.
[01:16:41] Unknown:
Now you built tools that are I look at it like science fiction stuff, but, you know, like hurricane suppression machines, laser Yeah. Malaria zappers, and surgical technology. What what makes a problem worth solving for you?
[01:16:59] Unknown:
Well, that's that's a good question because if you're you know, we were trying to invent sort of in general, you know, figure out what problems we could solve. And it turns out that the bigger the problem, the better because invention is such a haphazard expedition that you're unlikely to succeed anyway, so you might as well go after bigger problems. And so we would try to find the biggest problems in the world and understand them and and see if we could help with them. You could it's just as much work to work on a small problem.
So we might as well start with the big ones, and that's kinda how I think about it. And and, you know, so we would so you get to some obvious things like infectious disease and feeding people and, you you know, for a lot of problems, it turns out you end up just ending up at energy. You know, if you try to take on solving something like, you know, recycling or climate change or something, well, you could maybe put a dent in those things, but you're gonna use a lot of energy to do it. So you might wanna go solve energy first. So a lot of what I work on these days, probably the biggest thing is energy. Awesome.
[01:18:16] Unknown:
Now when you're looking at a blank slate, a new idea, big problem, would you create a process for turning, I guess, a wild concept into a working prototype?
[01:18:28] Unknown:
Well, the the wild concept, you know, these things sound like wild concepts at the beginning just because you can't see them.
[01:18:41] Unknown:
Oh, I think we lost you.
[01:18:48] Unknown:
Now you're back. I'm in. I'm gonna I'm gonna go back to I'll go to, like, a less intensive video. Maybe that'll help. How's that?
[01:18:57] Unknown:
All good.
[01:18:58] Unknown:
I think when you're trying to do something new, it sounds crazy. It sounds like a wild idea because people haven't gotten to see it working before. And so almost all the things I work on have that nature about them. They sound like Pablo's doing some crazy high-tech stuff. But once you get them working, then they just flip, you know, acclimate to a new version of normal once they can see it and feel it and use it and get it, build a little bit of confidence in it. You know, a great example of that is if you are ever in a city that has Waymo, then, you know, these are the self driving taxi cabs. Mhmm. And it's so fascinating because you could take your friends in there, and as soon as the thing starts moving because there's no driver, they're, like, hanging on for dear life, and they're like, oh my god. It's driving. It's and then five minutes later, they've forgotten all about it. They're totally used to it.
They're just talking about where they're going for lunch. They never think about it again for the rest of their life. And so you could just see that transition in real time in in an experience like that. And and so something like that happens with every new technology when it comes to life, and it just takes a while to get it to come to life. But once it does, people internalize it really quickly. So, anyway, I'd say, you know, for me, I'm working on these things usually in the window that's kinda five or ten years before they can come to life. And it's and and the creative process is mostly about trying to figure out, you know, what's gonna keep us from making it happen. And that could be, you know, we don't know how to do it. Usually, we don't get started if we don't think we know how to do it. But it could be a regulatory environment or, you know, it's too expensive and we gotta get the cost down or it could be you know, we're gonna run out of money or, you know, things like that. Right. Right. We're gonna get squashed by something better. So you kinda have to navigate all those things at once, and and I think that's where most of the creativity is is once you once you have the invention and you know what you wanna build.
[01:21:14] Unknown:
Now let's talk about your book a little bit, Deep Future. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Because, I I I took a look at your website today, when I finally got a link to it. And and, It's so easy to find. Yeah. Well, actually, you know what? When they sent me the link Yeah. Before I even clicked the link, I I just put you into a search engine. And Okay. You and before I even finished typing your first name, you were the top of the list.
[01:21:37] Unknown:
Okay. Good. That's what I like to hear. Yes, sir. Yes, sir. So I'm
[01:21:43] Unknown:
Go ahead. You were just Trying to be trying to be available, you know? Well, yeah. I mean, it really easy to find and that was which was great. And then I got to look at some of the pieces that were the the articles and stuff that were up there about you and the information that was available about you. And then I checked out your website. I love your website by the way. It's very it's very Oh, thanks. Easy to navigate through. I mean, it's just like like one page really and it's it's I like that. It's very minimalistic and I don't know. I'm I'm kinda trending more on the minimalistic side of things lately. So so I I I don't wanna waste people's time, so I try to give them some meat right away. Oh, yeah. You do. You get a lot of good information in there and I was able to check out your shows and and, really like and then like I said, folks, I'm not b s ing because he's sitting here. I'm I'm being honest with you. If you this is he has really, really good content. You need to check it out. I know you're on Apple, you're on Spotify, you're on all the major platforms, so you need to check him out.
You're gonna learn something. I learned a few things today listening. I listened to the show about the earbuds, Oh. And the, automate or the the, the automated, clothes manufacturing. Oh, yeah. Good. That was that was Yeah. Those are real. Those are both things we're working on now. Yeah. And they were just it was fascinating to hear the the conversation about it too. And it's like, you know, you don't you don't think about all the work that goes into that. Into Mac well, especially, I was talking about the clothes too. That's that's the one I was able to listen to the most. You don't realize all the work that actually goes into that and and just the finesse and the and the and the fine detailing that goes into it, and the fact that we're building technology that can actually duplicate that, you know, what what the human hands can do. Because because you always say, I like to cook. Right? So so then Okay. And when I learned how to cook, I was I was taught that there's no better tool in your kitchen than your hands, you know. Right. And I'm sure that's the same in just any other, any other, manufacturing business or any anything like that.
But to understand now that we're we're actually developing technology that can duplicate Yeah. The finesse of the human hand Yeah. Is just blows me away. Well, that's it's an interesting you
[01:23:45] Unknown:
honed in on one of the real cruxes of where we're at with robotics because what we when we've tried trying to make robots is hard because, they don't have fingertips. They can't they can feel like ours. And what's crazy is they do have vision that's better than ours. So you would think that vision would be harder to solve than feeling, but it's been the other way around. And so robots have incredible vision, but they really don't feel. And when you think about what is a seamstress doing shoving fabric into a sewing machine, they're feeling just the most mind, you know, changes in how that fabric is stretching and flowing and warping. And and so, we haven't really been able to make robots. Like, we can't right now, we can't make a robot that feeds a sewing machine the way a human does.
That's out of the window of what we've been able to accomplish with robotics. Mhmm. But what CreateMe, the company that you that was in that podcast is doing is they've gotten around it by they've made machines that can instead of using a a sewing machine that does stitches, they're using glue the same way your iPhone is made. It's the guys it's the same kind of guys who made the factories that make iPhones. So they use bonding, and so they have a a look, kinda like an inkjet head, just puts down these little dots of glue on the fabric, and it keeps it all flat. And a and a robot can deal with flat stuff. And then once they've done all the stuff they can on flat, then for sleeves and collars and stuff, it goes on to a kind of a a jig that holds it in shape Mhmm. And they can bond the collar on. Things like that. So, yeah, they've come up with a bunch of clever ways of getting around the fact that robots don't really have fingertips.
Yeah. It Eventually, they will. But
[01:25:42] Unknown:
It's amazing. It it really is a technology that and and it just seems like technology is just growing faster and faster and faster. It's like Yeah. You turn around one day and it's it's it's completely different than it was the day before.
[01:25:55] Unknown:
Yeah. It's exciting. And and also because, you know, we're getting to a point now where the technologies can start going places that they haven't been able to go before. I think we've been in this world where the technology has been kind of unimpressive in a lot of ways for the last twenty years because all we're doing is making software. You know, we're making a lot of iPhone apps, but we aren't making new technologies. I gotcha. Yeah. So that's really starting to change, and that's why I'm so excited because now we get to use tech to go make clothes, like you said, and use technology to go, you know, solve inflammation in your body with an earbud. I mean, there's just crazy stuff that's possible, but Silicon Valley sort of gotten drunk on software, and it's been a long time since we got to bring these other kinds of technologies to life at a large scale. Right. And it's it's it's fascinating. And and Yeah. Just to tie back to your book. So, you know Yeah. Deep Future Creating Technology That Matters.
[01:26:54] Unknown:
And like I said earlier, I mean, you're you're a busy guy. When did you when did you find time to add author to your bio?
[01:27:01] Unknown:
I just wrote it on airplanes. A buddy of mine had done that, and he said, oh, yeah. I wrote my book on airplanes. I'm like, I'm on airplanes. I could write a book. So I I did that, and it worked out. Simple enough. Right? Yeah. But, yeah, the book is really, I mean, it's really accessible. I mean, it's not you don't need a PhD to read it. This is a book that tries to explain some of the big problems in the world and the technologies that we see coming Mhmm. That can help solve them. And that's really kind of a hopeful position to be in. You know? It's exciting because you read this book and you'll it's hard to not be excited about the future because there's so much cool stuff happening. And then along the way, I tried to, you know, explain a little bit about how we can make these things become real, and how do we invest in them, and how do we develop them. And and so people who wanna work on cooler technologies, hopefully, might might find a way to do that in their career. We need everybody it's kind of all hands on deck. We need all kinds of help. So that's what that book is about. And and,
[01:28:04] Unknown:
so far, people seem to really love it, which is very rewarding. Yeah. I just wish I would have gotten informate more information about you first. I would love to have read the book before you sat down. Yeah. We could do this again sometime. Oh, absolutely. For sure. I would love to do that. Yeah. So so in the book, which which story or chapter in the book challenged you the most personally?
[01:28:23] Unknown:
Oh, that's a good one. There's so the oh, man. Challenge me personally. Look. I I wanted to write a book that people would enjoy reading. Right? It can't just be all nerd stuff. I kinda like all the nerd stuff, but I forced myself to put kind of a part story from my weird career in each chapter. Since I've been on a lot of, you know, gone a lot of places and worked a lot of things most people never get to do, I figured I'd share some of that. Okay. And it turns out that's what people like the most. You know? I would have been fine with a book that was just robots and lasers and nuclear reactors, but people wanted to people really like that human connection, and I'm really trying to make these things that seem super complex into much more accessible, things that anybody could understand. And so, so those stories really help a lot. You know, there's a couple of, you know, there's a couple of stories in there from, you know, my experience as a parent with my daughter.
There's you know, it's such I don't know that they're challenging so much, but, you know, I definitely had wasn't sure what all I wanted to put in the book and had to grapple with that a little bit. But Sure. Yeah. It's and so the book ended up being pretty personal,
[01:30:00] Unknown:
but, that worked out. So how did writing the the book shift your, your own thinking about technology and and and what technology should aim to do?
[01:30:11] Unknown:
Yeah. The the theme of the book is creating technology that matters. Now it's not that I'm trying to tell you what technologies matter. You could decide for yourself what that is, but I wanna reframe what people think of as technology, you know, and help them see that, like, these are tools for humans to build our future. Mhmm. That's what it is. And, you know, we're gonna build the future with whatever tools we have. And if if our toolkit sucks, then we're gonna, you know, be pretty limited. And that has been true for lots of human history. Now we have the most extraordinary toolkit ever. So we ought to be looking at that and thinking, holy shit. We can build an amazing future now because we have all these possibilities. And, you know, we don't really live in a world where that that's the prevailing story. You know? People are are dealing with a lot of, you know, a lot of pent up frustration about the way things are going, but, you know, we have some volition in this. We get to choose what future we wanna build, and we have the tools to go build it. And so I'm trying to show people the ways we can do that. So there's, you know, there's things in there about about how we can save a million lives a year with kids who are dying of malaria and other infectious diseases.
You know? That's not a problem you and I have. Our kids are fine. But, you know, half of those kids are under five years old, and they live in the in countries where we haven't spent enough effort on trying to keep them keep them alive just at the very beginning. I mean, it's pretty sad stuff. So I don't I don't think this is controversial. Hopefully, anybody would agree that, like, probably worthwhile to, like, at least give these kids a fair shot at life like you and I had. Absolutely. And so and so, you know, if if we could develop a technology that could help, you know, eradicate the infectious disease or keep these kids from getting it in the first place or save them from it if they do, that seems to me like it's worth doing. And when you start tracing it back, well, what else is going on? Well, those kids don't have clean water. Why don't they have clean water? Well, you need a lot of energy to clean up the water. Well, where's that energy coming from? If you're burning coal, then you're polluting the air and cleaning up the water. So, you know, we gotta figure out, okay, how are we gonna make clean, cheap energy for everyone on earth? And so those are big problems that are really worth solving, I think, and we're the we're the folks who are good at doing new things. You know? We're in the position of being able to invent these things, to develop them, to get a bunch of rich people, to waste a lot of money on trying it out early on, get economies of scale up, and then set an example for how we want to the rest of the world to do these things. You know, if we can find a way of making energy that's cheap and clean, then we can export that around the world and really make a difference on these problems. And you could clean up the water and fix sanitation and save a lot of lives. And I think that's pretty cool stuff. I I do too. That that's that's it's it's noble.
[01:33:39] Unknown:
You know, it it's something it it it's securing the future. It's important work. It absolutely is. Now, I know we kinda touched on a little bit already, but, you know, for for people who aren't, or for readers of the book that aren't necessarily inventors or technologists, what what's Yeah. What what's what what's the one mindset or or, I guess, practice from the book that you hope that they would be able to adopt, like, immediately and and apply it to their everyday life, whether it's the job, community, you know?
[01:34:08] Unknown:
Yeah. I mean, one of the things I I'm trying to show in that book is, yeah, we need an inventor, and we need a scientist, and we need an engineer. But we've got those guys. What they need is everything else. You know? They need people who can do sales and figure out an HR policy and get, you know, the health care lined up and, you know, support customers and, you know, build a factory and make some stuff. Like, it's all hands on deck. Like, we need everybody to do these things. You know, if you look at Tesla or SpaceX, yeah, there's a bunch of guys with PhDs hanging out there, but 99% of the company is not that.
It's everything else. And so I think, you know, what I'm trying to show in this book is you can vote with your life. You know, you can vote with your career. Is the is the job you have now I mean, not to disparage anybody's career. Like, you know, if what you're doing is cool, keep it up. But maybe just think, you know, if what you're doing is making an iPhone app to have weed delivered to your dorm room by a drone, You know, once you're done with that, think of it as practice. That's a practice career. Now you know a lot. You know how to build a product and support customers and all the stuff that has to be done, but then take on a problem you don't have that a billion people have. Take on something that's actually cool and more important. And so I think there's those possibilities exist. And, you know, we're at a turning point in the tech industry now where we're getting to get a lot of these things started, and they're all gonna need all the help they can get. So I think there's a lot of opportunity for people to look beyond their current career and look at doing something they really believe in.
[01:36:03] Unknown:
Yeah. Wow. Yeah. Even with the skill set they have. Yeah. That's a great that's a great point. It really is. You you do you you like you said, you have you have you have the scientists, you have the invest you have the the inventors, you have the technology, specialists. You have all of that, but you need you need the foot soldier. That's right. You know, so you look at it like military terms. You have you have all the leadership, you have the generals, the colonels, all that stuff, but you need the actual grunt in the field to actually get out there and actually make the difference.
[01:36:31] Unknown:
Yep. I got the science. I got the invention. Most of the guys that for, not even just guys. It's a lot of women too, even the ones we invest in. Yeah. They're the technical people. They can't sell shit to save their lives. And I tell them that. I say, look. You know? We can't invest in this. You gotta find a frat buddy or a cousin or somebody who can sell some stuff and get them on the team. Then we have a business. That's the difference between a, you know, science project and a business is can somebody sell something. So, you know, I'm simplifying a lot, but you get the idea. I do. Absolutely. It's not just sales. It's a lot of other things too. So I'm one thing I'm excited about, like, the region you're in, I've been to, like, San Antonio, which is probably not too far from you. It's about three hours. Building all kind what's that? About three hours. Three hours? Okay. Well, Texas oddly bid. Yes. But, you know, even so, I don't know about where you're at, but, like, in San Antonio, it's amazing. People are building all kinds of stuff, big stuff. You know, they had all these military bases, and a lot of those people are in factories building stuff. It's so exciting. I think that's where, you know, a lot of the future of stuff is gonna get built is in places like that. So, you know, these are really important folks, and they have skills, and they can learn, and they can be helpful. And when we're trying to build humanoid robots or nuclear reactors or whatever we're doing, we're gonna need those folks to come help. And so, yeah, I think there's a there's a lot, and and I think it's important to just think about what world you wanna be in.
Is this and what world do you wanna leave for your kids? Mhmm. And is the job you're doing making that world better?
[01:38:12] Unknown:
And if not, like, maybe just try to figure out how you can help work on something you believe more in. Yeah. I, yeah, I agree with you on that. You know, I I have my own kids and, you know, I'm I'm always and a lot of times I I look at what's going on in the world geopolitically. You know, I don't wanna get into all politics and stuff, but but, you know, I look around what's going on in the world, you know, and I'm and I'm concerned about the world that's gonna be left for my children and my grandchildren. You know, I have three grandchildren too. I I don't, you know, I don't Wow. Cool. So, yeah, I'm I I I frequently think about these things. I I frequently concern myself with these things. And Well,
[01:38:48] Unknown:
I mean, look, I think there's a it's there there's a rationale for being informed. Right? So, you know, you wanna be educated. You wanna be honest with yourself about how things are going in the world. But I think most people are overdoing it in a sense. They're not gonna help with any of those things anyway. Yeah. Like, you aren't gonna like, you can't find that country on a map that you're listening to hourly updates about how the war is going. Mhmm. You're not gonna, you know, help save these hostages anyway.
You but you're following this story as if it matter. It doesn't actually matter to you. We want a world where that's not happening, but you're not gonna help. So every moment you spend, all the attention you spend paying attention to these scary stories from around the world is keeping you away from the thing that you actually can't help with. Mhmm. Right? So if you have something that is your mission or have something that you care about or have something you can help with, which might just be raising your kids. I'm not saying I'm not trying to tell you what matters. You decide for yourself. Of course. But the time you spend focused on all the bullshit being reported from all around the world, that's you're not that's keeping you from being effective. It's draining your capacity to matter in the world. And so I think people need to be more judicious and about how they devote their own attention.
[01:40:25] Unknown:
I agree with you. And, you know, as as far as I I I'm concerned, I'm not an isolationist Yeah. But I'm I'm a non interventionist. I Okay. In in addition to everything that you just said, because you were spot on, you know, it's also the amount of money that we're sending out to all of these places that Oh. That Oh, I see. You know, the the money could be much I I would rather invest the $40,000,000,000 that we just gave to Argentina for beef Oh, yeah. Here Right. In at home Yeah. To to help our own farmers and ranchers. Yeah. You know what I mean? So so I look at it like that. We we shouldn't be funding wars overseas. We shouldn't be funding.
There's there's no reason for us to have military installations in a 150 countries around the world. You know? I I I Yeah.
[01:41:17] Unknown:
It yeah. I mean, that that's a complex issue. No. It is. Absolutely. Yeah. I know I'm just giving a And I think it's and and, honestly, like, if you are any country in the world besides The US, it's a totally reasonable thing to be noninterventionist, and you can 100% go for that. Yeah. But the but there's a but the
[01:41:39] Unknown:
and and I think that we Oh, I wanna apologize first of all. Before you go on, I wanna apologize. My my my my little boy, my Charlie, my my my French bulldog, he's whine every every time I do a show at Yeah. At the 08:30 mark, he is at Oh, he's gotta go out. No. No. He's at the door. He's howling and and crying at the door because he he knows that the show is almost over and he wants to come in. Almost over. Okay. Cool. And he wants to come in and hang out. And I I can't let him. Oh, no. No. No. No. No. No. No. Okay. He'll be Well It'll be worse. So so I apologize. Oh, you don't hear him? Okay. Good. No. I don't think it's I think it's fine.
[01:42:15] Unknown:
Yeah. No. It's cool. But yeah. Anyway yeah. Look. I I get it. It's I I'm probably a noninterventionist to an extent too. I haven't really tried to draw that line exactly. But but, yeah, it's it's it's one of these things where I think in the book, I try to show people how to, you know, how to focus in on what they care about the most and how to and and and free them up to ignore all the other shit. Yeah. I mean, look. You weren't gonna save those hostages anyway, so forget about them. Mhmm. I mean, I'm like, it I it's I actually think that's okay. Right?
And I know that they're very important to save them and all this kind of stuff, but the but the truth is you're taking yourself away from the thing that you could actually have an effect on. Exactly. And we and you gotta be ruthless about that. And so, yeah, that's just one of the things I think, you know, matters to for people if they wanna make it make their life Make your if you wanna make your vote count, wanna make the the vote of your life count, then you've got to be ruthless about use aiming at it, the thing that you can make a difference in.
[01:43:33] Unknown:
Yeah. I I agree with you. I I do. Now now I wanna get into AI a little bit and, and and things like that because that obviously, that's a huge thing right now. Right. I saw an article today that Amazon, let go of, like, 30,000 corporate level positions and with the intention of replacing it with AI. So, you know, that's a big that's a big thing. And you were working with AI long before
[01:44:01] Unknown:
Amazon's
[01:44:01] Unknown:
scale is so vast that 30,000 isn't that big of a dent. Oh, no. No. Not not really. Yeah. I mean, when you think they have over a million, partners spread out around the world, is what the article said anyway. I don't I don't even think I have it here. Well, I do actually. Let me see.
[01:44:18] Unknown:
And, and, you know, I think some of these numbers are skewed because it's they're also talking about reducing hiring for those kinds of positions going forward. It says the article here says,
[01:44:34] Unknown:
where to go, Amazon employs a total of approximately 1.5 milli 1,550,000 people as of June 30. That's huge. That's huge. So so 30,000 is less than 1%. Yeah. So the corporate workforce, which will be affected by the 14,000 job cut, compromised 350,000 personnel representing 4% reduction in the segment. Interesting. In the segment. Okay. Yeah. So it's inter it's interesting.
[01:44:59] Unknown:
I think that's you know, Amazon's job is to figure out how to do what they do Agreed. As efficiently as possible. And there are times when it's not very efficient, so you throw manpower at it. So I don't think it it's reasonable to expect any job to be permanent. Mhmm. You know, computer nerds are oddly the first people to have to relearn their job. Like, if you are working in with computers, you every two years, you learn a new database, a new language, a new operating system, a new, you know, toolkit because it's been it's always a moving target. And I think, you know, we have a lot of people in corporate America who've gotten kinda complacent about their jobs. They think they're entitled to do to have the job.
A lot of them are doing work cosplay. They're not actually working very hard. So and I know there are some in Amazon. So, you know, there I don't know, 30,000 of them, but, you know, there's definitely some excess people there. Oh, I'm sure. Working very hard. I'm sure. So so I think, you know, these companies, it's very important for them to clean up their act and become more efficient. That's important because we have a lot of hard work that needs to get done. We need people to step up and do a better job. You know, you can see these, you know, these extreme cases in Silicon Valley, like, you know, like when Twitter got taken over and went from 20,000 people to 2,000 people. And as far as I can tell, it's just working at least as good or better. Yeah. So what did 18,000 people do?
You know? I don't know if Amazon is could handle that same ratio, but lots of things probably could. And and so I think people need to get you know, if you if you are in a job where you can't see how your work matters and you're just taking a paycheck, it's not just who who cares if it's immoral or unethical. It's soul crushing. Like, that is you wanna know why you're depressed or pissed off. That's why. Like, you don't do something meaningful. That's not gonna work. Humans are evolved to be needed by the people around them. Like, you need to be needed. Mhmm. So find a new job. That's what I think. Which, like, actually kinda leads into my question I I was gonna ask you is that so,
[01:47:29] Unknown:
so so so what do you think about people who worry about that technology is moving faster than our ability to adapt ethically?
[01:47:37] Unknown:
Yeah. I mean, look, it's it's a tough thing to stomach, and I think, you know, you need to be compassionate with people. I'm obviously not it's right before dinner for me, so I'm not being very compassionate. But You're hangry. Right? But but yeah. You got me got me in a hangry moment. But, look, I think, you know, it's a it you need to be able to, you know, start with compassion, help people because their their brain is not built for the transitions that they gotta make. And so that's hard, and a lot of them aren't ready for it. So I think that keeping that in mind, a lot of the point of bringing these technologies to life is to make things better. There's a life cycle to that. Mhmm. Right? So we're probably in, like, junior high with social media.
Still poorly behaved, kinda pimply, like, don't quite have it figured out, saying some dumb shit, you know, whatever. AI, we're not even in preschool yet. I agree with that. But when you look on the longer his a longer timeline, like, we're pretty good with spreadsheets. We're really good at hammers and fire and other dangerous stuff that everybody has access to. Even cars. You know? Cars are really dangerous. We let, you know, 16 year olds drive 4,000 pounds around and aim it at whatever they want. Like, that is really dangerous. And and so but we have a mature relationship with it. Right? We've learned no one's freaking out about cars anymore because we've gotten used to them. We figured out how to kinda contain the risk more or less. Where's the where's the trade off? We've set those things societally. We're all used to it. So, you know, now but we're not used to it with, like, self driving cars. So people are more freaked out about self driving cars than they are about cars.
Mhmm. Well, cars are, like, a thousand times more dangerous than self driving cars. But people don't use math in their little brains. You know? They use they use emotions that come from some other part of the body. So, look General's breakdown. It's just you gotta be honest about these things and and try to reason your way to your beliefs, and that's just not natural thing for people. But the technologies are moving faster because we got past a couple of major bottlenecks. So now we have this period where we're gonna be accelerating and and bringing a lot of new technologies really fast.
And, you know, you can you can actually kinda kick back and ignore it if you want. I don't think that is very exciting. I mean, I think it's actually kinda fun to go learn about these things. Try them out. You're not gonna hurt anything with AI. Just go poke at it and see what it does. Yeah. And and if you find a way to make and a lot of these things, the the ultimate goal is to make your life better. Like, all these AI companies, the reasons they're worth trillions of dollars is because we think we can see how they're gonna make your life better. If they fail at that and they aren't making your life better, you're not gonna make enough money, and they're gonna tank anyway. They'll get what's coming to them.
But they have to make something that's so useful for you that you can't not pay for it. That's where they're at. And we want that. You know? You should want that. You know? We wanna go look at the there's a new robot. I think it's called, X one or what's the name of the company? The the robot's called Neo, I think. They just announced it today. So there's videos of this, like, robot that just walks around your house and cleans up messes. Pretty great. You know? Like, you're gonna want one of these things. And and and the thing is, it's just these these things are coming.
It's gonna make that robot is gonna make so many awesome fail videos on TikTok for, like, the next three years. Right? Everybody who gets one is gonna be following it around with their camera phone all day long, trying to catch it, tipping over, doing something stupid. Absolutely. Yes. That's but then but in but then but over those years, it's gonna learn how to handle every weird edge case, and it's gonna get to the point where it's really rock solid. It's better cleaning up your house than than you are on Adderall. Get like a seamless integration. Yeah. And so that's exciting. And, you know, you could help. Get one of those robots, have it try to wash dishes, you know, file bug reports every time it fails. You know, you can help make it better. I mean, that that's kinda what's going on is there's a transitionary process that developmental
[01:52:22] Unknown:
it's like raising a kid. You know? We have to go through these stages. We can't just skip from preschool to college. So Yeah. You're you're That's the thing. Yeah. Your three year old doesn't know what your 10 year old's gonna know, and your 10 year old doesn't know what your 16 year old's gonna know.
[01:52:37] Unknown:
Totally. Yeah. So have some fun with it, and, you know, don't freak out. It's it's not it's not
[01:52:44] Unknown:
a existential crisis. You know? I always used to say my my kids were my experiments.
[01:52:49] Unknown:
Yeah. Good. I mean
[01:52:53] Unknown:
yep. Mine just turned 18, so I'm a pre range adult. There you go. You're getting there. My my my oldest is 29. Just turned 29. Oh, wow. Oh, wow. Good work. And she gave me, she gave me three beautiful grandchildren. And, so I'm very very proud of smart smart girl too. I mean, I don't know where she got it from. It wasn't wasn't from me. Alright. She graduated, she graduated while she was pregnant with baby number two. Alright. She worked full time, and she and she graduated from Columbia University with her MBA with honors. Wow. Very, very impressive. Great. Very proud of her. She's pretty her to get these kids out of the house so we can get her back to work. Yeah. Well, no. She's still working too. She's Still working great. Her her and her husband, they they they give the they give they give my grandkids a beautiful life. So I'm very happy. Wow. Good work. And then, my my son is 26, and I kinda wonder if he's gonna make 27 sometimes.
But but, yeah. And he's doing great. He he lives up in Pennsylvania. My my daughter lives up in New York. I'm from New York originally. I'm not from Texas. Okay. So Yeah. So it's been, you know, I haven't seen them in a bit personally. I mean, I have photos and videos and stuff like that. Yeah. But not, like, personally. But, you know, everything I try to do, I try to do with them in mind. And, Yeah. Yeah. I get it. And, like I said, I I experimented on my kids. They were great. You know, they they were good subjects, and, you know, they did they they they somehow managed to, be successful and everything. So I didn't do too much damage along the way. Yeah. Somehow mine turned out pretty well too, but That's great. That that is great. In spite of me. So yeah. Exactly. Good point. In spite of me, they did very well. Yeah. So last question on on AI stuff.
As far as, like, like, how AI is, the create affecting human creativity over the next, say, decade or so, then you think it's like Yeah. Distortions, I mean, how do you see that shaping all of that creativity?
[01:54:46] Unknown:
You know, I just did a TED talk, and, I had AI make all the slides. Every slide is a bobblehead that AI made for me, and I couldn't do that. Mhmm. I don't know how to make a bobblehead. I don't know how to draw one. I never could do it. I can't draw at all. But I had this story I wanna tell. This this TED Talk hasn't gone live yet online, but it but I was able to share the story the way I wanted to. I was able to show these images that I had in my head, but now I could show them to people. I was able to put that together pretty quickly because I could just sit there and talk to AI and say, make me a bobblehead of Brad Pitt.
And it does it. You know? Right. Yeah. And it looks and it's actually amazing. So, like, I'm able to steer this thing to tell the story I wanna tell. AI has no idea how to tell the story that I wanted to tell. I'm creative about the story I wanted to tell. Mhmm. That's what I created. I didn't create the bobbleheads, but they were a little they were a little, you know, set pieces or actors in my storytelling. Yeah. And I couldn't have done all that without the AI. So I'm using it to expand what I can do. You know? Otherwise, I if without the AI, I would have said, oh, man.
It's too much work to make slides, to tell this story. I don't have time for that. I'm gonna have put it off until I'm retired. You know? So I think that that's a pretty good way of thinking about it. Most people you know, you might be good at one thing, but you probably suck at a bunch of other things. So the AI is gonna be there to help you out and help do the things that you suck at. Mhmm. And, you know, that's what you would do if you were rich. You'd hire people to do the things you suck at. Right. Most of us aren't rich enough to hire people to make bobbleheads or whatever thing that we need, you know, or clean up the house or whatever. You know? There's a lot of things that you're having to do. And, you know, yeah, it's character building, but, you know, I don't think it's working. Like, most people don't have enough character anyways. There's gotta be some other way to do that. That's a great point. So we gotta we gotta figure out how you do that. So I I don't think it's fair to blame the AI for eroding creativity. These are tools to help you be creative. You know? A piano is a way to help you be creative with music.
Yeah. That's what it is. It's a tool for you. And, you know, you have to spend years learning to play a piano before you're gonna do anything creative with it. Yeah. Well, now you could just go to an AI and say, hey. I can't play piano, but will you make me a little tune that sounds kinda like this thing I'm humming? And then, I got these lyrics, and I wanna make a song about this, but I can't find a word that rhymes with mom's spaghetti. So, you know, there's kind of a game to play here and and where you can start to use these things as team members. You know, use them to help you out, and and that's creative thing to do.
So I think it's democratizing for creativity. Right? Before, you know, only people who could draw could make images. Like, I one thing I love I'm excited about this. I haven't done this yet, but I'm looking forward to. I love infographics. I love it when somebody can tell a story about data in a graphic format and show me, like, you know, here's how many windmills there are in Texas versus Alaska, you know, and you see it visually. Mhmm. Well, now we can have AIs help make those for us. Now I wanna play with that. I wanna have it say, like, have it make me an infographic for for the things I'm working on. So I just but that's just what I wanna do. You know? You anybody could pick something. And so I think this is a exciting moment because now even though I can't draw, I'll be able to make infographics. And maybe I'm not maybe they're just for me. You know? Maybe I'm making it to show other people, but maybe it's just like, I wanna get this idea in my head. Let's do an infographic because that's what I understand.
[01:59:17] Unknown:
That makes sense.
[01:59:18] Unknown:
Yeah. So there's just so much cool stuff happening. I think getting too wound up about about, you know, how, like, AI is gonna I mean, yeah, you if you get use it as a crutch and you don't learn to play piano, then you're not gonna have that skill, but maybe you'll use that time to build some other skill, like the skill of piloting AI piano players. You know? Interesting. Yeah. So that's and and, honestly, like, I think a easy way to contextualize this is just think about what would rich people do if well, you know, like, what would I do if I was rich? I hire somebody to clean up the house. I'd hire somebody to wash the car. I'd hire somebody driving around. I'd hire somebody to play the piano, and I would just sit here and think of cool shit for all my minions to do. Well, now you can.
[02:00:08] Unknown:
You have the ability now. You can do it. Yeah. That's awesome. Exactly. Well, it's kinda like like the
[02:00:14] Unknown:
the I wanted a picture of myself with a reptilian at the ranch wearing cowboy hats, and I used AI to create that. And it came out fantastic. It was great. Yeah. You know? Easy. Yeah. And right now, that's useless shit. I mean I mean, it's Yeah. Of course. Yeah. But but when you can imagine here's the here's another way to think about it. Have you ever had in your life an idea for a product or a project or something that you wanted to do, but you didn't have the time or money to do it? Sure. Every I'm sure everybody has Everybody has something. Yeah. Well, as as AI evolves, it's gonna be able to do that for you. Mhmm.
It's gonna be able to do that for you. And what kind of awesome world is it gonna be where, you know, you can just dream up an infomercial product? It'll make it'll design the product for you. You can give it some feedback to make it better or different. It'll make the whole infomercial for you, and then you can click buy now and get one three d printed and mailed to you. And even if nobody else in the world ever buys it, like, you've gotten to have that whole experience. Like, I don't know. I just think this is, like, such an exciting
[02:01:27] Unknown:
evolution. There's huge potential for it. There's Yeah. And the on on the positive and the negative sides. But, you know Yeah. And and you get Yeah. Because other assholes are gonna make infomercial products that suck, and they're gonna Yeah. Spam the world with them and whatever. But Yeah. It's my AI versus yours. Yeah. Exactly. Alright. So I know it's getting late for you over there, and you're getting hangry, and I got Charlie I got Charlie getting hangry outside the door here. So, Cool. So, last things. What do you hope that people take away from this conversation tonight?
[02:01:55] Unknown:
Well, look. I know I'm being a little bombastic, but the truth is I I think, what matters is, you know, that we are gonna build our future, and we really get some volition in this. I'm trying to show examples of that both in the book and on the podcast and that kind of thing. So I'm trying to, you know, indulge. But, you know, we also invest in these inventors, and I try to get more of these things brought to life. So if you find somebody with crazy hair and a DeLorean,
[02:02:29] Unknown:
send them my way, and we'll we'll sort them out. Alright. Outstanding. Alright. So where can the audience go to find your book and more information about you and follow your work?
[02:02:37] Unknown:
Yeah. All that's on our website that you described. So it's deepfuture.tech,tech. That's a good place to start. The book's there, the podcast's there, all kinds of random stuff, and, yeah, that's the best place. And we have email list that's really good. So get on the email list to the WhatsApp group I think I'm on it. And see what's happening. I think I'm on the email list. So,
[02:02:58] Unknown:
I I know I signed up for it today. Yeah. Yeah. So Okay. Alright. Outstanding. And, hey, Pablo, anytime you wanna come back on the show, please just let me know. I'd love to have you back on. Especially after I especially after I get a chance to read your book, man. I I I I I'm gonna order it and Alright.
[02:03:12] Unknown:
The audio book you'll like because I read it myself. Oh, cool. Yeah. I'll check that out. That wasn't hangry. So
[02:03:18] Unknown:
yeah. Outstanding. Alright. Pavel Solman, thank you so much, man. I appreciate you being here tonight. God bless you. Have a great night. Enjoy that dinner. You too. Alright, brother. You too. Take care now. Alright, folks. Pablo's home, and I hope that was that was a great I love that talk. You you know what? I'm gonna tell you honestly, you know, in in even though we we didn't get all the information that we normally would have for our guests, I didn't know what to expect walking into this tonight with either of the guests, and this absolutely I love this conversation tonight. I think we had a I think we had a great time. Two great guests, and I hope you guys got something out of that tonight. And, I hope you're gonna go and, you know, and share the show and let everybody else see this thing. This was this was really good tonight. Alright. So just a couple of quick announcements before we wrap up for the night. So don't forget to head over to the website, joeroos.com, sign up for the programming announcements email list that we have. Don't forget, this is not it's not a sales pitch. We're not gonna send you anything you don't want. We're just gonna send you information about upcoming shows, guests, schedules, whatever it might be, any little thing that changes, whatever it is. So get yourself on the mailing list, jo roos dot com. Little window is gonna pop up on the screen there. Just fill it out. Get yourself on the mailing list. It's free, which means it don't cost you nothing, and it's, it's it's really informative. So just get on the mailing list. Alright? Stay in the know.
Also, wanna remind you about the upcoming events coming over here in Eagle Pass. We have the Eagle Pass Public Library is hosting its Halloween event on the twenty eighth. Well, that was yesterday. I didn't take it off my notes. I am so sorry. Forget that. Yesterday's event went very well from what I understand. Okay. Sorry. Oh, I've got to take it out. Alright. The veterans food drive though, that's that's very important. That's coming up. That's November 3, 7AM to 12PM at the Maverick Food Pantry, 1823 South Veterans Boulevard. And if you want more information about that event, you can always call (956) 251-9093.
That's (956) 291-9053. If you wanna help out, you wanna volunteer, you wanna more some more information about it, very important, we need to support our veterans. Alright? We need to support our veterans. I mean, our veterans, men or women, doesn't matter, put their life on the line to defend your freedoms, my freedoms, every single day. And they are very often overlooked, and until recently the government did a very very poor job in taking care of our veterans. I think our veterans should get everything for free, to be honest with you. If any if anybody in this country is ending for free, it should be our veterans. Abs without a doubt.
You could disagree with me on that one, I don't really care. That's just my opinion on it, and you could drop a comment down below, let me know what you think. Alright. So the veterans food drive right here in Eagle Pass on November 3, 7AM to 12PM, or while supplies last at the Maverick Food Pantry on 1823 South Veterans Boulevard. Check it out. Alright? Very, very, very important thing. Alright. Socials, you wanna follow us on our socials on, you can get us on, on on Twix at Joe Ruse. It's right up there on the screen. Truth Social, Joe Ruse. Minds at Joe Ruse. Facebook, Joe Ruse Show. Instagram is not Joe Ruse. TikTok is jo dot ruse. And Getter is at Joe Ruse. Shout outs to our executive producing team, Wayne Rankin, Rosanna Rankin, Carolina Jimenez, Marissa Lee, and of course, anonymous Angela. Thank you guys so much for what you do. Your time, your talent, your treasure, greatly appreciated, incredibly thankful for it. So again, guys, just the best. I love you guys. Thank you so much.
Also, I just wanna give another another thank you and shout out to John Seeley for his donation this week of $25. Thank you so much, sir. Appreciate that. And I know I knew I recognized the name, John. I I knew I recognized your name, and, so again thank you for for your donation. I I remember you followed the other show and, it's it's been great that you were able to come back this way and find us again. So thank you so much for that, buddy. I appreciate it. And again, thank you for the donation. It's it's it's greatly appreciated. Now if you wanna help us out, you could always do a donation, a one time donation of 25 of, of any amount. You could do a recurring donation in any amount. You could also join up as a producer of the show. You could sign up for associate producer at $17.76 a month. Producer is $18.36 a month, and executive producer is $25 a month or more recurring donations. Okay?
All producers get the shout out on every show. They get included in all of our show notes. They get anything that we send out from the show. Your name is in there because you are producing this show through your contributions. Alright? So all of that is included in that. And then as an executive producer, you get to book a segment on the show with us live. Now we normally do our Wednesday nights with Wayne, but Wayne has been under the weather. He's not feeling great. He's recovering well. I heard from him today. Gonna keep him in prayer. He went for some tests today to get some results on at the end of the week. So let's keep him in prayer. Let's let's let's, let's let's get him back here on the show. We miss him, and, we look forward to having him here again very, very soon.
If you wanna help us out with donations of cryptocurrencies, you can do that too. It's on our website. Support page has all of our wallet information up there. You can do that. And, of course, thank you to the folks that are streaming stats to us across the modern podcast apps like Podcast Guru, fountain.fm, and so on. You can get any of those apps. They're available in your app stores. You can get them there too, but, you really wanna support the modern podcast apps and the two point o platforms, you go up to modernpodcastapps.com or podcastindex.org.
Alright. And don't forget, folks, you could also find this show on all of your podcast wherever you wherever you get your podcast, this show is available to you there. You wanna check out the videos, the replays of the videos or the or download the videos, we're on Rumble, which is which is our home. We love Rumble. Rumble is our free speech platform, so check us out on rumble.com/joerus. You can also find us on YouTube at youtube.com/@joerus. We're on Twitch. We're on x. We're on Facebook. We're all over the place. So no excuse not to catch the show, so make sure you check us out. And listen, if you if you do check us out on on wherever platform it is, if you have the ability to do so, drop a review. Let us know. Like, subscribe, share it. Send it out to your friends, your family, your followers. Help us to grow this thing. Help us to get the word out. And, help us to build the audience. We've been doing really good. So, really really really very pleased and, you know, we're getting there. We're getting where we wanna be. So let's let's let's work on it together. Alright, folks. Alrighty. I think, I think that's it. Charlie is really howling at the door here. So we're gonna say, good night. So again, folks, thank you again for everything and for being with us tonight. Thank you to our guests. Don't forget to follow the show and, head to the website, joerus.com.
Let us know what you think. Alright, folks. Make Texas independent again. Go podcasting. Keep a steady stride. Keep talking. We'll see you Friday, have a good night folks.
[02:10:43] Unknown:
Weather. Happy trails to you to remain
Cold open, theme, and a rocky start
Host intro, housekeeping, and live show setup
Community engagement, contact info, and support model
Guest 1 intro: Tom Matt and the origin of Upside Vision
From addiction to a new perception: defining Upside Vision
Interpreting holographic images, limits, and uses
Live readings, symbolism, and session flow
Wellness, grounding practices, and empathic effects
Archetypes, animals, and cultural meaning in readings
EEG findings and what the science suggests
Human evolution, Akashic ideas, and possible futures
Takeaways, book plug, and how to learn more
Break and interlude
Hour 2 kickoff and sponsor mention
Guest 2 intro: Pablo Holman on inventing the future
From hacker roots to Blue Origin and long horizons
Choosing problems that matter: energy, health, scale
From crazy idea to working prototype
Deep Future: the book, podcast, and mission
Robotics reality check: fingertips, fabric, and factories
Beyond software: bringing hard tech to life
Personal stories, accessible tech, and why it matters
All hands on deck: careers that build the future
AI, jobs, and focusing attention on what you can change
AI and creativity: tools that expand human reach
Parting thoughts, how to follow, and resources
Closing remarks, local events, and producer shout‑outs
Sign‑off and show close
