Broadcasts live every Wednesday at 8:00p.m. uk time on Radio Soapbox: http://radiosoapbox.com
In this episode, we delve into the fascinating world of Cornish gypsies, exploring their rich cultural heritage, traditions, and the challenges they face. We recount the life of Janet Isaac, a formidable woman known as the 'Queen of the Cornish Gypsies,' who lived to be 104 years old. Janet's story offers a glimpse into a way of life that is fast disappearing, highlighting the resilience and resourcefulness of the gypsy community. We also touch on the broader issues of housing and the impact of modern developments on traditional lifestyles. Join us as we celebrate the unique history and enduring spirit of the Cornish gypsies.
Additionally, we discuss the recent changes in the Duchy of Cornwall, now overseen by Prince William, and the implications for local communities. We also share personal anecdotes and reflections on the importance of manifesting positive outcomes in our lives. Tune in for an engaging and thought-provoking episode that blends history, culture, and contemporary issues.
[00:00:00]
Unknown:
Ground involved. We'll get into it more on another show. But it's now council owned, and he had asked the council if someone could let us in so that we could, you know, you know, because we were making this basically making this history documentary. And they wouldn't let us in unless we had public liability insurance, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. And they wanted to charge us. So Phil very, very politely told them where to go. And, so we had to film from just outside, but it was no it was no biggie. To be fair, we were sheltered by the trees, and it was raining. So
[00:00:36] Unknown:
And you can hear the rain nicely in the background. And I was quite surprised that cafe wasn't a cafe? It's now a tapas bar, isn't it? But it was the Yeah. Donut place. It was Donut. So that's a it was so noisy in there, wasn't it? And it's like Yeah. Almost like they would be as noisy as they could. And I was thinking, I don't think that was gonna come out, but came out fine, actually.
[00:00:58] Unknown:
So, yeah. It was a great day. They're they're in yeah. So so just to let you listeners know, we are going to prob it's gonna probably be, like, easily 2 shows. So because there were a lot of things to talk about as well as, you know, sort of anecdotal stuff that we will only be able to you know, because obviously Phil was showing us videos and stuff. And there were little stories about people that he'd interviewed and that kind of thing. So there there are a lot of, even despite Phil's very, very sort of, concise but extensive audio, there are still little blanks to fill in, visual blanks, and things like that. So the I think it's probably gonna be a couple of shows to actually get through all the material, but we will put it together for you guys.
[00:01:47] Unknown:
Well, who would have thought when we started this that we we would be doing a documentary?
[00:01:53] Unknown:
Yeah. It's it's funny, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's but so the thing is, when we say a documentary, it's all the audio is once the all the audio has been edited and and cleaned up and and all of, you know, blah blah blah, everything's been done that needs to be done. Phil and his son are actually gonna, so all the videos and stuff that we were talking about and all the photographs that, you know, we're gonna be talking about on the show, You'll actually be able to see properly, and it's gonna be stuck up on on on Phil's channel. Phil and Cornwall, on the on Phil's YouTube channel. Yeah. Phil in Cornwall. So, Yeah. It's gonna be it's gonna be epic. It was an epic day. Phil did actually send me an email afterwards, you know, because I sent him a message just saying thanks so much. That was that was just brilliant.
And, he said, yeah. It was it was a mammoth. It was a mammoth mission, wasn't it? He said, but yeah. But we did it. Yeah. We did it. And and Yeah. Like I say, it will I I was really buzzing about it after. Although, as I said at the very end of the day, my it wasn't just the fact that we'd been on the road for 7 hours. It was the fact that we'd we'd traveled the journey.
[00:03:03] Unknown:
Yeah. We really we've relived parts of it, haven't we? Some of the things they spoke about.
[00:03:08] Unknown:
And and yeah. Really took you back there. Yeah. And and one of the most poignant things for me was actually laying my hands on on 80 year old footprints left by tank tracks that embarked to go to d day. That was very, very poignant because you think, you know, which tank was that? Did it how far did it make it? Did they did any of them make it home? 1 in 5 folks of the, Americans that embarked from Cornwall made it to the end of the war. So and there were well over 20,000 in Cornwall alone. So yeah. So it will be a good show, but it's not gonna be this week. Shelley's got her own connection this week. My own.
[00:03:49] Unknown:
My own that I just did a quick bit of research on last night, and I've seen this story before. And I was like, oh, I'm gonna tell that story. So Oh, great. I do like a yarn. I like a yarn.
[00:04:01] Unknown:
So, I noticed that we now have a new Prince of Wales, and he is now in charge of all the Duchy of Cornwall.
[00:04:10] Unknown:
Do we? I've not been watching the news.
[00:04:14] Unknown:
Nor have I. Nor have I. I have to say, because I, obviously, I like to be I like it to be as up to date and current as possible. So when I finish work this evening, I simply put, Cornwall into a couple of different search engines, and then clicked on news and saw what the feeds were. Yes. So, we have, Prince William is now the Prince of Wales. Obviously, because his dad missed their old big old sausage fingers out there. The king. That's it. The king. King Charles, is no longer the prince of Wales, is he? So that that accolade has been passed on to his son. That baton has been passed on to his son. And, you know, the important son, the real son, you know, the one that's not ostracized and all that kind of thing.
So that's been passed on to him and apparently, he's now proprietor of the Duchy of Cornwall. So, yeah, he basically manages it via WhatsApp, and it's worth roughly 1,300,000,000 to him. That's nice, isn't it? I wonder how much it's gonna be sold off. Do you know one of the things I was talking to Greener after the show the other, last week because you weren't here, you were off rocking out, weren't you, last week? Rocking. Yeah. I was. You were rocking. Actually, I've got to ask. How was it?
[00:05:34] Unknown:
It was alright. It was alright. I think because me and Darren are both, well, both into music, We could see flaws. I think they were having a few production issues with sound technical stuff. Yeah. But, you know, he looks like little things with the tube next to the microphone? Not that I could see. Did they do Living on a Prayer? Yes. They did that last. They did? Yeah. Yeah. It was it was alright. I mean, they played the one song. And I mean, I'd have had a few glasses of wine, of course, and their song do you know that one? And I will love you always.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I just cried all the way through that because I was thinking about my nan, and I suppose it's still a bit raw. It's nothing like a song that really comes and fills you up with emotion, is there? But, no, we enjoyed it. There's a few out there. There's a few out there, isn't it? Huge day of joy because you've only gotta be in just the right mood or just the wrong mood, however you wanna word it.
[00:06:31] Unknown:
And, yeah. It can or or just going through a tough time in your life. I know I know I know when, you know, in recent times when I've I've I've had a few tough things that have gone on and and, at one point my son sent me a song. So listeners, particularly male listeners out there, my son I was at a very low ebb, I have to say. My son sent me the song. He said, oh man, he said, this this song actually made me choke, he said, when I first listened to it. And, he sent it to me and and all I could well, I said put it this way, I listened to it, and then I sent him an expletive backwards, back, you know, back to him. I sent him an expletive because, yeah, it it did exactly the same thing to me. But guy any guys out there, go and have a look up Amigo the Devil. And he did a song called Cocaine and Abel, which is very it's the only song that he says he's totally alright with because he doesn't care what anyone else thinks because he wrote it for him. So there you go. So so it's a it's one of those real genuine tunes. But, anyway, going back to what I was saying about I was talking to Greener last week.
And we're talking about the Duchy of Cornwall, and and it's worth 1,300,000,000 to Prince William, the new Prince of Wales. And, that's great for something that you can just fart around with on WhatsApp, isn't it? Yeah. I'm a bit bored. I'll do a status. Yeah. I'll just I'll just I'll have a little fart around on this. This is worth 1,300,000,000, did you know, darling? Yes. Anyway, what yeah. That's just one of the one of his many estates, I'm sure. But, Greener was saying that before his mate died, he who was very you know, really into the building business. I mean, greeneries as well, but, you know, his mate's side had been in it a long time and and had done some very, very large projects and all that kind of thing. They have big developments. And and, he said years ago, he said 1 third of it had to be for affordable housing. You buy a plot, you got so you got 9 houses. 3 of those houses need to be affordable.
Yeah. He said before just before he died well, I've cut a year or so before he died. He went and looked at this plot. And, yeah, Yeah. 3rd of them had to be for, you know, affordable housing. The other 3rd were for, there was another third which was just for normal retail, which is that's where you make your profit as a builder. You know, all these other things are just legislation bought in to take profit off of you and make money for the local councils. Yeah? That's that's how it works. And to grease the polls, you have sort of 106 agreements. So they're you know, donate $20 for a for a local cycle path to be put in, which may or may not ever be put in. And they might consider forwarding looking into your plans a bit more, that kind of thing. Well, so that's 1 third for affordable, 1 third for profit for the for the businessmen.
And the other third of this this plot, I don't know whether this applies to every every plot in Cornwall, but I believe it is. Anyone is welcome to write, phone in, whatever, email me, tell me that I'm wrong. But the other third is for immigrants.
[00:09:45] Unknown:
Oh, that does surprise me. Oh my gosh.
[00:09:48] Unknown:
So you look at all the housing going up in your apartment. Excuse me. Potentially, 1 third of that is designated.
[00:09:57] Unknown:
Yep. Wow.
[00:09:59] Unknown:
It's quite impressive, isn't it?
[00:10:02] Unknown:
Well, I did see yesterday on the news, when I was sat down visiting someone at work, the as of January, I think it is, the Bibby Stockholm is no longer going to be used. So I don't know, you know, that holds, I think, up to 500 people. They're not gonna just stop the problem like that, are they? They've gotta be housed somewhere. So I suppose they're thinking perhaps by January, we'll have places for these people.
[00:10:33] Unknown:
Wow. There's a lot of building going on everywhere. And we're about to see a massive influx in Cornwall, I'm convinced. So we'll Well, there's a lot of people out there already, aren't there, that haven't got There are. Homes. It's awful. Oh, awful to see. Someone one of the ladies I walk my dog with, she her house has been sold out from under her, and she's, you know, basically, the local council and housing associations have said, well, have you looked into, renting privately? And she was like Yeah. Yes, I have. You try and find me one, you know, because there's nothing. And, she got really angry, and this is not, you know, this is her quote unquote, this is what she said. She said, she said, if I went in there and painted my face up, she said, and she said this to them. She said, if I came in here and painted my face up and had some children with me, you'd, you'd probably find somewhere for me, wouldn't you?
[00:11:22] Unknown:
You know? Yeah. She was so angry. She was so angry. A friend like that. She keeps saying if I turned up on a dinghy, I think they'd find me a home. Yep. Four children living in a mobile home, and they've been moved about 5 times in the last 3 years. And Interesting. You know, where is she gonna find somewhere to privately rent for £1400
[00:11:42] Unknown:
a month? Because that's what a lot of them are going for. Anywhere. It could go on go on to the, yeah. Challenge anyone. Go on go on to the, try and find yourself a house to rent in Cornwall. There isn't Airbnb. Yeah. Alright. Yeah. I know you can find an Airbnb to rent. That's not practical for living in.
[00:11:59] Unknown:
So, yeah, it's it's very sad, isn't it? Very sad indeed. It is. And I it's also made me think, like, with my nan's staff at the moment, we've gotta go through all of this probate stuff, and that could take 9 months. So it makes you think as well, how many houses are empty out there because of the same situations? It's gotta be a lot.
[00:12:19] Unknown:
Yeah. I would've thought so. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:12:23] Unknown:
Yeah. There's lots of houses out there. But unfortunately, just just a few too many people. Just a few.
[00:12:32] Unknown:
Just a few. Just a few. Just a few. Anyway, moving on.
[00:12:36] Unknown:
Moving swiftly along. Yes.
[00:12:40] Unknown:
So yeah. So what's really important down here in Cornwall, or what used to be really important down here in Cornwall is our tourist industry because, you know, fishing's we've been stripped of fishing pretty much. You know, there's there's you the fishing's got slightly better over the last few years, but not not drastically at all. Not enough to make a difference, not like it used to be in Cornwall, booming fishing industry, all that kind of thing. So the other thing that's really important down here is is tourism. And, why is it right? Why is it that the council take all this money, all these yeah. Or or we all pay our council tax, well, some of us do, you know, and yada yada yada. But they are shutting toilets, public toilets on beaches and blah blah blah blah at a rate of not. What do you think is gonna be the end result of this? You know, last year, my dad actually went out to the car park across the road from the flats that he lives in, which are alright. They're holiday lets and stuff. They're over there all privately owned, that kind of thing. Went over into the private car park, and there was someone crouched behind the car,
[00:13:52] Unknown:
defecating on the in the car park. Do you know what I mean? Nice. And it's just like, yeah. But because there's no blooming parking toilet Well, when we went to Pentooine Beach, I thought I'd nip in the toilet, and it was 50 p. I you might have had 50 p. I wasn't that desperate to go, but it's the point, isn't it? So where else am I supposed to go?
[00:14:11] Unknown:
Yeah. Absolutely. And aren't we supposed to be getting rid of cash?
[00:14:15] Unknown:
Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Oh, it's it's just crazy. It's just crazy.
[00:14:21] Unknown:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, have you got any other news?
[00:14:27] Unknown:
Well, the little bit of news that I did catch today that I was intrigued with was on Cornwall Live. Because I've interviewed this guy before, Jason. No, not Jason. That's not his name. Basically, he ran Touch Gloves Gym in Penzance. And the last few years he's really struggled with his own mental health trying to keep it going because his daughters were Muay Thai boxing champions. They've been everywhere and what have you. And this guy, he reached out to me in COVID times because it was back then it was a bit like people used to think I was a counselor and stuff. It's like, what do you think I should do? And it's like, I haven't got a clue. But I think also it was like, can I get the story out there? So he was basically saying, you know, because there was supposed to be that stadium that was built in Truro, but in the end, it went to the rugby, I think, the big stadium.
But there was high hopes that that would be shared by, you know, for massive sporting events, for boxing and everything, but it didn't go ahead. And anyway, this guy, he reached out to to me again in January. And I was just like, you know, I tried phoning a couple of numbers for him because he was struggling emotionally, mentally. And, anyway, long story short, there's this big post up today on Cornwall Live saying that the gym's been closed down. And there was no word or warning, just a note on the door. Very sorry. Please cancel your direct debits. You know, lots of the comments are very positive about him. You know, other people obviously annoyed. They've traveled a long way and the gym's closed, but, you know, he he's felt the way he's been treated and stuff the last few months that he hadn't even been able to show his face in that place.
And I was a bit like, a prepper, so to speak. When he phoned me a couple of times, I would try and advise him and try and pick him up a little bit. But anyway, so I read that today that that gym's closed, which is quite sad, and it's all to do with financial problems as always. Yeah. So it's about funding that he couldn't get and stuff like that. So, yeah, that's sad. But that's the only other one we've seen. Yeah. Everyone's getting pinched. You know? Is it is it still more for a a a bottle of, olive oil than it is for a bottle of wine? It is if you get the good stuff. Yeah. Yeah. It certainly is. I was only using mine today, and I thought, oh, a third of a bottle left. Let's make it last. And for the first time, the other day, I poured some in the frying pan. It was way too much, and I had to throw a load a bit away after. And I said, oh gosh. I feel so wasteful, especially given the price of it. You know, probably a couple of years ago, I wouldn't have had an eyelid, but perhaps it'll make us all be a bit more stingy.
[00:17:05] Unknown:
I don't like wasting stuff anyway, but I did think about it. £8 a bottle. Do you think you think how, you know, back in after wartime and rationing and all that kind of thing. And you think, you know, back further than than that, you know, there was not a lot of went to not a lot went to waste off of a carcass and things. You know what I mean? No. People And that's that's what I'm trying to be a bit like now. Not because of money. So was you in at all houses. The offal and eyeballs and stuff? Or No. Would you not go that far? No. I'm not going that far. I remember watching that Victorian era cooking thing many years ago on TV when we actually had a TV license. And there was a woman on there making sausages.
And she said, if anyone's bought cheap sausages and think they haven't had lips and eye eyeballs, she said, you got another thing coming.
[00:17:50] Unknown:
Now when you say that, I do if ever we're out and about and we go to bakery, I might have a sausage roll. And I know that that's I try not to think about it, but to be fair, I'd forgotten. And when I was younger and, you know, me and my husband were, like, just married and money was really tight, we used to buy the value range for everything. And it was probably about 10% meat, if that, in the sausages, but my god, they were tasty. So Yeah. Perhaps there's something to be said for eating earls, aisles, aisles, and all the rest. You know? Eye holes. Tasty.
[00:18:24] Unknown:
I'm glad you said eye holes. Well But, anyway, you are listening to radio soapbox.com, folks. We are already at the bottom of the hour. So we're gonna have a short little break here. And when we come back, it will be Shelley's connection. I last week, I basically, filled in for Shelley for her show. So we did a 2 hour kerna connection last week. And, what I did for the first hour was play songs, that was submitted to my old website over 20 years ago. So or around yeah. Over 20 years ago Or around 20 years ago. And, yeah. There are loads of them. So I just thought I'd I'd put because I've got a whole load here on on the page next to me that didn't get played last week. I'll just stick one of them in the break here. So this one is called not alone. There you go. Enjoy.
See you in a few minutes. Please. To let
[00:22:01] Unknown:
me know. Sorry eyes are telling lies. She hums a little lullaby.
[00:25:30] Unknown:
There you go. Oh, I like that. Moulay. Moulay with Not Alone. There you go. That was good. Yeah. That's, so just to clarify, I no longer have that website. That was a website that I ran 20 years ago for myself and other musicians. In fact, any artists. I had, like, people submitting photographs, not not dodgy ones, and, people submitting sort of, like, philosoph there was I had one area called Philosophy Corner and things like that. So Oh, it sounds really good. Yeah. Then I had I'd got busy with kids and that was that. That was that. They ruined your life. I just got swept under the carpet. Yeah. I'll put it all on disk and, lock it away to collect dust. But, yeah, I bought it out the other week. So I thought, well, actually, this there were some corkers. There were some really bad artists. There were there were some corkers as well. And it was just like it was so nice last week just pulling out a random selection of stuff. And it Yeah. I enjoyed it. Yeah. As well. So yeah.
Yeah. Anyway, so Shelley's connection this week. So, obviously, for people who don't normally listen to us on the connection, we, or they're just tuning into Radio Soapbox for the first time. Connection, we we basically every week, we pull out something Cornish, something Cornish heritage, something Cornish celebrity, something Cornish person of interest, just because not only is it important to us and and we are on a learning journey at the same time, but if any of the stories interest you, if any of the things that we cover interest you, go home and look at your own heritage. I bet there's loads of great stuff, and that's what it's about. So take it away, Shelley.
[00:27:14] Unknown:
Okeydoke. Let me clear my throat. Hang on. Excuse me. Right. I'm going to be talking to you about our Cornish gypsies. Okay. Right. For 100 of years, this group of people have been a misunderstood and at times persecuted part of the society. In the press, they were often at best car captured and at worst often vilified. But with the help of Nessa and Tom Isaac, what's started to unfold is a cohort with a strong family bonds and values and a complex cultural heritage, a hidden community that sincerely cares for and supports each other and one that has surprisingly strong roots binding them to Cornwall. Cornish gypsy folk have simply chosen to live their lives in a different way from the gorgeous or country people as they call us, but they sadly continue to face prejudice.
And unfortunately, most of what we have known is the lies of the Cornish gypsies of the past comes from unreliable sources. The fleeting impressions of the judgmental writers of the time or local folklorists who were only interested in curses and potions or the often derogatory articles that were reported in the press. It is a sad fact that the newspapers generally only reported the stories of gypsies who had fallen foul of the law in some way, perhaps for rough sleeping or because they were accused of tricking people out of money by telling fortunes or threatening to ill wish someone. Very little is known about their ordinary lives, and that is partly because they chose to live outside of society's expectations and conventions.
Family roots. There are an estimated 250,000 gypsies or travelers living in the UK today. That's 2024. And they have been here since at least 16th century. In the 2021 census, no point 2 of the Cornish population identified as Gypsy, Roma, or Traveller. Often called Roma or Romani people these days, they are by no means, population. Under that umbrella, there are many diverse groups, each with individual culture differences found all across Europe and beyond. In general, however, the genetic ancestry is thought to originate from Northern India or pap perhaps Egypt. Indeed, some suggest that the English word gypsy is a corruption of Egyptian.
At one time, there were many family gypsies in Cornwall. Some that were just passing through, but others that close had close associations with the area. A census census taken in 1965 found that there were 100 gypsy families in Cornwall, and only 12 of these were living on licensed sites. In 190 8, the Cornishman newspaper recorded the name of Gypsy, Cornish Gypsy Families as Cooper, Stanley, and Smith. But there were also the Richards, the Isaacs, and the Boswells. There are great number of superstitions which the gypsy Romy people hold dear even to this day. For example, they believe that 7th child of the 7th child will have second sight although their wagons are often painted with designs in bright colors.
Black must never be used. The color will bring death to the family. Most gypsies don't trust banks and tend to put their money into something solid like gold. They are also extremely given within their communities. If someone needs help buying something, a new fridge or a piece of equipment perhaps, then they all club together. The idea being that when you need help yourself, the favor will be returned. It was customary to burn all the possessions of their family members after they have died, the caravan included. One of the last recorded cases of this happening in Cornwall was after the death of Elizabeth Holland in 1966, and another was after the death of Janet Isaac in 1974.
So we are now gonna be introducing Janet Isaac. Janet had been a born had been born at a camp on Gipsy Lane in Houston around 18 70 where she and her husband, Joseph, may have had as many as 17 children. One of which, Alice, I know. Sorry. Sorry. Only 17. Wow. That's that's going. That's a lot. That's a lot. Yes. Alright. Sorry. Carry on. That's okay. One of which, Alice, was Tom Isaac's grandmother. It was Tom's wife, Nessa, who first wrote to wrote to me. I'm reading this off somebody else's site, suggesting that I tell granny Isaac's story. Fortunately, Tom remembers his great grandmother well, and much of the information here is able to relate comes from childhood memories of her and his grandparents.
The exact date I know. The exact great. Shut up, interrupting. Shut. The exact date of Janet and Joseph's marriage isn't clear. Gipsy families often avoided registering unions in the usual way, and it was not uncommon for them to go through life without birth or marriage certificates. I love that. The couple were cousins, however, had and had presumably known each other all their lives. Not sure about that one. Joseph, who had been born around 18/61, had been blind from birth, which meant that most of the responsibilities of the family fell to Janet. They seem to have spent much of their married life in and around Cambourne, living in camps at Stray Park and Dundance Burrows close to Cambray.
Though they were also known to have ventured around the Penzance and Golval area too, and sometimes upcountry for seasonal work. The couple the couple had a great many children to support, and they're not able to work at the traditional sense. Joseph made paper flowers, clothes pegs, and little wooden sculptures for the family to sell. For her part, Janet made lace a delicate and highly skilled profession and went door to door selling it by the yard as well as the other wares the family produced. The selling door to door was something that she had done since the age of 11, and her children continued and contributed to to help and do what they could, especially around Christmas time when they would make wreaths of wreaths of Holly to sell. For a few extra pennies, Janet was also known to tell the fortunes of the housewives that she called upon her rounds.
On one occasion, however, this got her into trouble. In March in 1934, she was visiting homes as usual on Clarence Street in Goeville, offering her various sales for goods. At one of the houses, she stops to tell the lady's owner's fortune, whatever was she, but whatever she predicted caused the housewife such distress that the neighbors called for the local policeman. When he arrived, he asked to see Janet's peddling license. This she produced only to discover it had expired a few months before and she was fined. This was not the only time that Janet Isaac had trouble with the police. Though given the circumstances, it is possible that the problems arose from malicious tattle tailing rather than any serious criminality.
For generations, Cornish gypsies had been experts in the breeding and care of horses. Many of the men folk made their money from selling the animals and the Isaac family seemed to have been part of this trade too. In 1939, Janet and their family were camped below Cambrai with a number of ponies hobbled and gazing on the slopes. Unfortunately, somebody passing noticed that one of the horses had a saw in his leg and reported it to the authorities. Janet was charged with neglecting the animal. At the hearing in Campbell, it was established that 8 members of the Isaac family, presumably Joseph and Janet's sons, were employed at Self Crofty Mind, and the weekly income for the whole family was around £20.
Janet explained to the court that there had been no intention to injure the pony, and it has only been left unattended for one day. But despite this, the chairman, mister T Stoplin, fined her 1 pound. The newspaper reported that Janet claimed to be unable to pay immediately and suggested that he sent her up the line instead, meaning to Bodmin Jail. In the end, it was agreed that she would pay the fine within a fortnight to escape imprisonment. Sadly, not long after this episode, Janet's husband, Joseph, passed away in April 1940, aged 79 years, and was buried in the graveyard at Glynip.
Janet remained a strong and resourceful woman who was much admired within the Gypsy community, especially in her later years. She was often called upon for her advice, both spiritual and practical, and would often be asked to settle disputes within the local families. She was a real metric of the Cornish gypsy life. In 1967, Janet was interviewed by Jane Radford for the Cornish guardian. By then, she was thought to be 97 years old, by far the oldest gypsy in Cornwall. By then, she also had around 200 grandchildren and great grandchildren. You can comment.
200. Yeah. I know.
[00:36:07] Unknown:
So Yeah. Wouldn't have those back at the weekend, would you? No. Pardon?
[00:36:12] Unknown:
In the interview, Janet spoke nostalgically of the days when she and her family lived in a horse drawn wagon and moved from place to place. She explained how in her youth she had traveled to Hampshire, Somerset, and other southern countries for seasonal work such as hop or pea picking. Janet recalled frequently eating hedgehogs while on the road which were delicious, she said, if rolled in a lump of clay and cooked on an open fire. In her final years, Janet became known as the queen of the Cornish gypsies and is thought by her family to have been the last gypsy queen in Cornwall. A term of endearment acknowledging the elderly woman's status at the matriarch of the community. I don't think I'm saying that wrong that word right. Matriarch? Matriarch. Alright. Matriarch. Matriarch. Right. I can say it. In 1970, she was interviewed for a final time on this occasion by local journalist, Jona King.
It was to mark her 100th birthday. Sadly, she had not received her telegram from the queen in recognition of a great age because there was no official record of her birth. Still living in a tiny caravan on Cambrai, Janet told the interviewer how she preferred a life under canvas more than any other. These caravans is all very well, sir, but give me a canvas and ponies every time. Under canvas is healthier and better and the ponies was part of the family. When asked what she did with her day, she replied, I sits beside the fire, looks at me picture books and puffs at me pipe. As long as old granny have got a crust of bread and a pipe o'backey, then things ain't so bad, sir.
Granny Isaac outlived all of her children and died on the 4th November 1974, aged a 104. She was buried with her husband, Joseph, at Gwyneth Churchyard, and her great grandson, Tom Isaac, remembers her caravan, which had been our home for so many years, and this was then set on fire. The family stood together and watched it burn, and Tom explained that the flames ensured that her spirit didn't linger with the possessions. By the time granny Isaac passed away, the traditional gypsy way of life was coming to an end for many in her community. The sixties seventies saw traveling families settling down on licensed sites or in council houses to take advantage of steady work and local school education for their children.
Rather than trading in horses, they moved over to cars and scrap metal. But many of their beliefs and customs still continue despite their changing circumstances as Tom and Nessa Isaac, the descendants of granny Isaac can attest. The story of this formidable woman's life gives us an amazing glimpse not only into the past, but also into a way of life and a culture that is little understood and fast disappearing. But it is important that we acknowledge that at one time, the gypsy culture was just as much as part of our Cornish heritage as any other, and that generations of this small population had been maligned often thought through no fault of their own.
Nessa and Tom, who were so warm and kind answering all of these questions, told us some very upsetting stories from their own lives. Stories where they and their families have been mistreated, bullied, and abused in the street because of their gypsy backgrounds. And that is that.
[00:39:25] Unknown:
Wow. And do you know wow. Wow. Bravo. Bravo. Honestly, that was that was really insightful and and lovely and and and the anecdotes, absolutely wonderful. Her husband could make paper flowers and stuff Yeah. Despite the fact that he was blind. And they were well, I'm assuming they were salable.
[00:39:49] Unknown:
I love the bit about the birth certificate and stuff, though, though, but she couldn't get a telegram because they didn't register
[00:39:56] Unknown:
their births and stuff. No. No. Of course. And these caravans are are are right as rain, but give me a canvas anytime because it's more healthy and the horse is a part of the family. You know? Oh, wow. That's that's, do you know what? Oh. We've this is what we've lost out of this is what this is what you this is what you've lost by carrying your blooming mobile phone with all the wet locks. Shut up. No. Come on. This is what we've lost, though, isn't it? This is the that way of life. And, alright, I I know some people wouldn't wanna go back to having to pick collect sticks to boil a pot of water so they can make a cup of tea. I get it. But there's something just
[00:40:39] Unknown:
Simplicity. Intrinsically,
[00:40:45] Unknown:
intrinsically human about it. Just, you know, just going back to nature, you know. I swear. I swear. You know, when the apocalypse comes, I'm I'm gonna be in a field somewhere just
[00:41:02] Unknown:
Yeah. Why not? You know, and I always think now I would love to have some land, and I literally
[00:41:10] Unknown:
sold 4 acres of land. I know. So I could buy it out. Such a shame. I'd have bought an acre off you. I would've. I would've. Oh. Oh, man. Anyway I probably bought a price in 2 when you were selling it, but there we I'm not actually to now either, but there we go.
[00:41:27] Unknown:
I know the price of land. Land. Oh, I would. I want a cow, and I want some chickens. That's my main source at the moment. I'm manifesting it. You you used that word at the end of your show. I like the word manifest. I love it. Is this is this all about positive thinking and sculpting the reality around you? Yeah. And I believe in it. I'm sorry. I don't want it now. It's out of your hands. It's out of your hands. Rubbish. Rubbish. It is. You're living in a real life plan. No. You're living inside. You know when you all say what will be will be, and, it is it is what it is, and I love that statement. What it is, my dear. It is what it is, but that also is a bit of a I say that a lot because it means that I don't really care, and I just accept it. But then that's like telling somebody, like, I wanna do this and wanna do And, like, they mustn't try and do anything a bit different because it is what it is. Nothing's gonna change. I don't know because I'm a bit like The the the phrase it is what it is. Yeah. The phrase it is what it is is
[00:42:24] Unknown:
it, sort of goes back to the serenity thing, and that is your your accept your acceptance, basically. I just accept everything at the moment. Yeah. But it's also a way of giving up. Yes. Yeah. Oh, it is what it is. That's I get what you're getting at. Yes. Well, you have to think about it in the positive and and that is, you know, well, again, give me the strength to change the
[00:42:46] Unknown:
things of other you know? Yeah. So you can manifest so you can manifest things.
[00:42:53] Unknown:
Yes. I suppose you can work towards bringing things into being. I do think if you want something bad enough,
[00:42:59] Unknown:
you will get it.
[00:43:01] Unknown:
I do. Okay. Yeah. Well, you tell that to that lady who's trying to get a house that I was talking about earlier.
[00:43:09] Unknown:
Yeah. Within reason. But then, you know, there's nothing strange reason, like, there's nothing you know? But then some way does this mental capacity go is what I'm asking? Well, I don't know. You just have to try it, don't you? She might not get a house that she can buy 1, but in the near future, she's gotta imagine herself living in a house, feeling that she lives in a house and seeing herself wake up in that house, and I love it. There's a book called The Secret by Rhonda Giles, I think she's called, and, yeah, I resonate a lot with it.
We just, you just have to put it out there. Thoughts become reality, so you are what you think. Very deep tonight, aren't we, Maleficus?
[00:43:48] Unknown:
Well, is this the royal way, I take it?
[00:43:52] Unknown:
Royal we. Yes. We are very deep tonight. Yes. We is. We yes. 1 is. 1 is. Well, no. You're deep as well. You're quite deep anyway, I think, aren't you?
[00:44:02] Unknown:
I can be. I can be really shallow at times as well. Who can't?
[00:44:08] Unknown:
At least to be honest.
[00:44:09] Unknown:
Yeah. No. I I think we can all be shallow at times because we choose to be at times, I think. But most, yeah, most of the time, I'm a I'm a bit of a thinker. Yeah. It has to be said, but I don't think I don't think me or me or you or anyone else on Radio Soapbox would be here if they were an idle thinker. If they were going along with the herd, they wouldn't be here.
[00:44:30] Unknown:
I finally came to terms like what this is all about, this radio show, the last week or so because, you know, I wanted to go into video and stuff like that and just, I don't know, got caught up with it as, like, I need to do this, make it really big and stuff. And I'm at that point now. It's like, do you know what? Those that want to listen, those that you reach, and this is what I do for a hobby. This is what I do in my spare time researching, then I get to chat to people about things that I'm interested in. So it's taken me a long time to realize that yeah. Exactly. But it's taken me a long time to realize that this is a hobby.
I don't know why I've only started thinking about it like that lately. Perhaps because I had a little break a while ago, and you come back different and fresh. And I only said to Darren tonight, I said, you know, because I don't do video anymore, I don't get any of those nerves, really, like I used to. That takes a lot of edge off it, and it's like, yeah, I do radio, not doing what everybody else is doing. Because radio, I think everybody does podcasts with video and stuff, and I I just can't cope with it. I just wanna enjoy it, and that's what it's all about. So, anyway, that's my thoughts.
[00:45:41] Unknown:
Yeah. No. Brilliant. Absolutely fantastic. And great show a great Shelley Tasker show earlier. Hat off to Sarah for doing what she does. And folks you can go back into the Pod Home archives to find that. The link I don't believe is on the radiosoapbox.com website yet, but I'm not sure.
[00:46:01] Unknown:
We
[00:46:02] Unknown:
must put a put a request into management. Well, maybe put a request into management. Yes. Yes. Maybe we could just get off get off our asses and do it ourselves. I don't know. I'm not gonna plan to. Anyway, thank you so much, for joining us, folks. You've been listening to radio soapbox.com and in particular, the kurno connection with Modefica Scott and Shelley Tasker. Coming after us is, Joss the Boss and guests from, we think, Freelee Radio. That's coming up straight after we finish. Thank you so much In in your own words, Shelley, thank you so much for your company, folks. Really, great to have you here. And we will catch up with you next week and we may well have the starts of the D Day the American D Day Journeys next week. So stay tuned, folks. And, I'm gonna play out now. If you got anything anything left to say, Shelley? Yeah. I was just gonna say have an awesome week, everyone.
[00:47:04] Unknown:
Alright. And manifest. Remember, you are your thoughts. Yeah. Your thoughts are you.
[00:47:09] Unknown:
Yeah. The end. Yeah. And all that. And all And all that jazz. I gotta play out with the amazing Graham Hart. This one's for the boys. Take care, folks. See you next week. See you next
[00:47:21] Unknown:
week.
[00:48:00] Unknown:
Easy. It picks you up and puts you down, and no one seems to gain. So take me from a struggle road to where they'll never reach me.
Ground involved. We'll get into it more on another show. But it's now council owned, and he had asked the council if someone could let us in so that we could, you know, you know, because we were making this basically making this history documentary. And they wouldn't let us in unless we had public liability insurance, etcetera, etcetera, etcetera. And they wanted to charge us. So Phil very, very politely told them where to go. And, so we had to film from just outside, but it was no it was no biggie. To be fair, we were sheltered by the trees, and it was raining. So
[00:00:36] Unknown:
And you can hear the rain nicely in the background. And I was quite surprised that cafe wasn't a cafe? It's now a tapas bar, isn't it? But it was the Yeah. Donut place. It was Donut. So that's a it was so noisy in there, wasn't it? And it's like Yeah. Almost like they would be as noisy as they could. And I was thinking, I don't think that was gonna come out, but came out fine, actually.
[00:00:58] Unknown:
So, yeah. It was a great day. They're they're in yeah. So so just to let you listeners know, we are going to prob it's gonna probably be, like, easily 2 shows. So because there were a lot of things to talk about as well as, you know, sort of anecdotal stuff that we will only be able to you know, because obviously Phil was showing us videos and stuff. And there were little stories about people that he'd interviewed and that kind of thing. So there there are a lot of, even despite Phil's very, very sort of, concise but extensive audio, there are still little blanks to fill in, visual blanks, and things like that. So the I think it's probably gonna be a couple of shows to actually get through all the material, but we will put it together for you guys.
[00:01:47] Unknown:
Well, who would have thought when we started this that we we would be doing a documentary?
[00:01:53] Unknown:
Yeah. It's it's funny, isn't it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's but so the thing is, when we say a documentary, it's all the audio is once the all the audio has been edited and and cleaned up and and all of, you know, blah blah blah, everything's been done that needs to be done. Phil and his son are actually gonna, so all the videos and stuff that we were talking about and all the photographs that, you know, we're gonna be talking about on the show, You'll actually be able to see properly, and it's gonna be stuck up on on on Phil's channel. Phil and Cornwall, on the on Phil's YouTube channel. Yeah. Phil in Cornwall. So, Yeah. It's gonna be it's gonna be epic. It was an epic day. Phil did actually send me an email afterwards, you know, because I sent him a message just saying thanks so much. That was that was just brilliant.
And, he said, yeah. It was it was a mammoth. It was a mammoth mission, wasn't it? He said, but yeah. But we did it. Yeah. We did it. And and Yeah. Like I say, it will I I was really buzzing about it after. Although, as I said at the very end of the day, my it wasn't just the fact that we'd been on the road for 7 hours. It was the fact that we'd we'd traveled the journey.
[00:03:03] Unknown:
Yeah. We really we've relived parts of it, haven't we? Some of the things they spoke about.
[00:03:08] Unknown:
And and yeah. Really took you back there. Yeah. And and one of the most poignant things for me was actually laying my hands on on 80 year old footprints left by tank tracks that embarked to go to d day. That was very, very poignant because you think, you know, which tank was that? Did it how far did it make it? Did they did any of them make it home? 1 in 5 folks of the, Americans that embarked from Cornwall made it to the end of the war. So and there were well over 20,000 in Cornwall alone. So yeah. So it will be a good show, but it's not gonna be this week. Shelley's got her own connection this week. My own.
[00:03:49] Unknown:
My own that I just did a quick bit of research on last night, and I've seen this story before. And I was like, oh, I'm gonna tell that story. So Oh, great. I do like a yarn. I like a yarn.
[00:04:01] Unknown:
So, I noticed that we now have a new Prince of Wales, and he is now in charge of all the Duchy of Cornwall.
[00:04:10] Unknown:
Do we? I've not been watching the news.
[00:04:14] Unknown:
Nor have I. Nor have I. I have to say, because I, obviously, I like to be I like it to be as up to date and current as possible. So when I finish work this evening, I simply put, Cornwall into a couple of different search engines, and then clicked on news and saw what the feeds were. Yes. So, we have, Prince William is now the Prince of Wales. Obviously, because his dad missed their old big old sausage fingers out there. The king. That's it. The king. King Charles, is no longer the prince of Wales, is he? So that that accolade has been passed on to his son. That baton has been passed on to his son. And, you know, the important son, the real son, you know, the one that's not ostracized and all that kind of thing.
So that's been passed on to him and apparently, he's now proprietor of the Duchy of Cornwall. So, yeah, he basically manages it via WhatsApp, and it's worth roughly 1,300,000,000 to him. That's nice, isn't it? I wonder how much it's gonna be sold off. Do you know one of the things I was talking to Greener after the show the other, last week because you weren't here, you were off rocking out, weren't you, last week? Rocking. Yeah. I was. You were rocking. Actually, I've got to ask. How was it?
[00:05:34] Unknown:
It was alright. It was alright. I think because me and Darren are both, well, both into music, We could see flaws. I think they were having a few production issues with sound technical stuff. Yeah. But, you know, he looks like little things with the tube next to the microphone? Not that I could see. Did they do Living on a Prayer? Yes. They did that last. They did? Yeah. Yeah. It was it was alright. I mean, they played the one song. And I mean, I'd have had a few glasses of wine, of course, and their song do you know that one? And I will love you always.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I just cried all the way through that because I was thinking about my nan, and I suppose it's still a bit raw. It's nothing like a song that really comes and fills you up with emotion, is there? But, no, we enjoyed it. There's a few out there. There's a few out there, isn't it? Huge day of joy because you've only gotta be in just the right mood or just the wrong mood, however you wanna word it.
[00:06:31] Unknown:
And, yeah. It can or or just going through a tough time in your life. I know I know I know when, you know, in recent times when I've I've I've had a few tough things that have gone on and and, at one point my son sent me a song. So listeners, particularly male listeners out there, my son I was at a very low ebb, I have to say. My son sent me the song. He said, oh man, he said, this this song actually made me choke, he said, when I first listened to it. And, he sent it to me and and all I could well, I said put it this way, I listened to it, and then I sent him an expletive backwards, back, you know, back to him. I sent him an expletive because, yeah, it it did exactly the same thing to me. But guy any guys out there, go and have a look up Amigo the Devil. And he did a song called Cocaine and Abel, which is very it's the only song that he says he's totally alright with because he doesn't care what anyone else thinks because he wrote it for him. So there you go. So so it's a it's one of those real genuine tunes. But, anyway, going back to what I was saying about I was talking to Greener last week.
And we're talking about the Duchy of Cornwall, and and it's worth 1,300,000,000 to Prince William, the new Prince of Wales. And, that's great for something that you can just fart around with on WhatsApp, isn't it? Yeah. I'm a bit bored. I'll do a status. Yeah. I'll just I'll just I'll have a little fart around on this. This is worth 1,300,000,000, did you know, darling? Yes. Anyway, what yeah. That's just one of the one of his many estates, I'm sure. But, Greener was saying that before his mate died, he who was very you know, really into the building business. I mean, greeneries as well, but, you know, his mate's side had been in it a long time and and had done some very, very large projects and all that kind of thing. They have big developments. And and, he said years ago, he said 1 third of it had to be for affordable housing. You buy a plot, you got so you got 9 houses. 3 of those houses need to be affordable.
Yeah. He said before just before he died well, I've cut a year or so before he died. He went and looked at this plot. And, yeah, Yeah. 3rd of them had to be for, you know, affordable housing. The other 3rd were for, there was another third which was just for normal retail, which is that's where you make your profit as a builder. You know, all these other things are just legislation bought in to take profit off of you and make money for the local councils. Yeah? That's that's how it works. And to grease the polls, you have sort of 106 agreements. So they're you know, donate $20 for a for a local cycle path to be put in, which may or may not ever be put in. And they might consider forwarding looking into your plans a bit more, that kind of thing. Well, so that's 1 third for affordable, 1 third for profit for the for the businessmen.
And the other third of this this plot, I don't know whether this applies to every every plot in Cornwall, but I believe it is. Anyone is welcome to write, phone in, whatever, email me, tell me that I'm wrong. But the other third is for immigrants.
[00:09:45] Unknown:
Oh, that does surprise me. Oh my gosh.
[00:09:48] Unknown:
So you look at all the housing going up in your apartment. Excuse me. Potentially, 1 third of that is designated.
[00:09:57] Unknown:
Yep. Wow.
[00:09:59] Unknown:
It's quite impressive, isn't it?
[00:10:02] Unknown:
Well, I did see yesterday on the news, when I was sat down visiting someone at work, the as of January, I think it is, the Bibby Stockholm is no longer going to be used. So I don't know, you know, that holds, I think, up to 500 people. They're not gonna just stop the problem like that, are they? They've gotta be housed somewhere. So I suppose they're thinking perhaps by January, we'll have places for these people.
[00:10:33] Unknown:
Wow. There's a lot of building going on everywhere. And we're about to see a massive influx in Cornwall, I'm convinced. So we'll Well, there's a lot of people out there already, aren't there, that haven't got There are. Homes. It's awful. Oh, awful to see. Someone one of the ladies I walk my dog with, she her house has been sold out from under her, and she's, you know, basically, the local council and housing associations have said, well, have you looked into, renting privately? And she was like Yeah. Yes, I have. You try and find me one, you know, because there's nothing. And, she got really angry, and this is not, you know, this is her quote unquote, this is what she said. She said, she said, if I went in there and painted my face up, she said, and she said this to them. She said, if I came in here and painted my face up and had some children with me, you'd, you'd probably find somewhere for me, wouldn't you?
[00:11:22] Unknown:
You know? Yeah. She was so angry. She was so angry. A friend like that. She keeps saying if I turned up on a dinghy, I think they'd find me a home. Yep. Four children living in a mobile home, and they've been moved about 5 times in the last 3 years. And Interesting. You know, where is she gonna find somewhere to privately rent for £1400
[00:11:42] Unknown:
a month? Because that's what a lot of them are going for. Anywhere. It could go on go on to the, yeah. Challenge anyone. Go on go on to the, try and find yourself a house to rent in Cornwall. There isn't Airbnb. Yeah. Alright. Yeah. I know you can find an Airbnb to rent. That's not practical for living in.
[00:11:59] Unknown:
So, yeah, it's it's very sad, isn't it? Very sad indeed. It is. And I it's also made me think, like, with my nan's staff at the moment, we've gotta go through all of this probate stuff, and that could take 9 months. So it makes you think as well, how many houses are empty out there because of the same situations? It's gotta be a lot.
[00:12:19] Unknown:
Yeah. I would've thought so. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:12:23] Unknown:
Yeah. There's lots of houses out there. But unfortunately, just just a few too many people. Just a few.
[00:12:32] Unknown:
Just a few. Just a few. Just a few. Anyway, moving on.
[00:12:36] Unknown:
Moving swiftly along. Yes.
[00:12:40] Unknown:
So yeah. So what's really important down here in Cornwall, or what used to be really important down here in Cornwall is our tourist industry because, you know, fishing's we've been stripped of fishing pretty much. You know, there's there's you the fishing's got slightly better over the last few years, but not not drastically at all. Not enough to make a difference, not like it used to be in Cornwall, booming fishing industry, all that kind of thing. So the other thing that's really important down here is is tourism. And, why is it right? Why is it that the council take all this money, all these yeah. Or or we all pay our council tax, well, some of us do, you know, and yada yada yada. But they are shutting toilets, public toilets on beaches and blah blah blah blah at a rate of not. What do you think is gonna be the end result of this? You know, last year, my dad actually went out to the car park across the road from the flats that he lives in, which are alright. They're holiday lets and stuff. They're over there all privately owned, that kind of thing. Went over into the private car park, and there was someone crouched behind the car,
[00:13:52] Unknown:
defecating on the in the car park. Do you know what I mean? Nice. And it's just like, yeah. But because there's no blooming parking toilet Well, when we went to Pentooine Beach, I thought I'd nip in the toilet, and it was 50 p. I you might have had 50 p. I wasn't that desperate to go, but it's the point, isn't it? So where else am I supposed to go?
[00:14:11] Unknown:
Yeah. Absolutely. And aren't we supposed to be getting rid of cash?
[00:14:15] Unknown:
Yeah. Exactly. Yeah. Oh, it's it's just crazy. It's just crazy.
[00:14:21] Unknown:
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So, have you got any other news?
[00:14:27] Unknown:
Well, the little bit of news that I did catch today that I was intrigued with was on Cornwall Live. Because I've interviewed this guy before, Jason. No, not Jason. That's not his name. Basically, he ran Touch Gloves Gym in Penzance. And the last few years he's really struggled with his own mental health trying to keep it going because his daughters were Muay Thai boxing champions. They've been everywhere and what have you. And this guy, he reached out to me in COVID times because it was back then it was a bit like people used to think I was a counselor and stuff. It's like, what do you think I should do? And it's like, I haven't got a clue. But I think also it was like, can I get the story out there? So he was basically saying, you know, because there was supposed to be that stadium that was built in Truro, but in the end, it went to the rugby, I think, the big stadium.
But there was high hopes that that would be shared by, you know, for massive sporting events, for boxing and everything, but it didn't go ahead. And anyway, this guy, he reached out to to me again in January. And I was just like, you know, I tried phoning a couple of numbers for him because he was struggling emotionally, mentally. And, anyway, long story short, there's this big post up today on Cornwall Live saying that the gym's been closed down. And there was no word or warning, just a note on the door. Very sorry. Please cancel your direct debits. You know, lots of the comments are very positive about him. You know, other people obviously annoyed. They've traveled a long way and the gym's closed, but, you know, he he's felt the way he's been treated and stuff the last few months that he hadn't even been able to show his face in that place.
And I was a bit like, a prepper, so to speak. When he phoned me a couple of times, I would try and advise him and try and pick him up a little bit. But anyway, so I read that today that that gym's closed, which is quite sad, and it's all to do with financial problems as always. Yeah. So it's about funding that he couldn't get and stuff like that. So, yeah, that's sad. But that's the only other one we've seen. Yeah. Everyone's getting pinched. You know? Is it is it still more for a a a bottle of, olive oil than it is for a bottle of wine? It is if you get the good stuff. Yeah. Yeah. It certainly is. I was only using mine today, and I thought, oh, a third of a bottle left. Let's make it last. And for the first time, the other day, I poured some in the frying pan. It was way too much, and I had to throw a load a bit away after. And I said, oh gosh. I feel so wasteful, especially given the price of it. You know, probably a couple of years ago, I wouldn't have had an eyelid, but perhaps it'll make us all be a bit more stingy.
[00:17:05] Unknown:
I don't like wasting stuff anyway, but I did think about it. £8 a bottle. Do you think you think how, you know, back in after wartime and rationing and all that kind of thing. And you think, you know, back further than than that, you know, there was not a lot of went to not a lot went to waste off of a carcass and things. You know what I mean? No. People And that's that's what I'm trying to be a bit like now. Not because of money. So was you in at all houses. The offal and eyeballs and stuff? Or No. Would you not go that far? No. I'm not going that far. I remember watching that Victorian era cooking thing many years ago on TV when we actually had a TV license. And there was a woman on there making sausages.
And she said, if anyone's bought cheap sausages and think they haven't had lips and eye eyeballs, she said, you got another thing coming.
[00:17:50] Unknown:
Now when you say that, I do if ever we're out and about and we go to bakery, I might have a sausage roll. And I know that that's I try not to think about it, but to be fair, I'd forgotten. And when I was younger and, you know, me and my husband were, like, just married and money was really tight, we used to buy the value range for everything. And it was probably about 10% meat, if that, in the sausages, but my god, they were tasty. So Yeah. Perhaps there's something to be said for eating earls, aisles, aisles, and all the rest. You know? Eye holes. Tasty.
[00:18:24] Unknown:
I'm glad you said eye holes. Well But, anyway, you are listening to radio soapbox.com, folks. We are already at the bottom of the hour. So we're gonna have a short little break here. And when we come back, it will be Shelley's connection. I last week, I basically, filled in for Shelley for her show. So we did a 2 hour kerna connection last week. And, what I did for the first hour was play songs, that was submitted to my old website over 20 years ago. So or around yeah. Over 20 years ago Or around 20 years ago. And, yeah. There are loads of them. So I just thought I'd I'd put because I've got a whole load here on on the page next to me that didn't get played last week. I'll just stick one of them in the break here. So this one is called not alone. There you go. Enjoy.
See you in a few minutes. Please. To let
[00:22:01] Unknown:
me know. Sorry eyes are telling lies. She hums a little lullaby.
[00:25:30] Unknown:
There you go. Oh, I like that. Moulay. Moulay with Not Alone. There you go. That was good. Yeah. That's, so just to clarify, I no longer have that website. That was a website that I ran 20 years ago for myself and other musicians. In fact, any artists. I had, like, people submitting photographs, not not dodgy ones, and, people submitting sort of, like, philosoph there was I had one area called Philosophy Corner and things like that. So Oh, it sounds really good. Yeah. Then I had I'd got busy with kids and that was that. That was that. They ruined your life. I just got swept under the carpet. Yeah. I'll put it all on disk and, lock it away to collect dust. But, yeah, I bought it out the other week. So I thought, well, actually, this there were some corkers. There were some really bad artists. There were there were some corkers as well. And it was just like it was so nice last week just pulling out a random selection of stuff. And it Yeah. I enjoyed it. Yeah. As well. So yeah.
Yeah. Anyway, so Shelley's connection this week. So, obviously, for people who don't normally listen to us on the connection, we, or they're just tuning into Radio Soapbox for the first time. Connection, we we basically every week, we pull out something Cornish, something Cornish heritage, something Cornish celebrity, something Cornish person of interest, just because not only is it important to us and and we are on a learning journey at the same time, but if any of the stories interest you, if any of the things that we cover interest you, go home and look at your own heritage. I bet there's loads of great stuff, and that's what it's about. So take it away, Shelley.
[00:27:14] Unknown:
Okeydoke. Let me clear my throat. Hang on. Excuse me. Right. I'm going to be talking to you about our Cornish gypsies. Okay. Right. For 100 of years, this group of people have been a misunderstood and at times persecuted part of the society. In the press, they were often at best car captured and at worst often vilified. But with the help of Nessa and Tom Isaac, what's started to unfold is a cohort with a strong family bonds and values and a complex cultural heritage, a hidden community that sincerely cares for and supports each other and one that has surprisingly strong roots binding them to Cornwall. Cornish gypsy folk have simply chosen to live their lives in a different way from the gorgeous or country people as they call us, but they sadly continue to face prejudice.
And unfortunately, most of what we have known is the lies of the Cornish gypsies of the past comes from unreliable sources. The fleeting impressions of the judgmental writers of the time or local folklorists who were only interested in curses and potions or the often derogatory articles that were reported in the press. It is a sad fact that the newspapers generally only reported the stories of gypsies who had fallen foul of the law in some way, perhaps for rough sleeping or because they were accused of tricking people out of money by telling fortunes or threatening to ill wish someone. Very little is known about their ordinary lives, and that is partly because they chose to live outside of society's expectations and conventions.
Family roots. There are an estimated 250,000 gypsies or travelers living in the UK today. That's 2024. And they have been here since at least 16th century. In the 2021 census, no point 2 of the Cornish population identified as Gypsy, Roma, or Traveller. Often called Roma or Romani people these days, they are by no means, population. Under that umbrella, there are many diverse groups, each with individual culture differences found all across Europe and beyond. In general, however, the genetic ancestry is thought to originate from Northern India or pap perhaps Egypt. Indeed, some suggest that the English word gypsy is a corruption of Egyptian.
At one time, there were many family gypsies in Cornwall. Some that were just passing through, but others that close had close associations with the area. A census census taken in 1965 found that there were 100 gypsy families in Cornwall, and only 12 of these were living on licensed sites. In 190 8, the Cornishman newspaper recorded the name of Gypsy, Cornish Gypsy Families as Cooper, Stanley, and Smith. But there were also the Richards, the Isaacs, and the Boswells. There are great number of superstitions which the gypsy Romy people hold dear even to this day. For example, they believe that 7th child of the 7th child will have second sight although their wagons are often painted with designs in bright colors.
Black must never be used. The color will bring death to the family. Most gypsies don't trust banks and tend to put their money into something solid like gold. They are also extremely given within their communities. If someone needs help buying something, a new fridge or a piece of equipment perhaps, then they all club together. The idea being that when you need help yourself, the favor will be returned. It was customary to burn all the possessions of their family members after they have died, the caravan included. One of the last recorded cases of this happening in Cornwall was after the death of Elizabeth Holland in 1966, and another was after the death of Janet Isaac in 1974.
So we are now gonna be introducing Janet Isaac. Janet had been a born had been born at a camp on Gipsy Lane in Houston around 18 70 where she and her husband, Joseph, may have had as many as 17 children. One of which, Alice, I know. Sorry. Sorry. Only 17. Wow. That's that's going. That's a lot. That's a lot. Yes. Alright. Sorry. Carry on. That's okay. One of which, Alice, was Tom Isaac's grandmother. It was Tom's wife, Nessa, who first wrote to wrote to me. I'm reading this off somebody else's site, suggesting that I tell granny Isaac's story. Fortunately, Tom remembers his great grandmother well, and much of the information here is able to relate comes from childhood memories of her and his grandparents.
The exact date I know. The exact great. Shut up, interrupting. Shut. The exact date of Janet and Joseph's marriage isn't clear. Gipsy families often avoided registering unions in the usual way, and it was not uncommon for them to go through life without birth or marriage certificates. I love that. The couple were cousins, however, had and had presumably known each other all their lives. Not sure about that one. Joseph, who had been born around 18/61, had been blind from birth, which meant that most of the responsibilities of the family fell to Janet. They seem to have spent much of their married life in and around Cambourne, living in camps at Stray Park and Dundance Burrows close to Cambray.
Though they were also known to have ventured around the Penzance and Golval area too, and sometimes upcountry for seasonal work. The couple the couple had a great many children to support, and they're not able to work at the traditional sense. Joseph made paper flowers, clothes pegs, and little wooden sculptures for the family to sell. For her part, Janet made lace a delicate and highly skilled profession and went door to door selling it by the yard as well as the other wares the family produced. The selling door to door was something that she had done since the age of 11, and her children continued and contributed to to help and do what they could, especially around Christmas time when they would make wreaths of wreaths of Holly to sell. For a few extra pennies, Janet was also known to tell the fortunes of the housewives that she called upon her rounds.
On one occasion, however, this got her into trouble. In March in 1934, she was visiting homes as usual on Clarence Street in Goeville, offering her various sales for goods. At one of the houses, she stops to tell the lady's owner's fortune, whatever was she, but whatever she predicted caused the housewife such distress that the neighbors called for the local policeman. When he arrived, he asked to see Janet's peddling license. This she produced only to discover it had expired a few months before and she was fined. This was not the only time that Janet Isaac had trouble with the police. Though given the circumstances, it is possible that the problems arose from malicious tattle tailing rather than any serious criminality.
For generations, Cornish gypsies had been experts in the breeding and care of horses. Many of the men folk made their money from selling the animals and the Isaac family seemed to have been part of this trade too. In 1939, Janet and their family were camped below Cambrai with a number of ponies hobbled and gazing on the slopes. Unfortunately, somebody passing noticed that one of the horses had a saw in his leg and reported it to the authorities. Janet was charged with neglecting the animal. At the hearing in Campbell, it was established that 8 members of the Isaac family, presumably Joseph and Janet's sons, were employed at Self Crofty Mind, and the weekly income for the whole family was around £20.
Janet explained to the court that there had been no intention to injure the pony, and it has only been left unattended for one day. But despite this, the chairman, mister T Stoplin, fined her 1 pound. The newspaper reported that Janet claimed to be unable to pay immediately and suggested that he sent her up the line instead, meaning to Bodmin Jail. In the end, it was agreed that she would pay the fine within a fortnight to escape imprisonment. Sadly, not long after this episode, Janet's husband, Joseph, passed away in April 1940, aged 79 years, and was buried in the graveyard at Glynip.
Janet remained a strong and resourceful woman who was much admired within the Gypsy community, especially in her later years. She was often called upon for her advice, both spiritual and practical, and would often be asked to settle disputes within the local families. She was a real metric of the Cornish gypsy life. In 1967, Janet was interviewed by Jane Radford for the Cornish guardian. By then, she was thought to be 97 years old, by far the oldest gypsy in Cornwall. By then, she also had around 200 grandchildren and great grandchildren. You can comment.
200. Yeah. I know.
[00:36:07] Unknown:
So Yeah. Wouldn't have those back at the weekend, would you? No. Pardon?
[00:36:12] Unknown:
In the interview, Janet spoke nostalgically of the days when she and her family lived in a horse drawn wagon and moved from place to place. She explained how in her youth she had traveled to Hampshire, Somerset, and other southern countries for seasonal work such as hop or pea picking. Janet recalled frequently eating hedgehogs while on the road which were delicious, she said, if rolled in a lump of clay and cooked on an open fire. In her final years, Janet became known as the queen of the Cornish gypsies and is thought by her family to have been the last gypsy queen in Cornwall. A term of endearment acknowledging the elderly woman's status at the matriarch of the community. I don't think I'm saying that wrong that word right. Matriarch? Matriarch. Alright. Matriarch. Matriarch. Right. I can say it. In 1970, she was interviewed for a final time on this occasion by local journalist, Jona King.
It was to mark her 100th birthday. Sadly, she had not received her telegram from the queen in recognition of a great age because there was no official record of her birth. Still living in a tiny caravan on Cambrai, Janet told the interviewer how she preferred a life under canvas more than any other. These caravans is all very well, sir, but give me a canvas and ponies every time. Under canvas is healthier and better and the ponies was part of the family. When asked what she did with her day, she replied, I sits beside the fire, looks at me picture books and puffs at me pipe. As long as old granny have got a crust of bread and a pipe o'backey, then things ain't so bad, sir.
Granny Isaac outlived all of her children and died on the 4th November 1974, aged a 104. She was buried with her husband, Joseph, at Gwyneth Churchyard, and her great grandson, Tom Isaac, remembers her caravan, which had been our home for so many years, and this was then set on fire. The family stood together and watched it burn, and Tom explained that the flames ensured that her spirit didn't linger with the possessions. By the time granny Isaac passed away, the traditional gypsy way of life was coming to an end for many in her community. The sixties seventies saw traveling families settling down on licensed sites or in council houses to take advantage of steady work and local school education for their children.
Rather than trading in horses, they moved over to cars and scrap metal. But many of their beliefs and customs still continue despite their changing circumstances as Tom and Nessa Isaac, the descendants of granny Isaac can attest. The story of this formidable woman's life gives us an amazing glimpse not only into the past, but also into a way of life and a culture that is little understood and fast disappearing. But it is important that we acknowledge that at one time, the gypsy culture was just as much as part of our Cornish heritage as any other, and that generations of this small population had been maligned often thought through no fault of their own.
Nessa and Tom, who were so warm and kind answering all of these questions, told us some very upsetting stories from their own lives. Stories where they and their families have been mistreated, bullied, and abused in the street because of their gypsy backgrounds. And that is that.
[00:39:25] Unknown:
Wow. And do you know wow. Wow. Bravo. Bravo. Honestly, that was that was really insightful and and lovely and and and the anecdotes, absolutely wonderful. Her husband could make paper flowers and stuff Yeah. Despite the fact that he was blind. And they were well, I'm assuming they were salable.
[00:39:49] Unknown:
I love the bit about the birth certificate and stuff, though, though, but she couldn't get a telegram because they didn't register
[00:39:56] Unknown:
their births and stuff. No. No. Of course. And these caravans are are are right as rain, but give me a canvas anytime because it's more healthy and the horse is a part of the family. You know? Oh, wow. That's that's, do you know what? Oh. We've this is what we've lost out of this is what this is what you this is what you've lost by carrying your blooming mobile phone with all the wet locks. Shut up. No. Come on. This is what we've lost, though, isn't it? This is the that way of life. And, alright, I I know some people wouldn't wanna go back to having to pick collect sticks to boil a pot of water so they can make a cup of tea. I get it. But there's something just
[00:40:39] Unknown:
Simplicity. Intrinsically,
[00:40:45] Unknown:
intrinsically human about it. Just, you know, just going back to nature, you know. I swear. I swear. You know, when the apocalypse comes, I'm I'm gonna be in a field somewhere just
[00:41:02] Unknown:
Yeah. Why not? You know, and I always think now I would love to have some land, and I literally
[00:41:10] Unknown:
sold 4 acres of land. I know. So I could buy it out. Such a shame. I'd have bought an acre off you. I would've. I would've. Oh. Oh, man. Anyway I probably bought a price in 2 when you were selling it, but there we I'm not actually to now either, but there we go.
[00:41:27] Unknown:
I know the price of land. Land. Oh, I would. I want a cow, and I want some chickens. That's my main source at the moment. I'm manifesting it. You you used that word at the end of your show. I like the word manifest. I love it. Is this is this all about positive thinking and sculpting the reality around you? Yeah. And I believe in it. I'm sorry. I don't want it now. It's out of your hands. It's out of your hands. Rubbish. Rubbish. It is. You're living in a real life plan. No. You're living inside. You know when you all say what will be will be, and, it is it is what it is, and I love that statement. What it is, my dear. It is what it is, but that also is a bit of a I say that a lot because it means that I don't really care, and I just accept it. But then that's like telling somebody, like, I wanna do this and wanna do And, like, they mustn't try and do anything a bit different because it is what it is. Nothing's gonna change. I don't know because I'm a bit like The the the phrase it is what it is. Yeah. The phrase it is what it is is
[00:42:24] Unknown:
it, sort of goes back to the serenity thing, and that is your your accept your acceptance, basically. I just accept everything at the moment. Yeah. But it's also a way of giving up. Yes. Yeah. Oh, it is what it is. That's I get what you're getting at. Yes. Well, you have to think about it in the positive and and that is, you know, well, again, give me the strength to change the
[00:42:46] Unknown:
things of other you know? Yeah. So you can manifest so you can manifest things.
[00:42:53] Unknown:
Yes. I suppose you can work towards bringing things into being. I do think if you want something bad enough,
[00:42:59] Unknown:
you will get it.
[00:43:01] Unknown:
I do. Okay. Yeah. Well, you tell that to that lady who's trying to get a house that I was talking about earlier.
[00:43:09] Unknown:
Yeah. Within reason. But then, you know, there's nothing strange reason, like, there's nothing you know? But then some way does this mental capacity go is what I'm asking? Well, I don't know. You just have to try it, don't you? She might not get a house that she can buy 1, but in the near future, she's gotta imagine herself living in a house, feeling that she lives in a house and seeing herself wake up in that house, and I love it. There's a book called The Secret by Rhonda Giles, I think she's called, and, yeah, I resonate a lot with it.
We just, you just have to put it out there. Thoughts become reality, so you are what you think. Very deep tonight, aren't we, Maleficus?
[00:43:48] Unknown:
Well, is this the royal way, I take it?
[00:43:52] Unknown:
Royal we. Yes. We are very deep tonight. Yes. We is. We yes. 1 is. 1 is. Well, no. You're deep as well. You're quite deep anyway, I think, aren't you?
[00:44:02] Unknown:
I can be. I can be really shallow at times as well. Who can't?
[00:44:08] Unknown:
At least to be honest.
[00:44:09] Unknown:
Yeah. No. I I think we can all be shallow at times because we choose to be at times, I think. But most, yeah, most of the time, I'm a I'm a bit of a thinker. Yeah. It has to be said, but I don't think I don't think me or me or you or anyone else on Radio Soapbox would be here if they were an idle thinker. If they were going along with the herd, they wouldn't be here.
[00:44:30] Unknown:
I finally came to terms like what this is all about, this radio show, the last week or so because, you know, I wanted to go into video and stuff like that and just, I don't know, got caught up with it as, like, I need to do this, make it really big and stuff. And I'm at that point now. It's like, do you know what? Those that want to listen, those that you reach, and this is what I do for a hobby. This is what I do in my spare time researching, then I get to chat to people about things that I'm interested in. So it's taken me a long time to realize that yeah. Exactly. But it's taken me a long time to realize that this is a hobby.
I don't know why I've only started thinking about it like that lately. Perhaps because I had a little break a while ago, and you come back different and fresh. And I only said to Darren tonight, I said, you know, because I don't do video anymore, I don't get any of those nerves, really, like I used to. That takes a lot of edge off it, and it's like, yeah, I do radio, not doing what everybody else is doing. Because radio, I think everybody does podcasts with video and stuff, and I I just can't cope with it. I just wanna enjoy it, and that's what it's all about. So, anyway, that's my thoughts.
[00:45:41] Unknown:
Yeah. No. Brilliant. Absolutely fantastic. And great show a great Shelley Tasker show earlier. Hat off to Sarah for doing what she does. And folks you can go back into the Pod Home archives to find that. The link I don't believe is on the radiosoapbox.com website yet, but I'm not sure.
[00:46:01] Unknown:
We
[00:46:02] Unknown:
must put a put a request into management. Well, maybe put a request into management. Yes. Yes. Maybe we could just get off get off our asses and do it ourselves. I don't know. I'm not gonna plan to. Anyway, thank you so much, for joining us, folks. You've been listening to radio soapbox.com and in particular, the kurno connection with Modefica Scott and Shelley Tasker. Coming after us is, Joss the Boss and guests from, we think, Freelee Radio. That's coming up straight after we finish. Thank you so much In in your own words, Shelley, thank you so much for your company, folks. Really, great to have you here. And we will catch up with you next week and we may well have the starts of the D Day the American D Day Journeys next week. So stay tuned, folks. And, I'm gonna play out now. If you got anything anything left to say, Shelley? Yeah. I was just gonna say have an awesome week, everyone.
[00:47:04] Unknown:
Alright. And manifest. Remember, you are your thoughts. Yeah. Your thoughts are you.
[00:47:09] Unknown:
Yeah. The end. Yeah. And all that. And all And all that jazz. I gotta play out with the amazing Graham Hart. This one's for the boys. Take care, folks. See you next week. See you next
[00:47:21] Unknown:
week.
[00:48:00] Unknown:
Easy. It picks you up and puts you down, and no one seems to gain. So take me from a struggle road to where they'll never reach me.
