Fundamentals. @Fundamentals21m
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AverageGary
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In this episode, I'm joined by Average Gary as we delve into the fascinating intersection of mathematics and music, exploring how mathematical concepts can be applied to understand musical patterns and time signatures. We discuss the intriguing idea of pattern recognition and its role in both mathematics and music, highlighting how humans are naturally wired to recognize patterns, which can be mistaken for mathematical talent. We also touch on the concept of mastery, emphasizing the importance of putting in the hours and the will to learn, even when it seems like a waste of time.
We further explore the idea of being a generalist versus a specialist, and how this relates to understanding complex systems like Bitcoin. The conversation shifts to the importance of struggling and pushing oneself to the edge of one's abilities to truly master a subject. We discuss the concept of escape velocity in learning and how reducing friction can help achieve mastery. The episode concludes with reflections on how Bitcoin can serve as a tool for learning and understanding complex systems, and the importance of finding one's unique path in the world of mathematics and beyond.
[00:00:30]
Unknown:
I'm joined today by fundamentals. I'm Average Gary. And Are you ready to bore
[00:00:36] Unknown:
you and lull you to sleep with what he talks about I'm here to bore you. Distractions and I'm here to bore you. If anyone's gonna bore anyone, it's me. Alright? What's up, Gary? It's good to good to see you. Yeah. Likewise. Yeah. It's good to it's shared this time. So I, you know, I'd say there was a mixed reaction to the music I attempted in the last episode, but let me at least explain why I, chose that song and that well, one, I like it. But, No other explanation needed at that point. The song is called waste, and it's, like, about like, it's like the chorus says, come waste your time with me. And that's sort of how I feel about the audience here. It's like, come waste you know, because everybody thinks math is a waste of time. We just talked about the mathematicians' lament.
[00:01:26] Unknown:
Yeah. And We're gonna talk more about that, I hope. I I think we will.
[00:01:30] Unknown:
Okay. I have a there's part of me that wants to read from it, but there's another part of me that says kinda fuck that. I have some thoughts I wanna just get across about it. But I, you know, I I think when I think about the music, I want I just wanted to have some music. You know? I like I like when the podcast ends. It's one of my favorite things that BusinessGad does. Like, when the podcast ends, there's, like, some nice music to take you out.
[00:01:57] Unknown:
Well and there's something like, there's a mathematical thing to the music as well. Right? Like, there there is there's math to music. Well, there certainly is.
[00:02:07] Unknown:
The the you know, you could cons I think, something I got into a little bit was even, like, you know, the property, the axioms of the group. Like, are there, like you know, when you have, like, octaves and scales and modes and Those are groups in a sense? If you do an like, you can do an operation called, say maybe there's certain modes where you do a full step or a half step, and no matter what, you may you know, it's closed under that mode or something like that. Right? There's there may say there isn't there exists an operation, right, that's maybe a certain amount of steps or a certain amount of rests or beats or something that that that, you know, where you can establish something that's a group. This is like this is what math, like, what math nerds do to force the concept. Right? And so, you know, it's funny because the mathematicians lament, he talks about how stupid it is for teachers to try to relate it some like, the, you know, the teachers are so fucking just just so dumb trying to they they trying to relate it so much to kids. You know?
[00:03:20] Unknown:
In my mind, I know nothing about music. Right? So, like, I played the flute in sixth grade for Yeah. Probably half a year. And I played it because I thought it was gonna be a quiet instrument, and nobody would hear me practicing. Oh my god. And that was just completely wrong. But, anyway, that sorry for that tangent. But in my mind, I just went to, like there's, like, this, like, like, four eights or something. Like, there's a way of describing, like There's time signatures. Yeah. There's time signatures. Yeah. There's all there's numbers to math. There there's Absolutely. Numbers to math. There's numbers to music. One of the big numerical representation of music that can be used.
[00:03:59] Unknown:
Absolutely. There's a guy who does re there's a big thing in in music and in, social media space called, like, reaction videos. I'm sure I'm not I'm I'm like a boomer telling you Yeah. These things exist. I think I know that. But but, I happen to love reaction videos for Phish because it basically takes me back to the discovery of, it's kinda you know, it's like when I was, going back and forth with eight myth Randir when he was starting to listen to all the episodes and it was activating a bunch. It was like he was doing his own reaction to the podcast, and Yeah. It gave me a new appreciation for what we were doing. And when I see these reaction videos, it gives me a new just takes me back to, like, beginning to appreciate something that I hadn't thought about in thirty years.
And, there's a guy who does them for fish really well. His name is Walter Ruski. I've talked about him on my fish podcast a lot, but he does he'll, like, stop the video and say He specifically does Phish reaction videos? He does all of them. He does a lot. Okay. But he'll he'll stop the video and he'll say, I'm hearing, like, I'm hearing the guitar player playing, you know, seven four, and I'm hearing the band playing four four. And he starts doing the math, and he's like, by the time he's like, it's gonna take, you know, something like 28 verses for them to come back together, to come back and connect again on the same, like, on the same beat signature. And he'll sit there and do the math about it. I think that's fun and interesting. And he can hear that? Like, he can hear He can hear because he's a musician, and he's I don't know what he plays, but I think percussionists are very good at, you know, detecting time signatures very easily. Well, I mean, is that be that's because percussion, like, sort of sets the timing for for a lot of the other things. They have a gift for knowing what you know, just kinda being dropped in a jam somewhere knowing the time signature. They usually set it. So maybe they're not that good at listening for it. But, like, I'm a guitar player. I'm I'm okay. I'm pretty good at listening for the time signature.
Right?
[00:05:59] Unknown:
Anyhow
[00:06:00] Unknown:
You you have to jump in at the right time. Well, and also if you're learning a song, like, you may learn a song, like, especially if you're learning progressive rock songs like Phish songs, like you will hear one instrument playing one time signature and another instrument playing it down in another one. And I think that's the thing that, yeah, he would notice and start doing the math and try to figure out how many measures are they putting you through this, tension, right, before it resolves. Right? And is that tension because to the ear or something sort of, like, wonky to it Yeah. That that To the ear, it doesn't off between two two six right, but as long as the your main rhythm section is in four four, your brain is like, this is music. Okay? It's just very weird music for a little bit, but I it's like you can kinda feel that it's gonna resolve, And it's incredibly satisfying when it does.
But there's a basic math though, like, okay. How many measures are you gonna put the listener through of the pain? Right? The Yeah. Pain and discomfort before you pay it off.
[00:07:06] Unknown:
I'm trying to think of parallel parallels to actual math of like
[00:07:11] Unknown:
It's I mean, I don't know if I'd consider any of this math in any way, but, like, it's definitely arithmetic and
[00:07:17] Unknown:
it's so this is like back to, you know. Well well, more of, like, the fundamental, like, the things in our brain that is wired for math and, like, what is it? Music is one of those things for sure. Explanation of patterns. Right? Like, that's maybe maybe that's what it is. It's like explanations of pattern. Like, math math is a way of explaining patterns
[00:07:39] Unknown:
and and reasoning about the world. It can be. That's one of its one of its users, we'll say.
[00:07:45] Unknown:
Right. Well, it it just again, drawing from the whole, like, music thing. Like, there's something in your brain you said that, like, four four is like, oh, that's music. Like, there's some recognition there. There's, like, a pattern recognition. And I think this is pretty well documented. Like, pattern recognition is, like, what humans excel at. It's like we just we recognize patterns. Like, oh, everybody that eats these red berries dies. So, like, let's not eat these red berries. Right? Like, there's a pattern.
[00:08:08] Unknown:
Yeah. Pattern recognition is a big part of how, you know, how our brains are wired. A lot of people confuse that for, like, mathematical talent.
[00:08:19] Unknown:
Right? Well, why well, and that's where I was I was gonna kinda take it though is, like, do you not think that some of these, like, great mathematicians, like, recognize these patterns to do some of these, like Well, yeah. It's it's a it's a component.
[00:08:32] Unknown:
It's a you know what I mean? It's a component, but, like, I would say somebody like Gauss, you know, the big talent is the ability to put a billion hours in so that the pattern emerges to recognize. Right? So that's what that's the talent is in, like, not knowing what what what or why he's doing it, and therefore doing it forever and putting, you know, putting more time in it than any other human being will ever ever think about doing so in order and then and then finding and then seeing the pattern. And everyone's like, oh, he recognized that pattern. He must be really good at recognizing patterns. It's like, no. He's good at generating a data set in a finite lifetime such that there is a pattern.
[00:09:16] Unknown:
And What I mean and and does that speak to, like, the the general thesis of, like, mastery of, like, you know, ten thousand hours doing something before you can truly master it. Right? And is that Yeah. But I mean just concreting
[00:09:27] Unknown:
patterns in your brain. That is a form of mastery. I mean, look at chess master. Right? Right. Like, that's what the you know, you can, like, wake them up out of a deep sleep and show them a board, and they'll know They'll be like, oh, yeah. That's mate in seven. You just see it. It's just, you know, that that's just because it's programmed. It's not like it doesn't take away from, like, it does take it does require an intelligence to do that. I think that's probably my greatest skills, pattern recognition too. It was one of my great one of my big skills, but I also there's a probably a greater intelligence in being able to connect dots. And this is what I was gonna actually, talk about. Just a pattern. Right? Like, you connect that you can just connect the dots that don't seem like they should be connected.
Nobody in the world, like, you're everybody thinks you're crazy. Right? Like, I do this fish podcast, the connecting fish and Bitcoin. Everyone thinks I'm out of my mind. Right? And I'm not claiming to be some sort of genius. I'm just saying that I see the pattern and I I I live on this earth and insist I have the sort of god given will to insist that this is an interesting story to tell and that this is there is pattern and even though no one else sees it. Right? Yeah. So it's like, it's a balance it's a balance of both of those things. I would I maybe the kind of end the kind of intelligence I covet is the one where people is the creative kind. Right?
Like, I think that, pattern recognition is more past based. Right? It's like you're building a neural maybe neural network in your of data you're building a data set in your mind and you're indexing it and you're keeping it you're making you're make you're I think you're making yourself as a human being into a, very effective kind of computer Yeah. Which certainly converts a certain kind of intelligence, but it may not be the kind of intelligence people think. Right? Right. Just the same way mathematics is not reduced to con to compute. It's also not reduced to recall. Yeah. Although it's a a big part of it. You know, if you if you study math like, let's just say you study number theory. Right? And you go through the division algorithm.
Mhmm. And then you forget everything about it a week later when you're trying to do the Euclidean algorithm, it's not gonna be very useful. So if you're not retaining if you don't have the ability to retain, like, a lot of specific concepts and that's where you know, okay. Well, what does it take to do that is you have to do problems, you have to do exercises, you have to practice it, and you have to master it. And that's the real talent is finding the will to do that when, you know, your brain is mostly telling you I should be doing something else.
[00:12:18] Unknown:
Well and I think you're right to the extent of wanting to take a specific subject to a higher level or to a next level. However, though and and maybe this is just like the difference in the way that my brain works. It it to me, a lot of times it's sufficient enough for me to go That's what mastery is, by the way. Mastery is Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm I'm I average Gary is a handle not just like, you know, flipping handle. It's because, I I'm very much a generalist in a lot of things. And I will I will sort of, like, deep dive on these, like, one or two things to learn it. And then, like, once I learn it, I I almost, like, create, like, an index in my brain of, like, hey. I know this is how this thing works, and maybe I forget how to explain the deep technical nuances of such a thing. But I know, like, general like, for example, like, a discrete log contract on on on Bitcoin. Right? It's like a way of doing sort of like an escrow esque thing where you're trusting, like, a signer. Sure. A third party signer in Oracle to to sign something that, like, unlocks a certain contract.
I can't explain to you right now, like, in detail, like, how that thing works, but the general premise and the general, like, way that DLCs work is, like, registered in my brain as, like, an idea Mhmm. To be to be connected to other ideas. Right? Yes.
[00:13:41] Unknown:
Yes. So okay. You have really done something interesting. Nobody is nobody listening is gonna know what I'm talking about, but I came today ready to talk about something called the generalist's limit. Are
[00:13:55] Unknown:
you serious?
[00:13:56] Unknown:
Dead serious. And, like, basically knows. Okay. It's just something I thought of while I was reading the mathematicians lament.
[00:14:04] Unknown:
Okay. Alright.
[00:14:05] Unknown:
Okay. Maybe this is what I need in my my my heart. I'm reading the mathematicians lament, and I'm like, oh, I gotta read this. I gotta read this. This is too good. I have to read it. I gotta read this. And I really felt this way and we may have an episode where we do read pieces of it. Mhmm. However, I hit I something just completely shifted for me in the middle of reading that when I started thinking about my own lament, which is I am a generalist. I've always referred to myself as a consummate generalist. Mhmm. And I have always struggled with, like, I am 50 years old and it really I'd say, it still hasn't happened yet. What the it is, like, when the, you know, whatever needs whatever the planets need to align for every kinda all the the general information and general things and general knowledge and concepts and things you've been exposed to and Mhmm. For it to all come together and lead to something, you know, significant.
Right? Yeah. Whereas I have specialized in things and I've already mastered them and I've already they're already way in the rear view mirror. Whereas the the, like, you know, the the big the big payoff of being a generalist has not happened. And if you go through your lot you can go through your entire life feeling this way and feeling like a failure. Right? Because you just know, you know, you know, you're in this game and you know you have certain ability and that you feel like you should have discovered something. This all should amount to something and it hasn't. And so I read a book. The thing that really I read a book that I think a lot of people consider shallow, but I thought it was, very meaningful to me. It was a book called Range. It's one of those business books you'd find in the airport. It's why, like, you know, people kind of shit on it. Mhmm. Have you ever heard of this book? You should definitely read. Okay. It's it's a bunch of stories about generalists versus specialists. It's like a Malcolm Gladwell type book that you like I said, you'd find in the airport, you know.
Yeah. Probably a best seller. However, it was really meaningful to me. It spoke very much to me because it told stories of generalists. And some of them, like, didn't discover what they were meant to discover until they were in their nineties. And it like, I hadn't, discovered Bitcoin yet. I didn't have exactly I I wasn't really looking to wait till I was 90. Yeah. Right? But this is one of the things maybe I think that Bitcoin really did for me, which is allow me to have a longer horizon of my life and say, it's okay if whatever it is. Absolutely. And then and so the stories of these generalists, for example, so I think the first chapter, as cheesy as it gets, it's like Roger Federer versus Tiger Woods, something like that where like Roger Federer's parents didn't allow him to specialize in sport. And you really grew up in an age where that was starting to become very, very, very important.
Mhmm. You weren't gonna make it if you didn't specialize. Right? And I think that's true about a lot of a lot of things and a lot of pursuits. Right? You're probably not going to ever get recognized, but that really is more of a statement of the fiat system than it is of you. Right? And that ultimately at the end of the day. Yeah. There's one chapter I really wanna talk about because it's about math. Okay? Okay. Keep going. It's about math. And this is what it got triggered reading the Mathematician's Lemait. Okay. So there was a, a big a big long study, years, maybe five, six years long.
Mhmm. On calculus programs in college. Okay. And so what they what they did was they they gave pretty broad latitude on what the curriculum you know, the curriculum had to be within a certain confined limit, but they gave broad latitude on how to teach it. Right? How rigorous, how, you know, how rigorous, how deep, how shallow. K? And, what happened was they look so then they looked at the grades the kids got, and then they looked they had the kids rate their teachers. Right? And then they followed up with these kids five years later to see what they were doing with their life. Were they doing anything in math or or or not? Right? Yeah. Okay. So here is essentially the, the bottom line, and then I'll get into a little bit of the what what it all means. Bottom line was that the kids that got the best grades rated their teachers the highest, and five years later, we're not doing anything in math.
The kids that got the worst grades rated their teachers the worst, but for some some way somehow were way more involved, way more prevalently involved in mathematical perfect professions and pursuits.
[00:19:14] Unknown:
There's a lot to there's a lot to, like, unpack from that. Yeah. Let's say so, like, what's the what do you glean from that? Or, like, what's the conclusion the book came to at least? First one was that, obviously, professors are incentivized
[00:19:26] Unknown:
to make the class very easy to give their kids good grades because then they get good ratings and everybody's happy and no one gives a shit who's doing math in five years. Yeah. Okay. So that's, like, the first kinda obvious conclusion. Right? Now if you've never taken calculus before, I don't know that you can appreciate the variety of how it can be taught. Now I, I was in so a lot of people know I didn't like, I stopped going to high school for two years basically. I just couldn't fucking be there. I hated it. Sure. And I was able to cut and not get caught for two years.
And despite that, I I still test like I still did my work and I still studied and I because I liked it. And I test when I got to college, magic the college, I got to went to Temple University and I tested into the honors program and I took honors calculus and I got a D in it and I had to retake it. And then when I retook it I was like fucked up and I was like still fucked up from the night before and I got an A minus I think in the class. It was so easy. It was incredibly easy. So I have a very vivid idea of how calculus can be very hard because I was actually still I was pretty good at it. I was good enough to test in the honors program. Right? So I was like, I was pretty or at least I thought I was good at it. I would have rated my my teachers highly, which is myself.
But I was pretty good at it, but I got rocked in this honors class. Right? I got fucking rocked. And I had a so I have a very clear sense of how something with a very limited, like, the the limited, curriculum can be made very, very hard if they if the professor wants it to be. Right? Yeah. And just like a quick example is, like, if anyone here who's taking calculus will know this, like
[00:21:23] Unknown:
I have not for the record. Yeah. But have you heard of derivatives?
[00:21:27] Unknown:
Derivative is a rate of change. So, like, in physics, the you have Sure. The velocity is how is how fast. Velocity is a measure of speed. Right? So, like, relative to a position. So it's like how much does that position change when you change time. Yep. And you can then go one derivative more and say call it acceleration, which is how much the velocity is changing due to time. Right? Okay. Okay. Okay. Now there's a very shallow, I well, the word is technique oriented. You can learn the technique of calculating a derivative. The majority of derivatives, like, in a of, like, a polynomial x to the n Mhmm.
The derivative is simply n times x to the n minus one. Meaning, like, x to the fifth, the derivative is five x to the fourth. X to the tenth Say that again. Let me let me put that in. So x to the fifth, the derivative is five x to the fourth.
[00:22:21] Unknown:
Five x to the fourth.
[00:22:23] Unknown:
Okay. And then there because x to the the exponent of x was five. And so the Right. I'm teaching you the technique, and everyone here is gonna know the technique for calculating the derivative. And you're gonna think you don't understand calculus. Okay. Right? So, like and then the derivative of five x to the fourth is 20 x to the third. Because Four times five is 20 Yep. Four times that yep. Times the thing. Right? And then 20 x to the third, that derivative is gonna be 60 x squared. And the derivative of that will be a 20 x.
And then the derivative of that will be a 20, and then the derivative of that will be zero. You go, I'll go, oh, no. What happened? We stopped the pattern. But, actually, the exponent is zero, so you multiply it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Zero zero. So this is the technique. Okay? And there's a lot of calculus classes where that's all they teach you. You know, there's a fun one called the the function e to the x, the where the derivative is e to the x. That's what you you're gonna see on the test. It's just like if you were training if you just wanted to get people to move through an engineering program and not feel like a retard and stay in school, right, and keep paying, you would just basically teach them the technique. You wouldn't teach them you wouldn't go any deeper and and say, well, how do you know a derivative even exists?
And this seems applicable to just more broadly, like, the education today. It does. But this so this is a but but it's particularly, like you know, the mathematicians lament put a particular color on this, but I really like, it really well, for what it did for me when I read this book, I wanna say it was 2017 when I read this book. Okay. And what it did for me was, you know, I so my, you know, my daughter at the time would have been 12 or 13 years old. I I already it it reinforced something that I knew already knew very well, which was the importance of struggling. Like Right. The importance of really kicking someone's ass. Yep.
Especially if somebody who's engaged and wants to learn. And, you know, making them fucking suffer and bleed is important. And so that is one of the reasons. If you guys feel like I'm some kind of sociopath doing this podcast, knowing because I know full well how difficult it is to be listening to this
[00:24:53] Unknown:
a lot of the time. I mean, it's difficult. Like, I was sharing this before we started. Like, it's difficult keeping up with this on a on a weekly basis. But the the driving motivation is the the showing up is the hardest part in most things. Yes. And if you can do that at a minimum consistently, whether that's fitness, whether that's doing math, whether that's learning a new skill, whatever it is, like, the the building of the repetitions is is the is the fitness. Right? There's a guy, as doing a strong man course once. His name was Rob Orlando.
And he said fitness is just a lifetime accumulation of reps. And I think you can take fitness and replace it with x, whatever it is. And it's just a lifetime accumulation of doing the thing and forcing yourself to doing and and not stopping and not giving up. It's a big part of it. The thing is shitty. That is a first derivative
[00:25:52] Unknown:
view. Meaning, you know, it's just like one movement over time, and it's true. You accumulate reps over time. And it's like the ten thousand hour thing. You accumulate reps over time. I will add a second derivative, I e, an acceleration. I think it's also important to rev the engine and push yourself to the edge of your ability at times. Not just like sprinting. Right? It's like, yes. You can run. You can train for a marathon, but you may be very bad at certain sports if that's all you do. Yeah. Absolutely. But you have to be able to in a very short amount of time like, you may not be able to out like, escape a tiger if all you did was train for marathons. Right. And I think so I think also this is I'm really using this as an excuse to bring derivatives into this conversation. But, like, second derivative approach, and I think about this a lot because I think about escape velocity.
Escape velocity in physics is how do you you know, when you shoot a rocket out, it must be going fast enough to overcome the gravitational force of the earth. Right. Otherwise and there is a point there is a point where it leaves that force. Right? Right. And it or not that it leaves that force, but it leaves that you end up in orbit instead of forming the ground. Escape velocity comes to mind. That's right. That's exactly what that's that's what I was saying. Right? So, like, you want there's an escape velocity that allows you to end up in orbit instead of falling to the ground.
Right? There's a there's exact there's an exact moment where that happens. Right? And we know what that is. I couldn't tell you what it is, but obviously, physicists know how fast a projectile has to go to end up in orbit instead of Yeah. Falling. Okay. But how do you measure how do you know what that escape escape velocity is for whatever you're pursuing? You well, I mean, I think in fit well, so in physics, you know, because you know the grav it's it's, the gravitational what there's a formula for the gravitational force of of, that a body is under between two masses. Quantity of mass that Earth is. Right? How's it gravitational force? Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Now how do you know what it is if you're in an abstract doing something abstract, like trying to master something? Right? Like math?
You don't know. So you that's why I said you have to, like, sprint as fast as you can every once in a while. You have to rev your engine. The word friction comes to mind. Like Yeah.
[00:28:23] Unknown:
Around knowing. Right? Because at a certain point, what I guess the
[00:28:30] Unknown:
well, no. The the friction just impacts the speed you're able to accomplish. Right? Yeah. Friction is just a barrier to reaching that velocity. Yeah. So you wanna design yourself to be unencumbered as unencumbered as possible from those frictions. Like, so if you're a drug addict, right, and you're very preoccupied with things just things in your life that are not, you know, that are gonna that's a big that would be a big friction to, you know, you would think for most people that would be a big friction for, mastering a skill other than doing drugs.
Right?
[00:29:11] Unknown:
Yeah. I guess I was trying to frame it in a way where, like, gravity is not the friction.
[00:29:16] Unknown:
Gravity is the is the force against That's right. The friction would be the design of the module going up. Right? So, like, the aerodynamic design, that's you want it to be, you know, you want it to,
[00:29:29] Unknown:
But reducing that friction allows you to reach escape velocity faster.
[00:29:34] Unknown:
Yeah. It it makes it it makes it impossible.
[00:29:39] Unknown:
Like, there's frictions that make escape velocity impossible. You're not gonna shoot, like, a big cube into space.
[00:29:44] Unknown:
And that's the thing. So that's why I reacted. I said, so it's sorta like no matter how many if you're just, like, throwing a baseball as hard as you can forever, there are no amount of reps that's gonna put that baseball in orbit. You could live to the age of a billion, and you're never gonna You're never gonna baseball every day, and it's never gonna happen.
[00:30:07] Unknown:
You need you need to,
[00:30:10] Unknown:
adjust. You need to change. That's the so that's just the sober I mean, I'm saying that's the sobering thing that we need to think about as humans. Right? If we wanna learn something, we wanna learn it to a level of mastery. You know, it's not gonna be enough to just do reps, regular reps. And even though, like, most people will never do that. Right? Yeah. Well, I think that's why that's on what your objective is. Right? You gotta pound the shit out of it over also. Not not continuously forever, but you'd have to have your moments where you really pound the shit out of it. And that is where so I think that what I've just started with talking about somebody like Gauss. Right?
Skye, like, the thing that's in the way and again, the mathematicians lament. The thing that gets in the way of doing that work is just this this demoralization or this idea that you do better use there's better ways to spend your time. Right? That's what it's sort of like the big sigh up they got us with here. Right?
[00:31:16] Unknown:
I was, Well, that that coupled with the fact that just time having the time is a luxury already. So it it Absolutely. It's the the grind in the hamster wheel rat race of Fiat that gives this psyop such credibility. And so it's very easy to become psy ops if you're like, oh, man. Well, if I don't insert activity that will accrue me more fiat, then I will be wasting my time.
[00:31:41] Unknown:
That's the friction. That's yes. So that's a so those are frictions. Right?
[00:31:47] Unknown:
Oh. Bit Bitcoin's a lubricant.
[00:31:49] Unknown:
It's I'd say so. I definitely would say so. It's also a motive it's something that motivates like, a lot of us maybe didn't know that it was important to understand cryptography. Ourselves ourselves not trusting other people, but, like, ourselves. And a lot of us still don't understand that.
[00:32:10] Unknown:
What and what's initially, because I you know, my official title when I was in the Navy was cryptologic technician. Right? Like, that was, like, my job category. And so the importance of cryptography for me has, like, it's been, like, directly in my face. But to your point, the the sort of, like, the way like, I never considered it a good use of my time to do it or to pursue it or to learn it even though I had plentiful and very, very robust access to resources
[00:32:45] Unknown:
that could have leveled me up, like, insanely. Yeah. And here's an yeah. And it's like, here's another way to know. Like, you could you could hit hard, like, Bitcoin's cryptography. Right? Yeah. And you can say, I'm gonna master that. Right? Mhmm. But then there's another level that says, well, if I'm really sovereign, then I'm actually I need to understand all of the I need to understand the kind of the limits of how how humans think of cryptography because Yeah. We are going to need to do a change. We are gonna have we're gonna there's going to be a change. There we are. Like, what we talked about last week, just moving to Schnorr signatures is one of those things where it's like if all you did was study what was in enforce ECDSA, you would be nowhere.
I mean, the future isn't sure. Right? So, like, how are you going to be able to discern, how are you gonna be able to discern things that are going into the protocol if you don't, you know, if you're not Yeah. If you know, if you're waiting for it to be in the protocol to learn it.
[00:33:53] Unknown:
Well yes. And and I think this was your your your point here, I agree with, and it was highlighted for me recently. I was there was, like, a discussion on Nasrin. I can't remember the the impetus of the discussion, but it made me, recall, there's this guy who goes by waxwing online, Adam Gibson, that does a lot of this, like, cryptography stuff. And and the recollection was for this, basically, a way of using something called a curve tree or curve trees to prove, a set membership with, like, zero knowledge. So, like, within a given, list of pub keys, prove that you I I have ownership of a pub key within a given list. Right? So this could prove ownership of Bitcoin, right, ostensibly.
[00:34:43] Unknown:
Okay. It feels like this is this this feels like I'm not an expert on what River did with their proof of,
[00:34:52] Unknown:
quote quote proof reserves. This is a little different. This is something first of all, this is like a the caveat on here is, like, this is like a very, very, experimental, has not been audited. You know, there's there's caveat on it. But the the reason why it came to mind, what we were just talking about, how, like, you you have to go beyond just what Bitcoin uses, in in order to have, like, I I don't wanna say, mastery maybe or understanding or even a an inkling of of, like, sniffing out bullshit. And and the highlight in here was, it it it says here in the document, it says, it can be made to work for Bitcoin public keys because of the existence of the two cycle of curves, sec p two fifty six k one and sec q two fifty six k one.
And then when I got in my mind, I was like, oh, shit. There's this other curve. There's this other elliptic curve thing, and there's some relationship between sec p and sec q
[00:35:48] Unknown:
that enables this thing by curve trees. You just ruined the rest of my life.
[00:35:53] Unknown:
Dude, I'm you're welcome.
[00:35:56] Unknown:
You're welcome for the suffering. But it's a generalist who think it's like a generalist perspective is I need to understand this generally. A specialist perspective is I only need to know what I need to know and I'll, you know, you know, and it's not I feel like I've heard this, like, inch wide versus a mile deep, but it's not the case. It's a mile it's a mild it's always a mile deep. And then it's question is how wide Can you make it? Can you make that Yeah. Can you make that rabbit hole? Right? Yeah. Isn't that I I was having a thought about rabbit holes that, when you talk about escape velocity, right? You jump into a rabbit hole. You this like, you have to go in with escape velocity.
So that because you might be wrong. And you have to know that if you're wrong, that's fine. You'll pop out the other side of this thing in a short amount of time. And Yeah. As long as you hit it, like, as hard as long as you hit it super hard. You know? And then so then the other thing is a generalist but, you know, a generalist coming into Bitcoin is gonna have a a large capacity for all of the fire hoses that it's sucking at. Yes. Yeah. That that's very true. And maybe that so in some ways, I might have found my thing because In Bitcoin, you mean? Bitcoin may have been what I've been training for. Maybe maybe not. Right? But maybe it is. Maybe it's the thing I've actually been training for so that if you throw a fire hose around physics or math or economics or Yeah. Or, you know, game theory or any of these other aspects.
[00:37:31] Unknown:
This yes. Yes. Yes. And I care there's somebody who's made this out for reservation before that, like, the people that have more broader, generalist views get Bitcoin a lot faster because they can draw these, like, conclusions together. But, like, my my trip down the Bitcoin rabbit hole was hard and fast, like, a matter of, like, like, a a month or two because I, like, touched the stove briefly with, like, shit coins and, like, lost, like, $30. And I was like, man, I can't afford that because I got a wife and kids. But then more specifically, it was, like, tying together all these different pieces that I'd already touched on in the past. Right? So I'd already done a brief stint down the economics rabbit hole. I was in the middle of a stint down the engineering rabbit hole. Right? I have these I I like to believe that I have these, like, moral convictions of of, ethical behavior. That was another rabbit hole that, like, was very fundamental in my youth. But then I got this coaster from, Satstock Coffee. By the way, shout out Satstock Coffee if you like your coffee.
It might be as good as Otis Bittmeyer's. I don't know. Bold claim. But, it's what I it's my preferred drink, of of caffeination. But I got this coaster. I'll try. Around and to to highlight this, in the center, there's the the orange Bitcoin bee. Right? And then around the perimeter are all these different terminologies. So finance, distributed systems, game theory, economic theory, cryptography, computer science Yeah. You know, network design, protocol design, history, political science, right, finance,
[00:38:58] Unknown:
distributed systems. It's a syllabus for the rest of your life.
[00:39:02] Unknown:
You there's nonstop learning to be had on all these different topic. And and maybe it's just by like and this is one of the things that convinced me that sort of like Bitcoin is money is because there are all these connections to it. And money once you understand the concept of money and what that means for the underpinning of society, it's like, wow. Okay. Like, this is why it touches on everything, and this is why there's such a rabbit hole to everything. This is why it matters to to learn math.
[00:39:31] Unknown:
Or money is one of the many things that's downstream from what Bitcoin is doing, which is, in my not my unique opinion and not my original opinion, but, I share this opinion that it's basically shoring up the knowledge system that's been destroyed. This is we have no knowledge system. It's totally co co opted, corrupted. Yeah. And it's creating a knowledge system that is that you can count on. And then money is downstream from from that.
[00:40:02] Unknown:
Knowledge and resources too. Right? And it and it's not and I always say I I and I might have heard this elsewhere. I don't know remember, but, like, layer zero Bitcoin is like you and I. Like, the people doing the thing in Bitcoin makes it what it is. It's the people running the nodes. And Yes. I mean, I don't know. Five years ago, thinking in my mind that I'd be talking to some random dude on the Internet that's, you know, twenty years my elder almost about mathematics. So that would have sounded crazy, but it makes perfect sense now. It still sounds
[00:40:35] Unknown:
crazy. I mean, it is kinda crazy. And it is crazy, and that's what's beautiful about it. And it's true. And and, you know, it's funny. We talk about, this is actually more of a Bitcoin episode, I guess, than a math episode. But you talk about Sorry for the tangent y'all. Totally fine. I was in a I was having I was getting taken to task by, the people who have agreed to do the work to publish my book, which is now which is now called institutional Bitcoin.
[00:41:01] Unknown:
Okay.
[00:41:02] Unknown:
No more fundamentals of institutional Bitcoin. No more handbook. I think it's now and they were basically saying, I don't think they it's kinda cool that they push back on me because they could just take my money, do the typesetting, and Yeah. Ship it off. But they're like, I don't really know if I think that Bitcoin changes its properties or anything like that based on whether it's institutional or individual. And it made me think about it, and I ended up writing a whole preface to the book to explain that I think it does, actually. I think that the properties do change based on who owns it. And I think that an individual like, almost like states of matter. An individual can own it, and it maybe take on a solid state where it's it's hard. Or or an individual can is capable of doing more with it than an institution. An individual's capable of using it
[00:41:55] Unknown:
for more things, clearly. Right? Is it is it capable is it capability
[00:41:59] Unknown:
or is it the desire to do more things? Right? Well, it's well, the desire comes from knowing they're capable. Right? So, like, an in institution doesn't care about privacy. In fact, they're they're incentivized to do otherwise. A lot of people are gonna say Bitcoin doesn't get privacy. Let's I'm not I'm saying an institution doesn't care about a lot of the things an individual who uses Bitcoin cares about. That's fair. Yes. And, so they don't an an institution doesn't care about, their Bitcoin being seized. Well, a a a law abiding, quote, unquote.
You know? Let's, I'm get I Yeah. I'm getting into another I'm getting I'm I'm I'm getting into another shill. But, like You're good. Because samurai was law abiding. But institutions that are, not, let's just say no corner institutions of today don't care about that. Right. They don't care about that until they until they do. Right. And so a company like Microsoft may never ever well, it's likely that they'll never care about their Bitcoin being seized. That fair to
[00:42:58] Unknown:
say? Pretty fair. Yeah.
[00:43:02] Unknown:
So an individual who cares about the same things that Microsoft cares about, but also cares about his Bitcoin being seized is gonna use It's gonna make sure that his Bitcoin is protected from seizure. Microsoft will not do that. Microsoft will probably custody their Bitcoin with whoever the hell gives them the nicest looking deck. Yeah. Right? And then so that's my point is it's more powerful. It holds more weight and it hold it maybe, like, has more mass, has more and this is I'm not trying to turn this into a big think boy nonsense, thing here. I just think that the the person who owns it determines how powerful that Bitcoin is.
Right. Like, so, I mean, Michael Saylor acquires Bitcoin and does nothing when does nothing with it. He probably loses it on purpose, and so that it does nothing. Literally, it's inert. Right? Yeah. And you want that's it's his choice. Right? So, like, everyone has their ability to to exercise their own free will on what they're being capable
[00:44:05] Unknown:
of. I I would push back, though. I don't know if, like, in inert is the right word to it because it gives it like, the the energy is is given to the rest of the network that is still It's yeah. It's a again, it's it's a it's more of a baseball card at that point. It's not Yeah. For example,
[00:44:22] Unknown:
personally, I am building, circular economies. Right? I'm finding people to trade with so that Yep. You know, even if I don't buy like, I pay for my kids' tuition in Bitcoin. And there's people who don't spend any time billing that, and they have the ability to do that because of the work I did. Right. So their Bitcoin is actually more powerful than Microsoft because Microsoft isn't trying to pay for anything in Bitcoin.
[00:44:48] Unknown:
Not yet.
[00:44:50] Unknown:
Not yet. Right. But even, like, they they don't care. They they don't care. They they see it. So when you see it as indistinguishable from the shit, it's just another thing that may be a little bit better as opposed to an individual who sees it as, you know, chimerically better, like as a like, just not, you know, transcendentally
[00:45:10] Unknown:
better. Well, I think that's, like, a perspective basis of, like, the tool itself. You know what I mean? Like Yeah.
[00:45:16] Unknown:
So, like, yeah, maybe there's this analogy to math too. Like, it's just it is in the, like, its power is in the eye of who's using it, wielding it, learning it. And, it's like the thing that sticks with me from the mathematician's lament is that you don't have to make math interesting. It already is. You don't have to make it useful. It already is. You just need to let people figure their figure themselves out.
[00:45:45] Unknown:
And the best way to get the time to figure that out is through Bitcoin.
[00:45:49] Unknown:
Definitely. Like, yeah. I mean, I think that you have to a lot of Bitcoiners don't think they have the time for math. Let's just face that. Right? However Yeah. Yeah. The more it's it's like it's Bitcoin itself doesn't do that. It's the long process of struggling through what you're do you know, through what your life is about. Well, that's something makes it makes sense.
[00:46:15] Unknown:
There's also a factor of the friction. Right? We talked about the friction earlier. It's like so, like, what you know, without without having ever listened to this podcast, how would you know to go read understanding cryptography? Right? How would you know to go check out these different resources? I don't know. I'm actually I did. Getting to that point is, like, I I think that's one of the maybe one of the things that we can blend to the broader community is, like, here's an entry point to topic x, y, or zed as it applies to mathematics and specific more specifically to cryptography that you need to understand this Bitcoin thing. Because otherwise, how do you how do you get exposure to that? Right? Do you stumble upon it on the Internet? Do you stumble upon it because you go to university because you're, you know, doing what you're told to do?
Like the Right. Removing the friction of it.
[00:47:02] Unknown:
Yeah. And I see that. And I don't wanna fall into a trap of having to make it relevant for people, but maybe this is sort of like the same trap that people who wanna expand Bitcoin's adoption fall into too. It's like, well, we have you know, we can't, you know, the first wave maybe are the people who saw it for you know, saw it themselves, but now maybe it you know, it's like you don't have to convince somebody why Bitcoin is useful. It already it already is. But I guess you do have to get their attention. So this podcast is meant to get people's attention.
Right? And then present, like, a reason why, you know, a reason why it's important. And then hopefully people can, you know, they just see something in themselves. Did you wanna talk about any real math today?
[00:47:48] Unknown:
I think we just call this a Bitcoin episode. It's it's an inevitable thing. And and I apologize, dear listener, if you were, still suffering from insomnia because we did not talk about math equations.
[00:48:03] Unknown:
I hope this is the episode that, Richard Grieser comes back to, by the way. I was very bummed out to hear that he had started the podcast and tapped out. So I'm gonna speak that into existence. Some people are not cut out for it. I will well, I that's probably true. I do not think that applies to him, but I wanted to say one thing before we close out. I am after hearing him talk about tapping out, and, I'm considering doing an office hours where, like, for an hour a week, any any listener can come on and ask open questions, something like that. And I'm thinking of doing that, especially for people who are sort of on the edge of quiz. Let's not think about it. When's the when's the date? So next week, which day is I need to I need to I need to work that out. My my thought about it was, like, maybe Tuesday nights.
[00:48:48] Unknown:
Okay.
[00:48:50] Unknown:
There I'll look at the Gnoster account for motivating the math and I will up I will update I will post the updates there. And we're prop like I have to figure out the platform. It can't be corny chat because I feel like I need to be able to visually Yeah. Do do stuff. HiveTalk. So I'm gonna have to check play with Hive Talk. But just so that's coming, if you got to this if you're 12 episodes in and got to this point, you guys are are the fucking best. And I'm gonna continue to sup to, you know, put my time in to support you guys and keep you guys here.
[00:49:21] Unknown:
Thank you again, dear listener, for joining Average Gary and Fundamentals as they explore the friction and motivation for math.
[00:49:47] Unknown:
Because everyone comes to look. Don't wanna be anything where my life's in a good book. A dream that's true. Thanks, everybody.
[00:54:13] Unknown:
Couple of do songs.
I'm joined today by fundamentals. I'm Average Gary. And Are you ready to bore
[00:00:36] Unknown:
you and lull you to sleep with what he talks about I'm here to bore you. Distractions and I'm here to bore you. If anyone's gonna bore anyone, it's me. Alright? What's up, Gary? It's good to good to see you. Yeah. Likewise. Yeah. It's good to it's shared this time. So I, you know, I'd say there was a mixed reaction to the music I attempted in the last episode, but let me at least explain why I, chose that song and that well, one, I like it. But, No other explanation needed at that point. The song is called waste, and it's, like, about like, it's like the chorus says, come waste your time with me. And that's sort of how I feel about the audience here. It's like, come waste you know, because everybody thinks math is a waste of time. We just talked about the mathematicians' lament.
[00:01:26] Unknown:
Yeah. And We're gonna talk more about that, I hope. I I think we will.
[00:01:30] Unknown:
Okay. I have a there's part of me that wants to read from it, but there's another part of me that says kinda fuck that. I have some thoughts I wanna just get across about it. But I, you know, I I think when I think about the music, I want I just wanted to have some music. You know? I like I like when the podcast ends. It's one of my favorite things that BusinessGad does. Like, when the podcast ends, there's, like, some nice music to take you out.
[00:01:57] Unknown:
Well and there's something like, there's a mathematical thing to the music as well. Right? Like, there there is there's math to music. Well, there certainly is.
[00:02:07] Unknown:
The the you know, you could cons I think, something I got into a little bit was even, like, you know, the property, the axioms of the group. Like, are there, like you know, when you have, like, octaves and scales and modes and Those are groups in a sense? If you do an like, you can do an operation called, say maybe there's certain modes where you do a full step or a half step, and no matter what, you may you know, it's closed under that mode or something like that. Right? There's there may say there isn't there exists an operation, right, that's maybe a certain amount of steps or a certain amount of rests or beats or something that that that, you know, where you can establish something that's a group. This is like this is what math, like, what math nerds do to force the concept. Right? And so, you know, it's funny because the mathematicians lament, he talks about how stupid it is for teachers to try to relate it some like, the, you know, the teachers are so fucking just just so dumb trying to they they trying to relate it so much to kids. You know?
[00:03:20] Unknown:
In my mind, I know nothing about music. Right? So, like, I played the flute in sixth grade for Yeah. Probably half a year. And I played it because I thought it was gonna be a quiet instrument, and nobody would hear me practicing. Oh my god. And that was just completely wrong. But, anyway, that sorry for that tangent. But in my mind, I just went to, like there's, like, this, like, like, four eights or something. Like, there's a way of describing, like There's time signatures. Yeah. There's time signatures. Yeah. There's all there's numbers to math. There there's Absolutely. Numbers to math. There's numbers to music. One of the big numerical representation of music that can be used.
[00:03:59] Unknown:
Absolutely. There's a guy who does re there's a big thing in in music and in, social media space called, like, reaction videos. I'm sure I'm not I'm I'm like a boomer telling you Yeah. These things exist. I think I know that. But but, I happen to love reaction videos for Phish because it basically takes me back to the discovery of, it's kinda you know, it's like when I was, going back and forth with eight myth Randir when he was starting to listen to all the episodes and it was activating a bunch. It was like he was doing his own reaction to the podcast, and Yeah. It gave me a new appreciation for what we were doing. And when I see these reaction videos, it gives me a new just takes me back to, like, beginning to appreciate something that I hadn't thought about in thirty years.
And, there's a guy who does them for fish really well. His name is Walter Ruski. I've talked about him on my fish podcast a lot, but he does he'll, like, stop the video and say He specifically does Phish reaction videos? He does all of them. He does a lot. Okay. But he'll he'll stop the video and he'll say, I'm hearing, like, I'm hearing the guitar player playing, you know, seven four, and I'm hearing the band playing four four. And he starts doing the math, and he's like, by the time he's like, it's gonna take, you know, something like 28 verses for them to come back together, to come back and connect again on the same, like, on the same beat signature. And he'll sit there and do the math about it. I think that's fun and interesting. And he can hear that? Like, he can hear He can hear because he's a musician, and he's I don't know what he plays, but I think percussionists are very good at, you know, detecting time signatures very easily. Well, I mean, is that be that's because percussion, like, sort of sets the timing for for a lot of the other things. They have a gift for knowing what you know, just kinda being dropped in a jam somewhere knowing the time signature. They usually set it. So maybe they're not that good at listening for it. But, like, I'm a guitar player. I'm I'm okay. I'm pretty good at listening for the time signature.
Right?
[00:05:59] Unknown:
Anyhow
[00:06:00] Unknown:
You you have to jump in at the right time. Well, and also if you're learning a song, like, you may learn a song, like, especially if you're learning progressive rock songs like Phish songs, like you will hear one instrument playing one time signature and another instrument playing it down in another one. And I think that's the thing that, yeah, he would notice and start doing the math and try to figure out how many measures are they putting you through this, tension, right, before it resolves. Right? And is that tension because to the ear or something sort of, like, wonky to it Yeah. That that To the ear, it doesn't off between two two six right, but as long as the your main rhythm section is in four four, your brain is like, this is music. Okay? It's just very weird music for a little bit, but I it's like you can kinda feel that it's gonna resolve, And it's incredibly satisfying when it does.
But there's a basic math though, like, okay. How many measures are you gonna put the listener through of the pain? Right? The Yeah. Pain and discomfort before you pay it off.
[00:07:06] Unknown:
I'm trying to think of parallel parallels to actual math of like
[00:07:11] Unknown:
It's I mean, I don't know if I'd consider any of this math in any way, but, like, it's definitely arithmetic and
[00:07:17] Unknown:
it's so this is like back to, you know. Well well, more of, like, the fundamental, like, the things in our brain that is wired for math and, like, what is it? Music is one of those things for sure. Explanation of patterns. Right? Like, that's maybe maybe that's what it is. It's like explanations of pattern. Like, math math is a way of explaining patterns
[00:07:39] Unknown:
and and reasoning about the world. It can be. That's one of its one of its users, we'll say.
[00:07:45] Unknown:
Right. Well, it it just again, drawing from the whole, like, music thing. Like, there's something in your brain you said that, like, four four is like, oh, that's music. Like, there's some recognition there. There's, like, a pattern recognition. And I think this is pretty well documented. Like, pattern recognition is, like, what humans excel at. It's like we just we recognize patterns. Like, oh, everybody that eats these red berries dies. So, like, let's not eat these red berries. Right? Like, there's a pattern.
[00:08:08] Unknown:
Yeah. Pattern recognition is a big part of how, you know, how our brains are wired. A lot of people confuse that for, like, mathematical talent.
[00:08:19] Unknown:
Right? Well, why well, and that's where I was I was gonna kinda take it though is, like, do you not think that some of these, like, great mathematicians, like, recognize these patterns to do some of these, like Well, yeah. It's it's a it's a component.
[00:08:32] Unknown:
It's a you know what I mean? It's a component, but, like, I would say somebody like Gauss, you know, the big talent is the ability to put a billion hours in so that the pattern emerges to recognize. Right? So that's what that's the talent is in, like, not knowing what what what or why he's doing it, and therefore doing it forever and putting, you know, putting more time in it than any other human being will ever ever think about doing so in order and then and then finding and then seeing the pattern. And everyone's like, oh, he recognized that pattern. He must be really good at recognizing patterns. It's like, no. He's good at generating a data set in a finite lifetime such that there is a pattern.
[00:09:16] Unknown:
And What I mean and and does that speak to, like, the the general thesis of, like, mastery of, like, you know, ten thousand hours doing something before you can truly master it. Right? And is that Yeah. But I mean just concreting
[00:09:27] Unknown:
patterns in your brain. That is a form of mastery. I mean, look at chess master. Right? Right. Like, that's what the you know, you can, like, wake them up out of a deep sleep and show them a board, and they'll know They'll be like, oh, yeah. That's mate in seven. You just see it. It's just, you know, that that's just because it's programmed. It's not like it doesn't take away from, like, it does take it does require an intelligence to do that. I think that's probably my greatest skills, pattern recognition too. It was one of my great one of my big skills, but I also there's a probably a greater intelligence in being able to connect dots. And this is what I was gonna actually, talk about. Just a pattern. Right? Like, you connect that you can just connect the dots that don't seem like they should be connected.
Nobody in the world, like, you're everybody thinks you're crazy. Right? Like, I do this fish podcast, the connecting fish and Bitcoin. Everyone thinks I'm out of my mind. Right? And I'm not claiming to be some sort of genius. I'm just saying that I see the pattern and I I I live on this earth and insist I have the sort of god given will to insist that this is an interesting story to tell and that this is there is pattern and even though no one else sees it. Right? Yeah. So it's like, it's a balance it's a balance of both of those things. I would I maybe the kind of end the kind of intelligence I covet is the one where people is the creative kind. Right?
Like, I think that, pattern recognition is more past based. Right? It's like you're building a neural maybe neural network in your of data you're building a data set in your mind and you're indexing it and you're keeping it you're making you're make you're I think you're making yourself as a human being into a, very effective kind of computer Yeah. Which certainly converts a certain kind of intelligence, but it may not be the kind of intelligence people think. Right? Right. Just the same way mathematics is not reduced to con to compute. It's also not reduced to recall. Yeah. Although it's a a big part of it. You know, if you if you study math like, let's just say you study number theory. Right? And you go through the division algorithm.
Mhmm. And then you forget everything about it a week later when you're trying to do the Euclidean algorithm, it's not gonna be very useful. So if you're not retaining if you don't have the ability to retain, like, a lot of specific concepts and that's where you know, okay. Well, what does it take to do that is you have to do problems, you have to do exercises, you have to practice it, and you have to master it. And that's the real talent is finding the will to do that when, you know, your brain is mostly telling you I should be doing something else.
[00:12:18] Unknown:
Well and I think you're right to the extent of wanting to take a specific subject to a higher level or to a next level. However, though and and maybe this is just like the difference in the way that my brain works. It it to me, a lot of times it's sufficient enough for me to go That's what mastery is, by the way. Mastery is Yeah. Yeah. Well, I'm I'm I average Gary is a handle not just like, you know, flipping handle. It's because, I I'm very much a generalist in a lot of things. And I will I will sort of, like, deep dive on these, like, one or two things to learn it. And then, like, once I learn it, I I almost, like, create, like, an index in my brain of, like, hey. I know this is how this thing works, and maybe I forget how to explain the deep technical nuances of such a thing. But I know, like, general like, for example, like, a discrete log contract on on on Bitcoin. Right? It's like a way of doing sort of like an escrow esque thing where you're trusting, like, a signer. Sure. A third party signer in Oracle to to sign something that, like, unlocks a certain contract.
I can't explain to you right now, like, in detail, like, how that thing works, but the general premise and the general, like, way that DLCs work is, like, registered in my brain as, like, an idea Mhmm. To be to be connected to other ideas. Right? Yes.
[00:13:41] Unknown:
Yes. So okay. You have really done something interesting. Nobody is nobody listening is gonna know what I'm talking about, but I came today ready to talk about something called the generalist's limit. Are
[00:13:55] Unknown:
you serious?
[00:13:56] Unknown:
Dead serious. And, like, basically knows. Okay. It's just something I thought of while I was reading the mathematicians lament.
[00:14:04] Unknown:
Okay. Alright.
[00:14:05] Unknown:
Okay. Maybe this is what I need in my my my heart. I'm reading the mathematicians lament, and I'm like, oh, I gotta read this. I gotta read this. This is too good. I have to read it. I gotta read this. And I really felt this way and we may have an episode where we do read pieces of it. Mhmm. However, I hit I something just completely shifted for me in the middle of reading that when I started thinking about my own lament, which is I am a generalist. I've always referred to myself as a consummate generalist. Mhmm. And I have always struggled with, like, I am 50 years old and it really I'd say, it still hasn't happened yet. What the it is, like, when the, you know, whatever needs whatever the planets need to align for every kinda all the the general information and general things and general knowledge and concepts and things you've been exposed to and Mhmm. For it to all come together and lead to something, you know, significant.
Right? Yeah. Whereas I have specialized in things and I've already mastered them and I've already they're already way in the rear view mirror. Whereas the the, like, you know, the the big the big payoff of being a generalist has not happened. And if you go through your lot you can go through your entire life feeling this way and feeling like a failure. Right? Because you just know, you know, you know, you're in this game and you know you have certain ability and that you feel like you should have discovered something. This all should amount to something and it hasn't. And so I read a book. The thing that really I read a book that I think a lot of people consider shallow, but I thought it was, very meaningful to me. It was a book called Range. It's one of those business books you'd find in the airport. It's why, like, you know, people kind of shit on it. Mhmm. Have you ever heard of this book? You should definitely read. Okay. It's it's a bunch of stories about generalists versus specialists. It's like a Malcolm Gladwell type book that you like I said, you'd find in the airport, you know.
Yeah. Probably a best seller. However, it was really meaningful to me. It spoke very much to me because it told stories of generalists. And some of them, like, didn't discover what they were meant to discover until they were in their nineties. And it like, I hadn't, discovered Bitcoin yet. I didn't have exactly I I wasn't really looking to wait till I was 90. Yeah. Right? But this is one of the things maybe I think that Bitcoin really did for me, which is allow me to have a longer horizon of my life and say, it's okay if whatever it is. Absolutely. And then and so the stories of these generalists, for example, so I think the first chapter, as cheesy as it gets, it's like Roger Federer versus Tiger Woods, something like that where like Roger Federer's parents didn't allow him to specialize in sport. And you really grew up in an age where that was starting to become very, very, very important.
Mhmm. You weren't gonna make it if you didn't specialize. Right? And I think that's true about a lot of a lot of things and a lot of pursuits. Right? You're probably not going to ever get recognized, but that really is more of a statement of the fiat system than it is of you. Right? And that ultimately at the end of the day. Yeah. There's one chapter I really wanna talk about because it's about math. Okay? Okay. Keep going. It's about math. And this is what it got triggered reading the Mathematician's Lemait. Okay. So there was a, a big a big long study, years, maybe five, six years long.
Mhmm. On calculus programs in college. Okay. And so what they what they did was they they gave pretty broad latitude on what the curriculum you know, the curriculum had to be within a certain confined limit, but they gave broad latitude on how to teach it. Right? How rigorous, how, you know, how rigorous, how deep, how shallow. K? And, what happened was they look so then they looked at the grades the kids got, and then they looked they had the kids rate their teachers. Right? And then they followed up with these kids five years later to see what they were doing with their life. Were they doing anything in math or or or not? Right? Yeah. Okay. So here is essentially the, the bottom line, and then I'll get into a little bit of the what what it all means. Bottom line was that the kids that got the best grades rated their teachers the highest, and five years later, we're not doing anything in math.
The kids that got the worst grades rated their teachers the worst, but for some some way somehow were way more involved, way more prevalently involved in mathematical perfect professions and pursuits.
[00:19:14] Unknown:
There's a lot to there's a lot to, like, unpack from that. Yeah. Let's say so, like, what's the what do you glean from that? Or, like, what's the conclusion the book came to at least? First one was that, obviously, professors are incentivized
[00:19:26] Unknown:
to make the class very easy to give their kids good grades because then they get good ratings and everybody's happy and no one gives a shit who's doing math in five years. Yeah. Okay. So that's, like, the first kinda obvious conclusion. Right? Now if you've never taken calculus before, I don't know that you can appreciate the variety of how it can be taught. Now I, I was in so a lot of people know I didn't like, I stopped going to high school for two years basically. I just couldn't fucking be there. I hated it. Sure. And I was able to cut and not get caught for two years.
And despite that, I I still test like I still did my work and I still studied and I because I liked it. And I test when I got to college, magic the college, I got to went to Temple University and I tested into the honors program and I took honors calculus and I got a D in it and I had to retake it. And then when I retook it I was like fucked up and I was like still fucked up from the night before and I got an A minus I think in the class. It was so easy. It was incredibly easy. So I have a very vivid idea of how calculus can be very hard because I was actually still I was pretty good at it. I was good enough to test in the honors program. Right? So I was like, I was pretty or at least I thought I was good at it. I would have rated my my teachers highly, which is myself.
But I was pretty good at it, but I got rocked in this honors class. Right? I got fucking rocked. And I had a so I have a very clear sense of how something with a very limited, like, the the limited, curriculum can be made very, very hard if they if the professor wants it to be. Right? Yeah. And just like a quick example is, like, if anyone here who's taking calculus will know this, like
[00:21:23] Unknown:
I have not for the record. Yeah. But have you heard of derivatives?
[00:21:27] Unknown:
Derivative is a rate of change. So, like, in physics, the you have Sure. The velocity is how is how fast. Velocity is a measure of speed. Right? So, like, relative to a position. So it's like how much does that position change when you change time. Yep. And you can then go one derivative more and say call it acceleration, which is how much the velocity is changing due to time. Right? Okay. Okay. Okay. Now there's a very shallow, I well, the word is technique oriented. You can learn the technique of calculating a derivative. The majority of derivatives, like, in a of, like, a polynomial x to the n Mhmm.
The derivative is simply n times x to the n minus one. Meaning, like, x to the fifth, the derivative is five x to the fourth. X to the tenth Say that again. Let me let me put that in. So x to the fifth, the derivative is five x to the fourth.
[00:22:21] Unknown:
Five x to the fourth.
[00:22:23] Unknown:
Okay. And then there because x to the the exponent of x was five. And so the Right. I'm teaching you the technique, and everyone here is gonna know the technique for calculating the derivative. And you're gonna think you don't understand calculus. Okay. Right? So, like and then the derivative of five x to the fourth is 20 x to the third. Because Four times five is 20 Yep. Four times that yep. Times the thing. Right? And then 20 x to the third, that derivative is gonna be 60 x squared. And the derivative of that will be a 20 x.
And then the derivative of that will be a 20, and then the derivative of that will be zero. You go, I'll go, oh, no. What happened? We stopped the pattern. But, actually, the exponent is zero, so you multiply it. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Zero zero. So this is the technique. Okay? And there's a lot of calculus classes where that's all they teach you. You know, there's a fun one called the the function e to the x, the where the derivative is e to the x. That's what you you're gonna see on the test. It's just like if you were training if you just wanted to get people to move through an engineering program and not feel like a retard and stay in school, right, and keep paying, you would just basically teach them the technique. You wouldn't teach them you wouldn't go any deeper and and say, well, how do you know a derivative even exists?
And this seems applicable to just more broadly, like, the education today. It does. But this so this is a but but it's particularly, like you know, the mathematicians lament put a particular color on this, but I really like, it really well, for what it did for me when I read this book, I wanna say it was 2017 when I read this book. Okay. And what it did for me was, you know, I so my, you know, my daughter at the time would have been 12 or 13 years old. I I already it it reinforced something that I knew already knew very well, which was the importance of struggling. Like Right. The importance of really kicking someone's ass. Yep.
Especially if somebody who's engaged and wants to learn. And, you know, making them fucking suffer and bleed is important. And so that is one of the reasons. If you guys feel like I'm some kind of sociopath doing this podcast, knowing because I know full well how difficult it is to be listening to this
[00:24:53] Unknown:
a lot of the time. I mean, it's difficult. Like, I was sharing this before we started. Like, it's difficult keeping up with this on a on a weekly basis. But the the driving motivation is the the showing up is the hardest part in most things. Yes. And if you can do that at a minimum consistently, whether that's fitness, whether that's doing math, whether that's learning a new skill, whatever it is, like, the the building of the repetitions is is the is the fitness. Right? There's a guy, as doing a strong man course once. His name was Rob Orlando.
And he said fitness is just a lifetime accumulation of reps. And I think you can take fitness and replace it with x, whatever it is. And it's just a lifetime accumulation of doing the thing and forcing yourself to doing and and not stopping and not giving up. It's a big part of it. The thing is shitty. That is a first derivative
[00:25:52] Unknown:
view. Meaning, you know, it's just like one movement over time, and it's true. You accumulate reps over time. And it's like the ten thousand hour thing. You accumulate reps over time. I will add a second derivative, I e, an acceleration. I think it's also important to rev the engine and push yourself to the edge of your ability at times. Not just like sprinting. Right? It's like, yes. You can run. You can train for a marathon, but you may be very bad at certain sports if that's all you do. Yeah. Absolutely. But you have to be able to in a very short amount of time like, you may not be able to out like, escape a tiger if all you did was train for marathons. Right. And I think so I think also this is I'm really using this as an excuse to bring derivatives into this conversation. But, like, second derivative approach, and I think about this a lot because I think about escape velocity.
Escape velocity in physics is how do you you know, when you shoot a rocket out, it must be going fast enough to overcome the gravitational force of the earth. Right. Otherwise and there is a point there is a point where it leaves that force. Right? Right. And it or not that it leaves that force, but it leaves that you end up in orbit instead of forming the ground. Escape velocity comes to mind. That's right. That's exactly what that's that's what I was saying. Right? So, like, you want there's an escape velocity that allows you to end up in orbit instead of falling to the ground.
Right? There's a there's exact there's an exact moment where that happens. Right? And we know what that is. I couldn't tell you what it is, but obviously, physicists know how fast a projectile has to go to end up in orbit instead of Yeah. Falling. Okay. But how do you measure how do you know what that escape escape velocity is for whatever you're pursuing? You well, I mean, I think in fit well, so in physics, you know, because you know the grav it's it's, the gravitational what there's a formula for the gravitational force of of, that a body is under between two masses. Quantity of mass that Earth is. Right? How's it gravitational force? Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Now how do you know what it is if you're in an abstract doing something abstract, like trying to master something? Right? Like math?
You don't know. So you that's why I said you have to, like, sprint as fast as you can every once in a while. You have to rev your engine. The word friction comes to mind. Like Yeah.
[00:28:23] Unknown:
Around knowing. Right? Because at a certain point, what I guess the
[00:28:30] Unknown:
well, no. The the friction just impacts the speed you're able to accomplish. Right? Yeah. Friction is just a barrier to reaching that velocity. Yeah. So you wanna design yourself to be unencumbered as unencumbered as possible from those frictions. Like, so if you're a drug addict, right, and you're very preoccupied with things just things in your life that are not, you know, that are gonna that's a big that would be a big friction to, you know, you would think for most people that would be a big friction for, mastering a skill other than doing drugs.
Right?
[00:29:11] Unknown:
Yeah. I guess I was trying to frame it in a way where, like, gravity is not the friction.
[00:29:16] Unknown:
Gravity is the is the force against That's right. The friction would be the design of the module going up. Right? So, like, the aerodynamic design, that's you want it to be, you know, you want it to,
[00:29:29] Unknown:
But reducing that friction allows you to reach escape velocity faster.
[00:29:34] Unknown:
Yeah. It it makes it it makes it impossible.
[00:29:39] Unknown:
Like, there's frictions that make escape velocity impossible. You're not gonna shoot, like, a big cube into space.
[00:29:44] Unknown:
And that's the thing. So that's why I reacted. I said, so it's sorta like no matter how many if you're just, like, throwing a baseball as hard as you can forever, there are no amount of reps that's gonna put that baseball in orbit. You could live to the age of a billion, and you're never gonna You're never gonna baseball every day, and it's never gonna happen.
[00:30:07] Unknown:
You need you need to,
[00:30:10] Unknown:
adjust. You need to change. That's the so that's just the sober I mean, I'm saying that's the sobering thing that we need to think about as humans. Right? If we wanna learn something, we wanna learn it to a level of mastery. You know, it's not gonna be enough to just do reps, regular reps. And even though, like, most people will never do that. Right? Yeah. Well, I think that's why that's on what your objective is. Right? You gotta pound the shit out of it over also. Not not continuously forever, but you'd have to have your moments where you really pound the shit out of it. And that is where so I think that what I've just started with talking about somebody like Gauss. Right?
Skye, like, the thing that's in the way and again, the mathematicians lament. The thing that gets in the way of doing that work is just this this demoralization or this idea that you do better use there's better ways to spend your time. Right? That's what it's sort of like the big sigh up they got us with here. Right?
[00:31:16] Unknown:
I was, Well, that that coupled with the fact that just time having the time is a luxury already. So it it Absolutely. It's the the grind in the hamster wheel rat race of Fiat that gives this psyop such credibility. And so it's very easy to become psy ops if you're like, oh, man. Well, if I don't insert activity that will accrue me more fiat, then I will be wasting my time.
[00:31:41] Unknown:
That's the friction. That's yes. So that's a so those are frictions. Right?
[00:31:47] Unknown:
Oh. Bit Bitcoin's a lubricant.
[00:31:49] Unknown:
It's I'd say so. I definitely would say so. It's also a motive it's something that motivates like, a lot of us maybe didn't know that it was important to understand cryptography. Ourselves ourselves not trusting other people, but, like, ourselves. And a lot of us still don't understand that.
[00:32:10] Unknown:
What and what's initially, because I you know, my official title when I was in the Navy was cryptologic technician. Right? Like, that was, like, my job category. And so the importance of cryptography for me has, like, it's been, like, directly in my face. But to your point, the the sort of, like, the way like, I never considered it a good use of my time to do it or to pursue it or to learn it even though I had plentiful and very, very robust access to resources
[00:32:45] Unknown:
that could have leveled me up, like, insanely. Yeah. And here's an yeah. And it's like, here's another way to know. Like, you could you could hit hard, like, Bitcoin's cryptography. Right? Yeah. And you can say, I'm gonna master that. Right? Mhmm. But then there's another level that says, well, if I'm really sovereign, then I'm actually I need to understand all of the I need to understand the kind of the limits of how how humans think of cryptography because Yeah. We are going to need to do a change. We are gonna have we're gonna there's going to be a change. There we are. Like, what we talked about last week, just moving to Schnorr signatures is one of those things where it's like if all you did was study what was in enforce ECDSA, you would be nowhere.
I mean, the future isn't sure. Right? So, like, how are you going to be able to discern, how are you gonna be able to discern things that are going into the protocol if you don't, you know, if you're not Yeah. If you know, if you're waiting for it to be in the protocol to learn it.
[00:33:53] Unknown:
Well yes. And and I think this was your your your point here, I agree with, and it was highlighted for me recently. I was there was, like, a discussion on Nasrin. I can't remember the the impetus of the discussion, but it made me, recall, there's this guy who goes by waxwing online, Adam Gibson, that does a lot of this, like, cryptography stuff. And and the recollection was for this, basically, a way of using something called a curve tree or curve trees to prove, a set membership with, like, zero knowledge. So, like, within a given, list of pub keys, prove that you I I have ownership of a pub key within a given list. Right? So this could prove ownership of Bitcoin, right, ostensibly.
[00:34:43] Unknown:
Okay. It feels like this is this this feels like I'm not an expert on what River did with their proof of,
[00:34:52] Unknown:
quote quote proof reserves. This is a little different. This is something first of all, this is like a the caveat on here is, like, this is like a very, very, experimental, has not been audited. You know, there's there's caveat on it. But the the reason why it came to mind, what we were just talking about, how, like, you you have to go beyond just what Bitcoin uses, in in order to have, like, I I don't wanna say, mastery maybe or understanding or even a an inkling of of, like, sniffing out bullshit. And and the highlight in here was, it it it says here in the document, it says, it can be made to work for Bitcoin public keys because of the existence of the two cycle of curves, sec p two fifty six k one and sec q two fifty six k one.
And then when I got in my mind, I was like, oh, shit. There's this other curve. There's this other elliptic curve thing, and there's some relationship between sec p and sec q
[00:35:48] Unknown:
that enables this thing by curve trees. You just ruined the rest of my life.
[00:35:53] Unknown:
Dude, I'm you're welcome.
[00:35:56] Unknown:
You're welcome for the suffering. But it's a generalist who think it's like a generalist perspective is I need to understand this generally. A specialist perspective is I only need to know what I need to know and I'll, you know, you know, and it's not I feel like I've heard this, like, inch wide versus a mile deep, but it's not the case. It's a mile it's a mild it's always a mile deep. And then it's question is how wide Can you make it? Can you make that Yeah. Can you make that rabbit hole? Right? Yeah. Isn't that I I was having a thought about rabbit holes that, when you talk about escape velocity, right? You jump into a rabbit hole. You this like, you have to go in with escape velocity.
So that because you might be wrong. And you have to know that if you're wrong, that's fine. You'll pop out the other side of this thing in a short amount of time. And Yeah. As long as you hit it, like, as hard as long as you hit it super hard. You know? And then so then the other thing is a generalist but, you know, a generalist coming into Bitcoin is gonna have a a large capacity for all of the fire hoses that it's sucking at. Yes. Yeah. That that's very true. And maybe that so in some ways, I might have found my thing because In Bitcoin, you mean? Bitcoin may have been what I've been training for. Maybe maybe not. Right? But maybe it is. Maybe it's the thing I've actually been training for so that if you throw a fire hose around physics or math or economics or Yeah. Or, you know, game theory or any of these other aspects.
[00:37:31] Unknown:
This yes. Yes. Yes. And I care there's somebody who's made this out for reservation before that, like, the people that have more broader, generalist views get Bitcoin a lot faster because they can draw these, like, conclusions together. But, like, my my trip down the Bitcoin rabbit hole was hard and fast, like, a matter of, like, like, a a month or two because I, like, touched the stove briefly with, like, shit coins and, like, lost, like, $30. And I was like, man, I can't afford that because I got a wife and kids. But then more specifically, it was, like, tying together all these different pieces that I'd already touched on in the past. Right? So I'd already done a brief stint down the economics rabbit hole. I was in the middle of a stint down the engineering rabbit hole. Right? I have these I I like to believe that I have these, like, moral convictions of of, ethical behavior. That was another rabbit hole that, like, was very fundamental in my youth. But then I got this coaster from, Satstock Coffee. By the way, shout out Satstock Coffee if you like your coffee.
It might be as good as Otis Bittmeyer's. I don't know. Bold claim. But, it's what I it's my preferred drink, of of caffeination. But I got this coaster. I'll try. Around and to to highlight this, in the center, there's the the orange Bitcoin bee. Right? And then around the perimeter are all these different terminologies. So finance, distributed systems, game theory, economic theory, cryptography, computer science Yeah. You know, network design, protocol design, history, political science, right, finance,
[00:38:58] Unknown:
distributed systems. It's a syllabus for the rest of your life.
[00:39:02] Unknown:
You there's nonstop learning to be had on all these different topic. And and maybe it's just by like and this is one of the things that convinced me that sort of like Bitcoin is money is because there are all these connections to it. And money once you understand the concept of money and what that means for the underpinning of society, it's like, wow. Okay. Like, this is why it touches on everything, and this is why there's such a rabbit hole to everything. This is why it matters to to learn math.
[00:39:31] Unknown:
Or money is one of the many things that's downstream from what Bitcoin is doing, which is, in my not my unique opinion and not my original opinion, but, I share this opinion that it's basically shoring up the knowledge system that's been destroyed. This is we have no knowledge system. It's totally co co opted, corrupted. Yeah. And it's creating a knowledge system that is that you can count on. And then money is downstream from from that.
[00:40:02] Unknown:
Knowledge and resources too. Right? And it and it's not and I always say I I and I might have heard this elsewhere. I don't know remember, but, like, layer zero Bitcoin is like you and I. Like, the people doing the thing in Bitcoin makes it what it is. It's the people running the nodes. And Yes. I mean, I don't know. Five years ago, thinking in my mind that I'd be talking to some random dude on the Internet that's, you know, twenty years my elder almost about mathematics. So that would have sounded crazy, but it makes perfect sense now. It still sounds
[00:40:35] Unknown:
crazy. I mean, it is kinda crazy. And it is crazy, and that's what's beautiful about it. And it's true. And and, you know, it's funny. We talk about, this is actually more of a Bitcoin episode, I guess, than a math episode. But you talk about Sorry for the tangent y'all. Totally fine. I was in a I was having I was getting taken to task by, the people who have agreed to do the work to publish my book, which is now which is now called institutional Bitcoin.
[00:41:01] Unknown:
Okay.
[00:41:02] Unknown:
No more fundamentals of institutional Bitcoin. No more handbook. I think it's now and they were basically saying, I don't think they it's kinda cool that they push back on me because they could just take my money, do the typesetting, and Yeah. Ship it off. But they're like, I don't really know if I think that Bitcoin changes its properties or anything like that based on whether it's institutional or individual. And it made me think about it, and I ended up writing a whole preface to the book to explain that I think it does, actually. I think that the properties do change based on who owns it. And I think that an individual like, almost like states of matter. An individual can own it, and it maybe take on a solid state where it's it's hard. Or or an individual can is capable of doing more with it than an institution. An individual's capable of using it
[00:41:55] Unknown:
for more things, clearly. Right? Is it is it capable is it capability
[00:41:59] Unknown:
or is it the desire to do more things? Right? Well, it's well, the desire comes from knowing they're capable. Right? So, like, an in institution doesn't care about privacy. In fact, they're they're incentivized to do otherwise. A lot of people are gonna say Bitcoin doesn't get privacy. Let's I'm not I'm saying an institution doesn't care about a lot of the things an individual who uses Bitcoin cares about. That's fair. Yes. And, so they don't an an institution doesn't care about, their Bitcoin being seized. Well, a a a law abiding, quote, unquote.
You know? Let's, I'm get I Yeah. I'm getting into another I'm getting I'm I'm I'm getting into another shill. But, like You're good. Because samurai was law abiding. But institutions that are, not, let's just say no corner institutions of today don't care about that. Right. They don't care about that until they until they do. Right. And so a company like Microsoft may never ever well, it's likely that they'll never care about their Bitcoin being seized. That fair to
[00:42:58] Unknown:
say? Pretty fair. Yeah.
[00:43:02] Unknown:
So an individual who cares about the same things that Microsoft cares about, but also cares about his Bitcoin being seized is gonna use It's gonna make sure that his Bitcoin is protected from seizure. Microsoft will not do that. Microsoft will probably custody their Bitcoin with whoever the hell gives them the nicest looking deck. Yeah. Right? And then so that's my point is it's more powerful. It holds more weight and it hold it maybe, like, has more mass, has more and this is I'm not trying to turn this into a big think boy nonsense, thing here. I just think that the the person who owns it determines how powerful that Bitcoin is.
Right. Like, so, I mean, Michael Saylor acquires Bitcoin and does nothing when does nothing with it. He probably loses it on purpose, and so that it does nothing. Literally, it's inert. Right? Yeah. And you want that's it's his choice. Right? So, like, everyone has their ability to to exercise their own free will on what they're being capable
[00:44:05] Unknown:
of. I I would push back, though. I don't know if, like, in inert is the right word to it because it gives it like, the the energy is is given to the rest of the network that is still It's yeah. It's a again, it's it's a it's more of a baseball card at that point. It's not Yeah. For example,
[00:44:22] Unknown:
personally, I am building, circular economies. Right? I'm finding people to trade with so that Yep. You know, even if I don't buy like, I pay for my kids' tuition in Bitcoin. And there's people who don't spend any time billing that, and they have the ability to do that because of the work I did. Right. So their Bitcoin is actually more powerful than Microsoft because Microsoft isn't trying to pay for anything in Bitcoin.
[00:44:48] Unknown:
Not yet.
[00:44:50] Unknown:
Not yet. Right. But even, like, they they don't care. They they don't care. They they see it. So when you see it as indistinguishable from the shit, it's just another thing that may be a little bit better as opposed to an individual who sees it as, you know, chimerically better, like as a like, just not, you know, transcendentally
[00:45:10] Unknown:
better. Well, I think that's, like, a perspective basis of, like, the tool itself. You know what I mean? Like Yeah.
[00:45:16] Unknown:
So, like, yeah, maybe there's this analogy to math too. Like, it's just it is in the, like, its power is in the eye of who's using it, wielding it, learning it. And, it's like the thing that sticks with me from the mathematician's lament is that you don't have to make math interesting. It already is. You don't have to make it useful. It already is. You just need to let people figure their figure themselves out.
[00:45:45] Unknown:
And the best way to get the time to figure that out is through Bitcoin.
[00:45:49] Unknown:
Definitely. Like, yeah. I mean, I think that you have to a lot of Bitcoiners don't think they have the time for math. Let's just face that. Right? However Yeah. Yeah. The more it's it's like it's Bitcoin itself doesn't do that. It's the long process of struggling through what you're do you know, through what your life is about. Well, that's something makes it makes sense.
[00:46:15] Unknown:
There's also a factor of the friction. Right? We talked about the friction earlier. It's like so, like, what you know, without without having ever listened to this podcast, how would you know to go read understanding cryptography? Right? How would you know to go check out these different resources? I don't know. I'm actually I did. Getting to that point is, like, I I think that's one of the maybe one of the things that we can blend to the broader community is, like, here's an entry point to topic x, y, or zed as it applies to mathematics and specific more specifically to cryptography that you need to understand this Bitcoin thing. Because otherwise, how do you how do you get exposure to that? Right? Do you stumble upon it on the Internet? Do you stumble upon it because you go to university because you're, you know, doing what you're told to do?
Like the Right. Removing the friction of it.
[00:47:02] Unknown:
Yeah. And I see that. And I don't wanna fall into a trap of having to make it relevant for people, but maybe this is sort of like the same trap that people who wanna expand Bitcoin's adoption fall into too. It's like, well, we have you know, we can't, you know, the first wave maybe are the people who saw it for you know, saw it themselves, but now maybe it you know, it's like you don't have to convince somebody why Bitcoin is useful. It already it already is. But I guess you do have to get their attention. So this podcast is meant to get people's attention.
Right? And then present, like, a reason why, you know, a reason why it's important. And then hopefully people can, you know, they just see something in themselves. Did you wanna talk about any real math today?
[00:47:48] Unknown:
I think we just call this a Bitcoin episode. It's it's an inevitable thing. And and I apologize, dear listener, if you were, still suffering from insomnia because we did not talk about math equations.
[00:48:03] Unknown:
I hope this is the episode that, Richard Grieser comes back to, by the way. I was very bummed out to hear that he had started the podcast and tapped out. So I'm gonna speak that into existence. Some people are not cut out for it. I will well, I that's probably true. I do not think that applies to him, but I wanted to say one thing before we close out. I am after hearing him talk about tapping out, and, I'm considering doing an office hours where, like, for an hour a week, any any listener can come on and ask open questions, something like that. And I'm thinking of doing that, especially for people who are sort of on the edge of quiz. Let's not think about it. When's the when's the date? So next week, which day is I need to I need to I need to work that out. My my thought about it was, like, maybe Tuesday nights.
[00:48:48] Unknown:
Okay.
[00:48:50] Unknown:
There I'll look at the Gnoster account for motivating the math and I will up I will update I will post the updates there. And we're prop like I have to figure out the platform. It can't be corny chat because I feel like I need to be able to visually Yeah. Do do stuff. HiveTalk. So I'm gonna have to check play with Hive Talk. But just so that's coming, if you got to this if you're 12 episodes in and got to this point, you guys are are the fucking best. And I'm gonna continue to sup to, you know, put my time in to support you guys and keep you guys here.
[00:49:21] Unknown:
Thank you again, dear listener, for joining Average Gary and Fundamentals as they explore the friction and motivation for math.
[00:49:47] Unknown:
Because everyone comes to look. Don't wanna be anything where my life's in a good book. A dream that's true. Thanks, everybody.
[00:54:13] Unknown:
Couple of do songs.
Introduction and Musical Reflections
Mathematics and Music: A Harmonious Connection
The Art of Pattern Recognition
The Generalist's Lament
Specialization vs. Generalization in Mathematics
The Importance of Struggle in Learning
Bitcoin: A Catalyst for Mastery
Bitcoin's Impact on Knowledge and Society
